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Old 15th Nov 2011, 23:15   #31
paul1234
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alternatives to motability

I have looked at alternatives when my Motability lease expires next year. There are some good PCPs available. They dont include insurance or maintainence but on a 2 year 10000 miles pa, I'm looking at £330pa insurance ( I know this will vary for others), one service at £225 and I would allow £125 for a new tyre ( motability work on 2 tyres per lease). Brakes should not be a problem and the warranty takes care of the rest. PCP costs can be as low as £125 for a small car and even a premium badge can be had for £240 per month. Doing the maths its possible to have a C class on a 2 year lease for about the same as one on the scheme (working on a pro rata basis).
I think anyone over the age of 40 with a good driving record, living outside central london or the other major cities (ie high cost insurance areas) and driving less than 10000 miles pa could benefit.
Food for thought, and bear in mind these PCP costs include VAT.
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Old 16th Nov 2011, 00:15   #32
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No, their DLA is £55 per week but they give that up in favour of taking a car instead. If the car lease over the 3 year period is greater than £55 per week then the excess cost can be paid up front in the form of a non-refundable advanced payment. An example could be that a bog standard Zetec (or whatever that trim level is these days) might fall within the £55 per week category and require zero advance payment. A Titanium with all the trim upgrades could require a £1500 advance payment.
At the end of the three years that advance payment is not given back.

Basically you pay £7200 over a 3 year period to hire a car. The benefit to most people is that there is no tax, no maintenance costs, no tyre costs, no servicing costs and the opportunity to be driving a brand new car. You don't own it, you never will under the scheme.
Not quite right, you pay the mobility component (£55/week) towards the car you can also get a care component of DLA that is assessed on the same form, but you keep this money, as it's used for help with personal care, rather than getting around. For example, someone could get none/lower/middle/upper rate care (£0/£19.55/£49.30/£73.60) per week plus none/lower/upper mobility (£0/£19.55/£51.40) in any combination, the only people eligible for motability are those with upper rate mobility component, they can in addition can get none/any one of the care components that they keep.
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Old 16th Nov 2011, 01:09   #33
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Some of the comments in here make me really rather annoyed (although some of the others pleasently surprise me by being reasonable).

A 40k car costs the "taxpayer" no more under Motorbility than a £10k car, as you pay the same monthly fee (usually all your DLA mobility allowance) AND a hefty upfront fee to cover the depreciation of the car over 3 years above the level that the DLA payments would cover.
A £10k car might have Zero upfront fee, but a £40k one might have £5-10k - IIRC under the current rules the Motorbility scheme has actually been running at a slight but noticeable profit.
Also Motorbility are a huge fleet hire, they get big discounts on the cars under the scheme, so will usually pay a fair bit less than any individual would to get the cars (they have a hefty discount on the RRP), so the "£40k car" is probably closer to £30 or £35k, and the scheme normally ends up with getting a slight profit at the end of it.

The change has been made mainly for the sake of the DM and image and uneducated idiots who can't ever be bothered to look into the truth.

A £15k car for example probably won't be suitable for many people (why stop at £15k, you can get a Picanto for £6 or £7k), as one of the things that people who take the motorbity option often require is a dealership near enough to them that the car can be serviced with minimal inconvenience, or may need an Automatic (usually costs a bit more), or a larger vehicle to enable them to get in and out comfortably.
It's surprising how important an extra few inches in height to the seat can suddenly become when you' have say a hip problem, or how important a higher cabin area can be if you can't bend easily/without pain, let alone little things like the height and position of the boot opening, or the size of the boot (things that are really quite important considerations if you've got a wheelchair, especially if the person who pushes it may be a little older, or smaller), and those are all before the normal considerations of things like how comfortable is the driving position for you, or can you see around comfortably from the drivers seat (the pillars in some cars are really badly placed for people of some heights)

Also the 5 mile ruling is going to make a lot of problems for people who may drive the car themselves when going around the town, but have a family member nominated to help them when it comes to longer drives or things like hospital visits (IIRC under motorbility only the nominated drivers, or the staff of the servicing garage etc can ever drive the car).

It's unfortunately the Motorbility scheme throwing the baby out of the bathwater in an attempt to appease the DM readers who can't or won't be happy until the only choice for motorbility cars is a nice little orange plastic three wheeled thing that only takes the disabled person.
There are problems with the old scheme, but it would probably have cost less to have dealt with them - the changes in the rules now aren't likely to stop someone from lying about where they live, and a lot of the people that abused the scheme lived in the same town (or even same house) as the person who the car was for the use of.

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Old 16th Nov 2011, 01:43   #34
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5 miles is way too short.
I ( or rather /we .. there's a few family who live within walking distance and we go together) regularly drive over 15 miles to visit the older family members 3-4 times a week.
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Old 16th Nov 2011, 17:29   #35
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No, their DLA is £55 per week but they give that up in favour of taking a car instead. If the car lease over the 3 year period is greater than £55 per week then the excess cost can be paid up front in the form of a non-refundable advanced payment. An example could be that a bog standard Zetec (or whatever that trim level is these days) might fall within the £55 per week category and require zero advance payment. A Titanium with all the trim upgrades could require a £1500 advance payment.
At the end of the three years that advance payment is not given back.

Basically you pay £7200 over a 3 year period to hire a car. The benefit to most people is that there is no tax, no maintenance costs, no tyre costs, no servicing costs and the opportunity to be driving a brand new car. You don't own it, you never will under the scheme.
Its actually a lot more than £7200 over 3 years. Its nearer £8600 as DLA increases in line with inflation and any increse (in most cases) goes towards the cost. So the much publices BMW x3 would cost £9500-15000 AP plus £8600, at least £18100 for a 3 year lease equating to £503 per month.
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Old 26th Nov 2011, 20:52   #36
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When the new rules were announced on 21st October, Motability said the new car selection rules and the Max £2000 AP would take effect straight away but they would honour existing commitments, fair enough. Basically you had until 31st December if you wanted to order a car over the £2k limit. But in November they allowed a new car on the scheme, the Mercedes B class with several models over £2k and £3699 in one case. This is contrary to their own rules and must throw confusion as to how or if the new rules will actually come into force?
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Old 27th Nov 2011, 07:57   #37
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It's surprising how important an extra few inches in height to the seat can suddenly become when you' have say a hip problem, or how important a higher cabin area can be if you can't bend easily/without pain, let alone little things like the height and position of the boot opening, or the size of the boot (things that are really quite important considerations if you've got a wheelchair, especially if the person who pushes it may be a little older, or smaller), and those are all before the normal considerations of things like how comfortable is the driving position for you, or can you see around comfortably from the drivers seat (the pillars in some cars are really badly placed for people of some heights)
You know your stuff. Something like a Nissan Note has a perfect seat height for me to 'swivel' into, whereas whenever I get into or out of my friend's MX5 it's like I'm on bloomin' Gladiators!

With the Motability scheme, if a vehicle is paid for by your DLA, what benefits do you get over just using your DLA to fund a non-Motability?

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Old 27th Nov 2011, 12:02   #38
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You have to worry about also paying for servicing, tyres, repairs, insurance etc etc. The only thing you need to pay for in relation to a Motability car is the fuel for 3 years.

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Old 27th Nov 2011, 12:08   #39
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What's wrong with a £25k cap? Maybe they are saying that someone who claims but adds funds to get a £40k car, doesn't need financial help.
Whats wrong! My sons seat that spin around and cone out to the floot cost £35K. The hoist to lift his chair that cost £15K then a month after having it was not enough as he got a new chair and the system will only allow you to be speced for what you have at the time, dispite in 1 month a new chair coming! Oh and then a decent car to move it all, so 250kg for a chair, 1 child, 1 baby, 2 adults and it be practical we had no option but the top end ford galaxy!

It's not just the car it's the add ons! DLA is ment to cover that but dont! In the end i spoke to Laim Fox my local MP and he personly bought it for me via some charity thing they have access too.

The insurance thing is an odd one. There now telling us we have to get a D1 lience due to weight yet the law says what weight!

They have also reduced the mileage. There is a huge fee if you go over and with a disabled child your always on the road to hospitals and what not!
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Old 27th Nov 2011, 12:43   #40
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You have to worry about also paying for servicing, tyres, repairs, insurance etc etc. The only thing you need to pay for in relation to a Motability car is the fuel for 3 years.
Oh, I see, thanks.

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Old 27th Nov 2011, 12:51   #41
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I agree with everything except this, "no nominated drivers under 21".

I am 17 and my mum is disabled. She cannot walk, let alone drive, and because my dad works night shifts, I am the one she relies on to drive her to hospital appointments, doctors appointments etc. and to go out and get her anything she needs.

I guess that will have to change now and her already challenging life will now get even harder for her. Big thanks to those who abuse the system!
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Old 27th Nov 2011, 13:34   #42
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You know your stuff. Something like a Nissan Note has a perfect seat height for me to 'swivel' into, whereas whenever I get into or out of my friend's MX5 it's like I'm on bloomin' Gladiators!
Aye it's the sort of thing most of the people that complain about the motorbility scheme etc never consider.
It's amazing how people's attitudes can change however if they have even just a relatively short term injury but suddenly find they can't get into their car easily...(one of my mum's friends was suddenly a lot more understanding of the problems with getting into a car after she hurt her knee and found it very painful to get into a lot of cars).

I know about it because my mum has a very bad hip, which has made me consider stuff most people don't think twice about (is a standard loo too low? If so how to solve it without using one of those useless frames for a very basic example*), or is the front door step big enough for her to stand on with her crutches? (most aren't)


Lukefinch.
That's one of the changes I can understand the reasoning behind to a degree (insurance for under 21's could take up most of the mobility allowance on it's own!), but is very bad news for people like your mother and you, where the only available driver is someone under 21, of which there are from memory a huge number in the UK
I can't remember the stats, but there was a programme about it on the BBC a while back, that made the point there are tens of thousands of people for whom their main carer is actually a child (or at least under 18).
I would have hoped they could have come up with some compromise for situations where the only practical driver was under 21, either by limiting the cars a bit, or something like a GPS tracker to discourage the youngsters from abusing it.

It's a change that is likely to end up costing the local health authorities a fortune in hospital transport fees alone if under 21's can no longer take a parent to the hospital in a mobility car.


*We've had to redecorate/organise virtually everything in the house to make life easier for my mum - including raising sockets in the Lounge so she didn't have to use extension leads (cables on the floor are bad....), to be able to even just plug a hair dryer in, and even the likes of the stairlift are a nightmare at times (if it fails when she's on it, she's completely stuffed without someone around).

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Old 27th Nov 2011, 14:07   #43
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If you want the same car, you can still have it.
You can have whatever you like, you just opt to take the cash instead of the scheme.
Then put the cash towards the runnings costs of a car that is being used outside of the current scheme rules.

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Old 28th Nov 2011, 22:29   #44
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If you want the same car, you can still have it.
You can have whatever you like, you just opt to take the cash instead of the scheme.
Then put the cash towards the runnings costs of a car that is being used outside of the current scheme rules.
There are some cracking leasing deals around too
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Old 28th Nov 2011, 23:00   #45
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Unfortunately true. Ruin it for those whose need is genuine.
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Again though, isn't it the age old case of the minority spoiling it for the majority?
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Hmm. This means the Gf will no longer be able to driver her mum's car as we live more than 5 miles away. A bit inconvenient really, but not the end of the world.
*Cough*

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Old 29th Nov 2011, 10:20   #46
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my brother regularly comes over and takes my mum out and about to give my dad a break as he's a full time carer. Her car is adapted so she can get in and out easily and takes her breathing equipment. My brother lives more than 5 miles away.

go go government.

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Old 30th Nov 2011, 13:19   #47
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When the changes were announced, there were 1476 cars under £2000 including 307 automatics. Now, a month later there are 1531 (55 more) and 324 automatics (17 more). This augers well for January 2012 when, hopefully we will see even more cars and, if negotations go well with manufacturers, a better choice of automatics too.
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Old 30th Nov 2011, 14:17   #48
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Just did a little research - people with problems stemming from obesity can qualify for these free cars.

I have absolutely no sympathy for any of them - yes many people have legitimate problems they are born with, but in this country at least, a huge amount of people will qualify as disabled through their own lazy and irresponsible actions of shoveling massive quantities of food down their worthless gullets, thus increasing their already corpulent masses.

I'm pretty sure this scheme will explain the sight of various chav rude boys driving around in decent cars - no doubt many of them belong to their obese relatives.

What's more I'm pretty certain these nominated carers can use disabled parking spaces too even if the disabled person isn't in the car.

If anyone is genuinely disabled, then you deserve all the help in the world, but no doubt your rights are being spoiled by the lazy, worthless masses of scum that infest this country, both domestic and imported.

In days gone by their kind wouldn't even survive - now they're being paid to breed, live in absolute comfort and have sweet cars to boot.

Pretty sure there was a fat disgusting sow who couldn't be tried for benefit fraud due to being too fat to fit in the dock recently...

And another waste of space obese guy too fat to go to prison so he got away without it...

This country is long overdue a cull.

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Old 30th Nov 2011, 14:46   #49
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1: I suspect the "obese" people are those who are medically obese rather than just fat.
And some people who have disabilities really do struggle to keep their weight down as it can be very hard to eat healthily, and exercise properly with some disabilities without a lot of help (which often isn't easy to get).

2: You CANNOT use a disabled parking space without the disabled person being in the car - IE you cannot use a disabled parking space to get someones prescription or shopping whilst they stay at home.
The traffic wardens are pretty hot on that, and the repercussions include massive fines, and the person whose Blu badge you use, losing it (note it's the Blue Badge that grants parking concessions NOT the car*).
It's actually a criminal offence to misuse the badge.

Nominated careers MAY be able to use the vehicle for the benefit of the person it's assigned to IF they are listed as a driver by the person who the car is leased to (IE if you're a nominated driver you can use the car to get their shopping/medication from memory, or as part of a normal family life if say the disabled person if a child or partner).


*Although if the vehicle is registered as "disabled" for tax purposes (any car can be if the main user is in receipt of DLA higher rate mobility, not just Motorbility cars), it can also give certain concessions with the likes of Toll roads and Congestion charges if you register it with the operators of the schemes..

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Old 1st Dec 2011, 22:35   #50
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Will the scheme change for the good? Since the website was updated in October the number of cars has risen from 1476 to 1531, Automatics from 307 to 324 and a couple of interesting cars, including the B class Merc have appeared. If you search using the WPMS link it shows there are appx 300 cars with an AP between £2000 and £2500 of which 80 are automatics. I wonder come Jan 2012 how many of these will be under the £2k ceiling? I have a feeling January will either be a very good quarter as manufacturers aim to compete to get as many cars as possible on the scheme or a very lean one. My guess is on the former.
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Old 23rd Dec 2011, 22:02   #51
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This is a text I picked up from another messsageboard which augers well for 2012. Will be interested to see the numbers models and prices.


"Here's a heads up after a telephone conversation I had yesterday with Motability:

1. Expect some major improvement to the availability of under £2k vehicles, particularly automatics, from Jan 2012

2. If a manual car is on the scheme and the auto isn't showing because its over £2k, they will make it available to you"
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Old 24th Dec 2011, 00:33   #52
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Hmm, my missus gets higher rate DLA which she uses for the aforementioned 3-year lease car (currently an Astra.)

She also gets road tax and insurance paid for her. Is that not usual?

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Old 24th Dec 2011, 00:55   #53
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That's normal.
However you can get the tax free on any car that is used for someone who who has higher rate DLA mobility, regardless of if the car is Motobility or not.
You get a cert from the DLA and use that to change the cars taxation class to disabled, and then get the tax free (only one car at any one time for a cert).
The hard part is getting the taxation changed from normal to disabled, last time I looked it required going to the local DVLA office in person with the registration and certificate, and the local offices often aren't easy to get to if you're disabled in any way (so the disabled person may require a friend/family member to do it).

The insurance isn't that high on a lot of Mobility cars from memory, as they've always had some fairly strict requirements (IIRC 2 claims in X years regardless of the type be they scratched bumper or complete write off), and now they're stopping insuring younger drives the main reason for a lot of younger disabled to get the car is gone.
Remember the higher rate mobility component is about £3.5k a year, which combined with the front loaded payments, the discount mobility get as a huge fleet buyer, and the fact the car is sold afterwards normally means they at the very least break even.

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Old 24th Dec 2011, 01:46   #54
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........and Congestion charges if you register it with the operators of the schemes..
I worked on the software for the London congestion charge, and cars registered disabled don't have to be registered with the operator of the charge as the system checks on the Doovla

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Old 24th Dec 2011, 06:24   #55
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I agree with everything except this, "no nominated drivers under 21".

I am 17 and my mum is disabled. She cannot walk, let alone drive, and because my dad works night shifts, I am the one she relies on to drive her to hospital appointments, doctors appointments etc. and to go out and get her anything she needs.

I guess that will have to change now and her already challenging life will now get even harder for her. Big thanks to those who abuse the system!
I am disabled and i think most of these changes are completely sensible (for once) but i do agree with the above.
Me and the mrs are well over this age but what is the problem... i mean you can pass your test and hold a full license at seventeen.

The muppet's behind the system changes need to realize that carer's are ALL ages and if they are old enough to hold a full license then end of.
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Old 25th Dec 2011, 12:07   #56
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Here is a link which gives details of the revised criteria and looks a far more sensible approach.
http://www.motability.co.uk/main.cfm?Type=IDX
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Old 25th Dec 2011, 12:08   #57
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Wrong Link, try this one
http://www.motabilitycarscheme.co.uk...&ObjectId=2840
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Old 26th Dec 2011, 21:30   #58
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Having read the latest announcement on Motability's website it appears the £25000 price rule has been scrapped as there is no mention of this in the text. It also appears that an automatic, diesel or estate versions (or a mix or indeed all theree, ie an auto diesel estate) can be ordered without having to prove that a disability requires it and, having used the word "core" then perhaps there will be a number of "non core" vehicles also.
here is the key sentence
"The core range of cars available through the Motability Scheme has been revised to focus on cars with an Advance Payment of £2,000" The key word is focus.
A number of questions come to mind. Volvo offer an S40 petrol manual. Does this mean if someone wanted a V50 diesel auto they could have one even if the AP was over £5000? Or is the V50 a different car?
With the Mondeo, The Titanium X is available as a diesel manual with 115bhp. There are two Auto versions both with the same AP but with 140 and 163BHP, would both be available?
I think for those wanting to go over the £2k it will be a question of researching, compiling a short list and contacting Motability to ascertain what is and is not available.
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Old 26th Dec 2011, 23:23   #59
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Why are people on benefits driving round in twenty-five grand cars, when I've worked for twenty years and am driving round in a two grand focus?
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Old 26th Dec 2011, 23:40   #60
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Why are people on benefits driving round in twenty-five grand cars, when I've worked for twenty years and am driving round in a two grand focus?
Because they have life altering disabilities and have no chance of having the chance to work towards owning their own car.

Does this mean they shouldn't have the chance to drive?

Anyway, this arguments been done to death. They get it, live with it.

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