Mortgage question re joint ownership

Vipa66 · 16 May 2016 at 23:30

BDEE said:
There is actually one lender (that I know of) that will do a mortgage on a joint proprietor sole borrower basis (indirect security). This lender rather oddly is also one of the most strict lenders on the high street and I was amazed when I found out they offered joint proprietor sole borrower, but it can be done. That doesn't mean you should though and of course would be subject to underwriter approval. I don't know how they would treat the non-borrower in terms of affordability, so it might not even help your situation as they may still just apply the same affordability rules (and I suspect this would probably be the case).

Deed of trust as mentioned is an option, but then that also shuts the door for some lenders too. You should for sure seek some advice from a professional broker.

Paul - Don't mean to be a party pooper and I know you are trying to help, but promotion of your business is not allowed on this forum and I have noticed your business email address cropping up a couple of times now..... Just a heads up:

"No promotion of business interests
You may not promote any website or business you have a financial or other interest in, or use the popularity of this community to help build one of your own. The forums are here to allow people to freely share knowledge, not provide them with personal financial gain, or free advertising."

My business email is the only one I've got... what would you have me use?

I have not mentioned a website and I am not trying to promote a business. As you say, I'm only trying to help. FCA regulation makes it very difficult and risky for me to try and help in an open public forum and, with no way of PMing on here, the next best option is to take it out of the public domain via email.

The other option is to idly stand by and let people with genuine queries, for which I have the knowledge, experience and qualifications to answer, be potentially misled and misinformed by well meaning folk who are just guessing based on their own limited life experience.

I have offered to give pointers, not asked for business and, to be honest, don't want any business... current money laundering regs make it almost impossible to arrange a mortgage other than face to face and therefore I don't engage in distance selling.

Pawnless Endgame · 17 May 2016 at 08:22

Vipa66 said:
My business email is the only one I've got... what would you have me use?

Gmail? Hotmail/AOL if you're still in the 1990s?

Syla5 · 17 May 2016 at 12:30

Unless you plan to have a nice big wedding in the future and it means a big deal to you both, you could just get married, then you can leave your wife off the mortgage application and the deeds and she is covered without fear of you being able to run away with the house.

It is likely cheaper to go to the registry office then to try and sort any legal agreement between the pair of you.

Mr Jack · 17 May 2016 at 12:57

You can have the mortgage assessed on your income alone, and still have it in joint names. The mortgage company will assess to their higher of single income based and joint income based.

This is common, ordinary, and absolutely nothing to get fussed about.

Vipa66 · 30 May 2016 at 16:52

Mr Jack said:
You can have the mortgage assessed on your income alone, and still have it in joint names. The mortgage company will assess to their higher of single income based and joint income based.

This is common, ordinary, and absolutely nothing to get fussed about.

That's not what he asked

Arthur Hucksake · 30 May 2016 at 18:06

I would listen to the gentleman who actually works in Financial Services for a living if I were you. Rare you get offered free, professional advice like that.

Domo · 31 May 2016 at 01:10

Update. So HSBC has stated they won't make any exceptions as we all suspected. Thought we'd give it a go since we've been a mortgage holder with them for 10+ years.

On my own I can borrow just over £400k, but when adding my partner with zero income that drops to £330k. The only way to get the amount required is to leave my partner off the mortgage and get a deed of trust drawn up. But she's not willing to do that and remains insistent on being named on the mortgage. I quote the mortgage advisor - "I must admit, you're not in the greatest position". Says it all. Wish my partner could see sense, in that a deed of trust is just as good as being on the mortgage - in fact it's better since she's not ever obliged to pay the mortgage but she is guaranteed to get half if or when we sell in the future! It's a win win.

Edit - it was HSBC who suggested the deed of trust.

covenantuk · 31 May 2016 at 08:12

Marry her and be done with it.

dowie · 31 May 2016 at 08:35

Why on earth would you even guarantee to give half of it io her if you're paying and you're not married?

She's being irrational tbh... having an agreement to give her a share of the house in future is reasonable (though relative to her contribution not half if you're the one paying for most of it).

Think about it OP she's putting her foot down because she wants to protect herself in the event you split up in future, you should be protecting yourself too.

Trifid · 31 May 2016 at 09:23

dowie said:
Think about it OP she's putting her foot down because she wants to protect herself in the event you split up in future, you should be protecting yourself too.

This. Seriously, the whole thing is for her sole benefit. Not yours. I'd be looking to quietly drop the subject of moving if you can.

Vipa66 · 3 Jun 2016 at 12:56

Domo said:
Update. So HSBC has stated they won't make any exceptions as we all suspected. Thought we'd give it a go since we've been a mortgage holder with them for 10+ years.

On my own I can borrow just over £400k, but when adding my partner with zero income that drops to £330k. The only way to get the amount required is to leave my partner off the mortgage and get a deed of trust drawn up. But she's not willing to do that and remains insistent on being named on the mortgage. I quote the mortgage advisor - "I must admit, you're not in the greatest position". Says it all. Wish my partner could see sense, in that a deed of trust is just as good as being on the mortgage - in fact it's better since she's not ever obliged to pay the mortgage but she is guaranteed to get half if or when we sell in the future! It's a win win.

Edit - it was HSBC who suggested the deed of trust.

For God's sake man... drop me a line.... look, I've even set up a gmail account!!!! [email protected]

Just run 3 different lenders affordability calculations making up the numbers so you, as a single applicant get to £400k... I then added your partner in both as a dependent over 18 (which would be pointless) and also as a second applicant with no income... it had NO EFFECT on the amount they would lend!

All lenders are different.. I get really frustrated when people go to their bank and then write everything off because XYZ Bank won't do what they want! Use a broker... that's what we are here for, trained for and I'm sorry, but every whole of market broker I know is worth 100 bank salespeople any day of the week.. our businesses rely on our ability to solve problems and make things happen, we don't just sit there trying to work out how to hit our stretch targets! (and trust me... that is exactly what they do... I worked in that environment for many years!)

dowie · 3 Jun 2016 at 13:20

you could always just mention those three lenders in this thread...

wildman · 3 Jun 2016 at 13:47

so she wants her name on the deeds but is contributing zero finances to it.

she can do one

Vipa66 · 3 Jun 2016 at 14:14

dowie said:
you could always just mention those three lenders in this thread...

unfortunately that would constitute advice and I ain't going to do that in an open forum.

Vipa66 · 3 Jun 2016 at 14:18

wildman said:
so she wants her name on the deeds but is contributing zero finances to it.

she can do one

I think giving up ones job, raising a family and looking after the family home is a HUGE financial contribution

tom_e · 3 Jun 2016 at 14:19

Domo said:
Update. So HSBC has stated they won't make any exceptions as we all suspected. Thought we'd give it a go since we've been a mortgage holder with them for 10+ years.

On my own I can borrow just over £400k, but when adding my partner with zero income that drops to £330k. The only way to get the amount required is to leave my partner off the mortgage and get a deed of trust drawn up. But she's not willing to do that and remains insistent on being named on the mortgage. I quote the mortgage advisor - "I must admit, you're not in the greatest position". Says it all. Wish my partner could see sense, in that a deed of trust is just as good as being on the mortgage - in fact it's better since she's not ever obliged to pay the mortgage but she is guaranteed to get half if or when we sell in the future! It's a win win.

Edit - it was HSBC who suggested the deed of trust.

She's really not selling herself as someone you want to sign half a house away to.

413x · 3 Jun 2016 at 15:15

It's horrible to say but really sure is protecting herself and add another poster said, you should be .

Hopefully this doesn't cause you relationship trouble. But if she is unrelenting it could do.

I wouldn't (personally) let her have all her way and cost both of you by insisting (irrationally) she be on the mortgage when there are are other options

Is she a very money driven person?

dowie · 3 Jun 2016 at 17:02

Vipa66 said:
unfortunately that would constitute advice and I ain't going to do that in an open forum.

really? But you don't have to advise him on anything, you can suggest he checks banks X, Y and Z himself as they might treat his partner's lack of income differently. He'll still need to speak to an advisor at the particular institution if he wants to do anything and you're not stating specifically that they will be any better just suggesting that he should check there in his search

you're able to share an opinion in general on different providers or products too without giving any specific advice

Vipa66 · 3 Jun 2016 at 18:29

dowie said:
really? But you don't have to advise him on anything, you can suggest he checks banks X, Y and Z himself as they might treat his partner's lack of income differently. He'll still need to speak to an advisor at the particular institution if he wants to do anything and you're not stating specifically that they will be any better just suggesting that he should check there in his search

you're able to share an opinion in general on different providers or products too without giving any specific advice

If that's your interpretation of MCOB, the MMR and the European Credit Directive, that's great.. But it doesn't match mine and it certainly doesn't match my compliance department's!

As soon as I start pointing anyone to a specific product or provider, it becomes advice, even in a casual conversation as you describe above.