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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:21   #1
pmbuzz
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Is it illegal NOT to save someone from dying?

If you ignored someone just about to throw themself from a high bridge ?
If you saw someone drowning and just walked on by ?
If you encountered people in a burning building and just carried on your way?

Say you started to save someone by giving mouth to mouth or cardiac compressions but gave up, could you be arrested ?

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:25   #2
Tefal
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in none of those situations could i see it being criminal because you'd have to put yourself and others at risk and would mostly just cause more problems than you solve.

Also please don't try and do CPR if you're not trained.

I think though like the woman wo stood there after her sister stabbed a guy and instead of phoning the police called hsi family and taunted them saying she wouldn't call an ambulance got sentenced when he died but under a different charge.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:25   #3
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No I would say.

All of the above are out of your control and more to the point you aren't the cause of the situation they are in.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:25   #4
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Er no. Well, not unless you were negligent (i.e. your action or inaction caused the death). You might put yourself in danger, or do more harm than you otherwise might have sought to prevent, etc.


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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:28   #5
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So what if someone's heart pills were 6 inches out of reach and you refused to pass them to them and they died?


That's the way'a the world! The way it's always gonna be!
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:28   #6
JBuk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbuzz View Post
If you ignored someone just about to throw themself from a high bridge ?
If you saw someone drowning and just walked on by ?
If you encountered people in a burning building and just carried on your way?

Say you started to save someone by giving mouth to mouth or cardiac compressions but gave up, could you be arrested ?

afaik there's no specific law that states you must inform the emergency services if you think somebody needs help

and it's ok to give up trying to resuscitate someone, you can't be expected to go at it infinately lol

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:30   #7
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In France you have to help people by the roadside. Something like that, anyway.
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:31   #8
Sinny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbuzz View Post
If you ignored someone just about to throw themself from a high bridge ?
If you saw someone drowning and just walked on by ?
If you encountered people in a burning building and just carried on your way?

Say you started to save someone by giving mouth to mouth or cardiac compressions but gave up, could you be arrested ?
I bet you could probably get sued though. or am I getting confused and thinking of America

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:31   #9
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Leave a lot of people to die do we?
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:32   #10
timmyt
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I doubt its illegal just in bad taste.
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:32   #11
muon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PardonTheWait View Post
So what if someone's heart pills were 6 inches out of reach and you refused to pass them to them and they died?
I think it is clear what your intentions are if you do that and are aware your inaction would kill them. I would hope there is a provision somewhere to charge such a person.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:32   #12
pmbuzz
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So, is NOT ringing the services an inaction that could cause death ?

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:33   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moses99p View Post
In France you have to help people by the roadside. Something like that, anyway.
You can be prosecuted for leaving the scene of a road accident (before the emergency services arrive) in the UK, but I'm not sure there's anything about helping people.


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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:33   #14
Tefal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbuzz View Post
So, is NOT ringing the services an inaction that could cause death ?
dunno, but actively stopping others from calling them seems to be.

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I already told you, you cannot compete at my intellectual level so there's no need to try.
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:34   #15
muon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbuzz View Post
So, is NOT ringing the services an inaction that could cause death ?
I would say yes.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:34   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PardonTheWait View Post
So what if someone's heart pills were 6 inches out of reach and you refused to pass them to them and they died?
Unless there was a duty of care then no it wouldn't be illegal.

Wouldn't want to know you though
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:35   #17
mame
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This has crossed my mind before. What if your worst enemy was about to suffer a slow James Bond style death that was nothing to do with you and just sat back and said "ho ho ho, I'm going to enjoy this" an waited the 10 minutes it took to kill him.
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:35   #18
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This is your friend:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omission_(criminal_law)

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:36   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mame View Post
This has crossed my mind before. What if your worst enemy was about to suffer a slow James Bond style death that was nothing to do with you and just sat back and said "ho ho ho, I'm going to enjoy this" an waited the 10 minutes it took to kill him.
It's ok, but only if you have popcorn.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:39   #20
mame
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It's ok, but only if you have popcorn.
I think your sig. goes with that
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:39   #21
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None, the Laws in England and Wales does not make it illegal for an omission act. WITH EXCEPTIONS.

i.e.

If you are a Parent or Guardian of the person - hence you are legally required to care and feed your child. (from Children and Young Persons Act 1933)

Job/Duty - Police officer to help someone in a fight/prevent a crime (Crouther’s Case (1599), or if you are a Doctor, and someone is dying in front of you, you should at least try (without putting yourself in danger).

Duty arising from special relationships - R v Gibbins and Proctor (1918) CCA.

Assumption of care for another - R v Smith (1826). R v Shepard (1862)

Official, contractual or public duties - Railway keeper ( R v Pittwood (1902) close the gate, he didn't hence liable)

etc etc etc

There are a few more..

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:40   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich_L View Post
But broken links aren't anyone's friends.

(fixed the quoted one so you can edit yours and claim ignorance )


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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:41   #23
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I remember when I was in Scouts and we were being trained in CPR and recovery position stuff. The Scout Master just warned us that if somebody was unconscious or possibly dead, it didn't change the fact that you can't take advantage of someone! :O

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:42   #24
Raymond Lin
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Side note - There are countries however where it is illegal if you can make a easy save (a Fine for example), or at least say, call the police/fire department/ambulance.

In short, the UK doesn't not make everyone have the obligation of Superman.

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:43   #25
muon
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What about reporting crime? Is that mandatory?

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:51   #26
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Guy drowning --> You have a fear of drowning
Guy about to jump ---> you have a fear of heights
People burning ---> Fear of fire


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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:52   #27
Raymond Lin
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What about reporting crime? Is that mandatory?
depends if you are in it

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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:55   #28
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I've got a better question, is it illegal to stop someone performing an illegal act if that act was to prevent you from performing an illegal act?
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Old 28th Sep 2010, 23:59   #29
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a large portion of the western world has good samaritan laws of one of two different kinds.

The USA largely makes it hard/impossible for people to be sued for helping and failing/doing something wrong.

There and many other places its to help prevent people from being too scared of the repercussions to help.

other places the law works to make it illegal to not help if you can.

In the situation described in the op in those places it would be illegal to not call for help, but wouldn't be required to put your own life at risk.

In the USA you wouldn't get sued for helping and failing, trying CPR but doing it incorrectly, etc, etc.

In the uk we don't really have anything, we're MORE vunerable to being sued for helping than the USA, and less vunerable to being sued for not helping, IE its easier to do nothing in the UK and not get in trouble for it.
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Old 29th Sep 2010, 00:07   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbuzz View Post
If you ignored someone just about to throw themself from a high bridge ?
If you saw someone drowning and just walked on by ?
If you encountered people in a burning building and just carried on your way?

Say you started to save someone by giving mouth to mouth or cardiac compressions but gave up, could you be arrested ?
I would say that you'd have a lot of explaining to do as to why you didn't call 999 in any of those cases.

You never have to put yourself in harm but in some of the situations presented in the thread like heart pills being 6 inches away I believe you could be charged with death by negligence or some such thing.

In France there is the samaritans law which I believe means you can be prosecuted if you don't contact the emergency services or try to help if you see an accident.

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