Legal Advice?

King Damager · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:51

Ok, so here is the situation.

On ~ 30th November, our landlords, who generally speaking have been very good up until now, dropped a letter through our door asking us whether we wanted to renew our contract for next year (August 2012-2013). They said that if we wish to renew the same household then if we let them know by Thursday 1st December at time X. Then they'll deliver us an agreement which will need to be completed in 14 days. The short version of what follows is that we got in touch with them and said we wanted to continue our agreement, before the set time.

We have, however had no agreement come through, and today instead got a different letter. This letter said that unfortunately the property that we currently rent (and the entire block), is no longer being offered this year (No reason given). They are however offering to show us around some alternative accommodation that they have available for next year and will offer us this accommodation. On top of this they'll pay to keep stuff in storage for us, if we desire, to help ease the transition.
Upon phoning them up and asking to book a time ASAP to see their alternative properties (they go fast, and they're saying that they are available on a first come first serve basis), the reason that I was given as to why our current properties will be no longer available is because 'someone has come along who wants the lot'. Now I feel that they may well mean buy, or even rent the lot at once, and was wondering how legal this is.

My opinion is, that whilst unfortunate that they're screwing us over, as we haven't actually officially signed anything for 2012/13, they're perfectly entitled to do whatever the hell they want....

Disclaimer:
I realise that no one here is a qualified lawyer etc, and none of the advice is likely to be entirely accurate.

kd

Participant · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:52

The contract expires, your obligations to each other expire with it.

Nitefly · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:54

King Damager said:
Disclaimer:
I realise that no one here is a qualified lawyer etc, and none of the advice is likely to be entirely accurate.

kd

Not entirely true!

Go and speak to a solicitor about it.

Haggisman · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:54

Robbie G said:
The contract expires, your obligations to each other expire with it.

Pretty much this - in fact I think it's pretty good of them to go out of their way to help you and pay to store your stuff while you find somewhere new.

cm1179 · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:55

King Damager said:
and none of the advice is likely to be entirely accurate.

kd

then it's useless

King Damager · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:55

Robbie G said:
The contract expires, your obligations to each other expire with it.

Aye, this is what I thought unfortunately :s

Thanks anyway I guess...

kd

Paul11 · 8 Dec 2011 at 13:57

King Damager said:
Disclaimer:
I realise that no one here is a qualified lawyer etc, and none of the advice is likely to be entirely accurate.

kd

how do you know no one here is a qualified laywer ?

strange comment to make considering how many people there are on the forums

King Damager · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:01

Paul11 said:
how do you know no one here is a qualified laywer ?

strange comment to make considering how many people there are on the forums

Chances are somebody is, but considering every other legal thread in existence gets rebuffed by plenty of people saying stop asking for advice on the internet and get to a solicitor I thought I'd solve the pointless posts...

kd

grumpysculler · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:02

Robbie G said:
The contract expires, your obligations to each other expire with it.

Not entirely true.

Is this Scotland or England/Wales? Tenancy law is different in each.

In a fixed term they can go stuff themselves unless you do something daft like don't pay rent. Provided you are not in a fixed term, the landlord can evict you provided proper notice is given. In England/Wales this would be a Section 21 notice and in Scotland a notice to quit and Section 33. In both cases, it is 2 rental periods notice that is required (assuming monthly rent and AST/SAT).

When a fixed term ends (unless you are subejct to tacit relocation in Scotland), you automatically go onto a periodic tenancy with all the rights you had before except for those pertaining to termination.

Speak to a solicitor, shelter or ask at http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=16 (lots of good housing folk there)

tl;dr - they can kick you out for no reason but they have to do it properly. Even if your fixed term expires, you still have a valid tenancy.

King Damager · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:04

England.

In a Fixed term at the moment for Aug 2011-2012.

kd

Nitefly · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:04

King Damager said:
Chances are somebody is, but considering every other legal thread in existence gets rebuffed by plenty of people saying stop asking for advice on the internet and get to a solicitor I thought I'd solve the pointless posts...

kd

My post isn't pointless because:

- you will be more likely to get accurate legal advise
- you will have a cause of action from incorrect legal advise

Hence anyone legally minded would probably suggest you do that, whilst every google warrior / armchair barrister will bounce in claiming to know the answer.

Pestilence · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:04

No need for a solicitor, tbh. There is no contract signed for next year, so they can do what they like.

Quite nice of them to be offering the alternatives they are, too.

Haggisman · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:05

grumpysculler said:
Not entirely true.

Is this Scotland or England/Wales? Tenancy law is different in each.

In a fixed term they can go stuff themselves unless you do something daft like don't pay rent. Provided you are not in a fixed term, the landlord can evict you provided proper notice is given. In England/Wales this would be a Section 21 notice and in Scotland a notice to quit and Section 33. In both cases, it is 2 rental periods notice that is required (assuming monthly rent and AST/SAT).

When a fixed term ends (unless you are subejct to tacit relocation in Scotland), you automatically go onto a periodic tenancy with all the rights you had before except for those pertaining to termination.

Speak to a solicitor, shelter or ask at http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=16 (lots of good housing folk there)

tl;dr - they can kick you out for no reason but they have to do it properly. Even if your fixed term expires, you still have a valid tenancy.

He's already stated they've been asked if they wish to renew - implying it's fixed term.

He's already stated the new tenancy starts in August 2012 - that's in 8 months time, I can't imagine their current agreement stipulates a 4 month notice period, therefore he's more than given them sufficient notice.

King Damager · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:05

Nitefly said:
My post isn't pointless because:

- you will be more likely to get accurate legal advise
- you will have a cause of action from incorrect legal advise

Hence anyone legally minded would probably suggest you do that, whilst every google warrior will bounce in claiming to know the answer.

Oh, no I understand that, and was expecting people to say that anyway. However, I thought I'd put a disclaimer at the end that pointed out that I was aware that people would point this out...

kd

Participant · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:06

grumpysculler said:
Not entirely true.

Is this Scotland or England/Wales? Tenancy law is different in each.

In a fixed term they can go stuff themselves unless you do something daft like don't pay rent. Provided you are not in a fixed term, the landlord can evict you provided proper notice is given. In England/Wales this would be a Section 21 notice and in Scotland a notice to quit and Section 33. In both cases, it is 2 rental periods notice that is required (assuming monthly rent and AST/SAT).

When a fixed term ends (unless you are subejct to tacit relocation in Scotland), you automatically go onto a periodic tenancy with all the rights you had before except for those pertaining to termination.

Speak to a solicitor, shelter or ask at http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=16 (lots of good housing folk there)

tl;dr - they can kick you out for no reason but they have to do it properly. Even if your fixed term expires, you still have a valid tenancy.

Erm , no, even if it's fixed term they can still give you notice to leave at the end of the term (July 2012).

anything I don't mind · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:12

I would just find a new place to live as soon as possible and not even take their offer for another place. It would not be worth the time to fight it to be honest.

grumpysculler · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:43

Robbie G said:
Erm , no, even if it's fixed term they can still give you notice to leave at the end of the term (July 2012).

Which can't be notice to leave during the fixed term.

Haggisman said:
therefore he's more than given them sufficient notice.

The notice period might be enough, but if that notice is not of the correct form then it will be thrown out of court. Statute is very clear on what is required for a notice to be valid and without a valid notice a mag/sherrif will not grant a possession order.

Glaucus · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:48

Nitefly said:
Not entirely true!

Go and speak to a solicitor about it.

Why, what would he achieve by doing that.

Participant · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:51

grumpysculler said:
Which can't be notice to leave during the fixed term.

Yes it can? You can serve a section 21 notice at least 2 months before the end of the contract, and its date is the day after the end of the term.

Glaucus · 8 Dec 2011 at 14:53

grumpysculler said:
Which can't be notice to leave during the fixed term.
.

It isn't a notice to leave during fixed term, it's noticed to leave at the end of the fixed term and is almost always given at the start of the tenancy (it can be given at any point) its nothing special so the chances of it being in wrong format are pretty much none.

And again what would he achieve or want to achieve by talking to a solicitor?
Just move on.