Poll: British Grand Prix 2021, Silverstone - Race 10/23

[Greboth]

I didn't realise they were so limited in options. Seems like there needs to be another more substantial penalty if after taking out your main rival in an overtaking manoeuvre where you were at fault you can still go on to win the race. Otherwise you're surely incentivising drivers to tactically clip the wheel of the car in front?

Given the split in opinion amongst fans, commentators and ex-drivers etc. as to racing incident or which one to blame. I do wonder if the stewards were also somewhat of the same mixed opinion and so concluded that Hamilton, while more at fault, was not wholly at fault. A 60/40 split to put an arbitrary number to it. Which also factored in the "soft" penalty as some have called it.

 

[GR63]

Quit being coy princess, you wanna accuse people of something then accuse them

I'm not fussed. Opinions are like a-holes.. everyone has one...

 

[this_is_gav]

Despicable to see the FIA, F1 and Mercedes having to put out a statement regarding the racism Hamilton has received. We've all got our opinions but there are no excuses for racism to be a part of them.

 

[jonneymendoza]

Despicable to see the FIA, F1 and Mercedes having to put out a statement regarding the racism Hamilton has received. We've all got our opinions but there are no excuses for racism to be a part of them.

https://www.skysports.com/share/12358799

 

[this_is_gav]

Seeing the incident from Hamilton's onboard my opinion hasn't changed. Verstappen didn't pinch Hamilton to the pit wall, Verstappen went middle, Hamilton looked left and then switched to that tighter line, then in my opinion Hamilton just carried too much speed given how tight he was and just understeered into Verstappen.

It certainly wasn't malicious or intentional, but it was ill judged.

As shallow a thought as this is, I can't help but think if someone like Mazepin had done this whether the opinions would be different.

 

[jonneymendoza]

Wait a minute - I watched Max steer away from Lewis and then steer back into him. Did you miss that bit?

Of course he did. He misses everything max done wrong. Blinkers on at full capacity lol

 

[dave28]

Given the split in opinion amongst fans, commentators and ex-drivers etc. as to racing incident or which one to blame. I do wonder if the stewards were also somewhat of the same mixed opinion and so concluded that Hamilton, while more at fault, was not wholly at fault. A 60/40 split to put an arbitrary number to it. Which also factored in the "soft" penalty as some have called it.

i imagine they have a different system of looking at it than fans and commentators though, my guess would be they just look at it from a black and white rule book view and they dont see anything there more serious to give a harder punishment

 

[Jono8]

Just watched the incident. Seems pretty tame. I've seen far worse go without a penalty. It's a racing incident for me.

Max seemed to lack awareness that Lewis was coming up on the inside.

 

[Terminal_Boy]

Are F1 going to have to introduce a tiered penalty system? That 10 second time penalty didn’t punish Hamilton at all and it wouldn’t have punished Verstappen if the incident had seen him put Hamilton into the tyre wall because they both have suck a combined skill/performance edge over the rest of the field.

 

[GravyMonster]

No absolutely not. For any given transgression you can't give one driver a 10 second stop/go and another a 5 second time addition simply because of the difference in their cars/position in the race/whatever other metric.

 

[Alibaba99]

Given the split in opinion amongst fans, commentators and ex-drivers etc. as to racing incident or which one to blame. I do wonder if the stewards were also somewhat of the same mixed opinion and so concluded that Hamilton, while more at fault, was not wholly at fault. A 60/40 split to put an arbitrary number to it. Which also factored in the "soft" penalty as some have called it.

The FIA stated that Lewis was predominantly at fault for the contact.

"The Stewards reviewed video and telemetry evidence," read their ruling. "Cars 33 [Verstappen] and 44 [Hamilton] entered turn 9 with Car 33 in the lead and Car 44 slightly behind and on the inside.

"Car 44 was on a line that did not reach the apex of the corner, with room available to the inside.

"When Car 33 turned into the corner, Car 44 did not avoid contact and the left front of Car 44 contacted the right rear of Car 33. Car 44 is judged predominantly at fault."

 

[this_is_gav]

Are F1 going to have to introduce a tiered penalty system? That 10 second time penalty didn’t punish Hamilton at all and it wouldn’t have punished Verstappen if the incident had seen him put Hamilton into the tyre wall because they both have suck a combined skill/performance edge over the rest of the field.

You can't have a harsher penalty just because team A isn't as good as team B.

Still maybe you're right in a way. 10 seconds at a later stop had little effect (Norris was on older rubber, Bottas waved him through and Leclerc was struggling on the hards with an iffy engine). If Hamilton had dropped 10 seconds on the road at the time the penalty was applied then he certainly wouldn't have won as he would be stuck behind too many cars so early in the race (as it was he couldn't get close to Leclerc until Leclerc suffered engine cut outs and Bottas couldn't get close to Norris).

 

[JRS]

Half-tempted to do a quick search back through the 2011 race threads to see how much overlap there is between Hamilton fans calling Verstappen everything from a pig to a dog right now and Hamilton fans insisting that everyone else was at fault when he was hitting everything except the safety car that year

 

[.:MBK:.]

The FIA stated that Lewis was predominantly at fault for the contact.

Reads like Hamilton failed to avoid the collision, rather than being directly classified as causing it. I know thats semantics but guess when it comes to the rules/penalties is a subtle difference and probably why it was a "soft" penalty.

 

[Basher]

Reads like Hamilton failed to avoid the collision, rather than being directly classified as causing it. I know thats semantics but guess when it comes to the rules/penalties is a subtle difference and probably why it was a "soft" penalty.

If Hamilton had spun out as a consequence of the manoeuvre, I wonder if they'd have penalised Max, given he could also have avoided it.

 

[this_is_gav]

Anyway some other thoughts on the race. Epic stuff by Leclerc. Ferrari haven't shown anywhere near that pace except at Monaco, a completely different track. He probably would have won had it not been for those engine cut outs. Can't help but wonder if Sainz might have been up there too had it not been for contact in the sprint race.

Ironically after a 40 point haul, I'm not sure it was a great race for Mercedes. Hamilton made a bit of a meal of beating an ailing car which had no right being in the lead, Bottas was completely absent (albeit maybe knowing his fate) and Russell got a penalty for knocking Sainz off on Saturday, still started well ahead of his teammate yet was only 2 seconds ahead of at the end of the race (though this went up to six after Leclerc and Hamilton lapped him) - this is why Russell still has questions over his race pace. I can't help but think if Verstappen had got away from Copse in the lead then he would have driven off into the sunset.

Another cracker by Alonso. He'll never get back to his 2012 peak, but he's still better than most. Even after his amazing first lap in the sprint race he still had no business finishing 7th in that Alpine.


I only voted the race a 6 has it was very processional and pretty boring for most of the race and while the battle at the front gave some excitement I couldn't but think it was a bit hollow given how much faster the Mercedes is than an ailing Ferrari.

 

[Steampunk]

I didn't realise they were so limited in options. Seems like there needs to be another more substantial penalty if after taking out your main rival in an overtaking manoeuvre where you were at fault you can still go on to win the race. Otherwise you're surely incentivising drivers to tactically clip the wheel of the car in front?

No, because you get punished for what you did, not what the outcome of serving that punishment at the end of the race. Hamilton was just as likely to get a puncture or lose a wing or wheel in that collision, so it's not something drivers tend to do. I'm sure that regardless of the punishment or what points Hamilton ended up with, Christian "old lady" Horner would be complaining that nothing less than his disqualification from the race would be "fair" considering that Verstappen was out of the race thanks to his own aggressive driving.

Some drivers (such as Verstappen) do historically have a habit of trying to hit the car near them in order to force them out of the way for a corner. Verstappen time and time again relies on the other driver moving in order to prevent the crash that he is causing. When there's no where to go, or when the other driver isn't being bullied, this is the sort of incident that happens, and it does happen regularly when Verstappen is involved.

 

[this_is_gav]

Christian "old lady" Horner would be complaining that nothing less than his disqualification from the race would be "fair" considering that Verstappen was out of the race thanks to his own aggressive driving.

I think Horner's reaction was fully justified (as was Verstappen's tweet from his hospital bed) given his opinion that his driver had just been punted off at over 180mph, especially after he heard Max struggling to breath over the radio. That would have been enough to shake anyone close to you.

Mercedes didn't come off any better than Red Bull in the tit-for-tat pleading and "please, sir" stance during the red flag. They were both as bad as each other.

Mercedes have been getting increasingly annoying this season. They have spoken regularly about wanting a challenge, yet the moment a team steps up to the mark they've tried every trick to have that challenge removed or nullified. Then the rumours of Hamilton wanting a veto on having Russell as a teammate.

 

[deuse]

Wait a minute - I watched Max steer away from Lewis and then steer back into him. Did you miss that bit?

The post above

"“We’d failed the rim where we’d had the contact at the front-left,” Shovlin said. “So that would have been a DNF had it not been red-flagged.""

 

[Feek]

The post above

Great job in completely avoiding my question. The damage occurred during the contact, of course it did. What does that have to do with one driver visibly steering into the other driver?