BBC testing UHD.

Chandler_90 · 29 Jul 2014 at 18:21

Where can one view said UHD test material?

GAC · 29 Jul 2014 at 18:28

As part of its presence at the Commonwealth Games, BBC Research & Development currently has a number of ultra high definition (UHD) television screens at both the Science Centre in Glasgow and New Broadcasting House in London showing live coverage of the games. These screens are open to the public for the duration of the Commonwealth Games and free to view for visitors between 10am and 5pm in Glasgow and 12 midday to 3.30pm in London.

Chandler_90 · 29 Jul 2014 at 19:00

Ah, I see I actually need to read here lol

GAC · 30 Jul 2014 at 13:17

well finally got a reply from someone in charge.

Thank you for our interest in UHD. BBC R&D is currently working with the
other European broadcasters within the European Broadcasting Union
(www.ebu.ch) to define the most appropriate technical parameters for UHD
in Europe. We are considering parameters such as frame rate, bit depth,
dynamic range and colorimetry. No conclusions have been reached yet, as
there is still further research to be done. The results will be
published in due course.

Regards
John Zubrzycki
Portfolio Manager
BBC R&D

so god knows where it will end up. sigh.

Sirrel Squirrel · 30 Jul 2014 at 15:08

What do you want to actually know? I summed up the rough spec of what is currently being tested in my earlier post.

GAC · 30 Jul 2014 at 15:16

was trying to find out what they where actually classing as uhd, res and bandwidth. after all iplayers hd in glorious 720p.

i know what you said, but unless your working at the bbc its just your guess, although a educated one as i take it you work in tv land of some description.

Sirrel Squirrel · 30 Jul 2014 at 15:29

Bit more than an educated guess, the facts are that UHD for broadcast is classed as 3840x2160 resolution, the current spec allows for 50p or 60p. Bandwidth wise the absolute minimum you can get away with for a 50p stream at that resolution using the HEVC codec is around 18Mbps depending on the content. Transmission tests that have been carried out so far have ranged from 20Mbps to 35Mbps, so as an educated guess, the BBC are probably testing their feed at 30Mbps but they could well be varying it since it is a test.

GAC · 30 Jul 2014 at 15:35

ahhh. just hope its more towards the 35Mbps end make a nice change from the current gimped stuff. sky movies for one even in hd can look rather iffy. although film4 the last time i had it in hd looked very good.

Rroff · 30 Jul 2014 at 15:45

I'd be suprised if the bitrate as generally used will be that high - infact I wouldn't be completely shocked if it ended up around 11-12Mbit even :S

Chris1712 · 30 Jul 2014 at 16:11

It'll be the same or near enough as the World Cup tests. If you're close enough to the right transmitter (WC was Crystal Palace, not sure about this) you'll be able to dump the whole mux with any T2 tuner then try and play it back.

The World Cup footage was:
HEVC 3840 x 2160 @ 59.59 FPS, 35mbps
HE-AAC 48HZ Stereo 153kbps

Quartz · 30 Jul 2014 at 17:17

We might not be getting 4K OTA:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/0...eo_on_terrestrial_tv_crunch_time_for_freeview

Chris1712 · 30 Jul 2014 at 17:48

Another switchover will happen, turning off DVB-T only leaving T2, SD channels will move to h.264, HD channels to h.265 etc. etc. It's all possible and part of the BBC's remit to push technology in the UK.

You will get something on T2 (HEVC) soon though, even if it's just a BBC demo channel like BBC HD was back in 2009.

Gundam God · 31 Jul 2014 at 18:15

^ More than likely as I can't see them getting rid of freeview any time soon.

Is it not possible to add more capacity on freeview?

asim18 · 31 Jul 2014 at 19:36

You can tell which cameras are native 4K while watching on 1080p, not a lot of them. All of the shots aren't even 1080p yet, some are just high grade broadcast cameras.

Doubt it'll be anything amazing or if anything will come of it any time soon.

gothic_hobbit · 31 Jul 2014 at 19:39

Sirrel Squirrel said:
SD has definitely dropped in bit rate and the +1 channels even more so, some are around 1Mbps. Sky are actually considering delivering 4k over the Internet utilising the fibre network their working on so they can guarantee a sustained bit rate to their boxes. They can then keep the satellite bandwidth for SD and HD.

Standard definition Freeview channels look like VHS quality.

GAC · 31 Jul 2014 at 22:43

got a tweet back from the bbc guys with this.

our Ultra HD trial broadcast is at 35Mbs (camera feeds are 800Mbs)

Sirrel Squirrel · 1 Aug 2014 at 12:46

asim18 said:
You can tell which cameras are native 4K while watching on 1080p, not a lot of them. All of the shots aren't even 1080p yet, some are just high grade broadcast cameras.

Doubt it'll be anything amazing or if anything will come of it any time soon.

What sort of content are you referring to, for something to be classified as HD for broadcast it must be recorded at at least 1920x1080 and 50 interlaced or 25 progressive frames a second or 1280x720 at 50 progressive frames a second, which used to be the case for some sports channels but I don't know if that's changed.

It is anticipated that UHD broadcasts will start at some point in 2016 and from the current tests it promises to be pretty amazing, considering the frame rate is being doubled, the resolution is quadrupled and the colour space will also be widened.

413x · 1 Aug 2014 at 12:54

Tbh there is nothing on BBC I would want to watch in 4k
I think if you don't watch sport much (me) there isn't really anything on broadcast TV where I go 'I want higher resolution)
Certainly not at cost of more licence fee

Only thing that I think would interest me is films. I'm not sure how much capacity a 4k film would need

And if it doesn't he told established on physical media I will never need to worry about it anyway for at least 10yrs I expect

Rozzy85 · 1 Aug 2014 at 17:38

Gundam God said:
^ More than likely as I can't see them getting rid of freeview any time soon.

Is it not possible to add more capacity on freeview?

Capacity is dependent on the modulation used and the frequencies available in an area. If you can receive all channels currently transmitted then it's about 129Mbit/s for DVB-T and 40Mbit/s for DVB-T2. A typical Freeview stream/channel uses about 1600-1800Mbps. A new channel is also being rolled out so that'll be even more. Will probably be DVB-T2 to expland the HD channels available.

asim18 · 2 Aug 2014 at 13:43

Sirrel Squirrel said:
What sort of content are you referring to, for something to be classified as HD for broadcast it must be recorded at at least 1920x1080 and 50 interlaced or 25 progressive frames a second or 1280x720 at 50 progressive frames a second, which used to be the case for some sports channels but I don't know if that's changed.

It is anticipated that UHD broadcasts will start at some point in 2016 and from the current tests it promises to be pretty amazing, considering the frame rate is being doubled, the resolution is quadrupled and the colour space will also be widened.

I'm referring to the coverage of the Commonwealth Games.