Decisions Decisions.. Rift vs Vive

[Surfer]

Thats just my normal personality lol.

People always say ohh Vive has room scale...for months and months now and im still waiting on the game that proves that point. Whats the point in Vive being able to do roomscale if there is no game that takes real advantage of it. All the games ive seen so far arent actually proper room scale and the Oculus can easily do them with its own system.

Just advertising or marketing bumflluff flannel then?


I dont favour either though there are certain aspects of the oculus which are very annoying.

 

[RoyMi6]

As someone with 2 x Vive, a Rift (DK1, DK2, CV1) and Touch pre-order I have to agree with you about the room scale thing being "limited".

I've got two VR rooms, one at home (3m x 3m) and one at work (4.5m x 4.5m)

In both instances I've had the opportunity to game and try out custom developed software.

Regardless of the size of the room it always limits you as the virtual world is likely always bigger.

In Onward for example, sort of the jumping out of the way around a corner, it just makes sense to stay in the middle of the room and use the movement mechanic to get around. By moving to the side of the room you ultimately need to move back to the centre of the room when you move around again so that you can be most effective and no accidentally move into a wall when you get to a corner again.

Experiences and games that allow you to teleport (like Recroom) are again at no disadvantage by having a smaller room. To get across the play area you NEED to use teleport and when you do get excited and decide to move around your play space you usually end up pulling your cable out if the room is too big (literally in the work space we've got your can't use the far corner because it's further than the cable and I needed to reduce the room size to fit).

While there's definitely a benefit over "standing" room to "small room" the benefit does not scale well to "room size" and unless you've specifically custom made something that fits to the area you have (which we have, and it's a lot of fun) there's not a massive need for the space.

Saying that, the Oculus Rift headset cable is little limiting in that while I don't need a lot of space to move around I do want to have that space further from my computer/monitor

 

[millermilla]

It seems odd but teleporting soon becomes second nature and even with room to move I mostly teleport very close and take a few steps either way to get into position rather than walk to a location.

 

[ArmitageShanks]

Ok still waiting on you showing me the games.

Look on Steam - almost every Vive game. The teleport is just a way to get past the bounds of your physical room.

So, let me list a few for you:

• Chair in a Room (this is actually a no-teleport game - you have to move across the entire room)
• Fantastic Contraption
• The Gallery - Call of the Starseed
• Google Earth
• Final Approach
• The Lab
• Locked in VR
• Onward
• Pool Nation
• Raw Data
• Rec Room
• theBlue
• Tilt Brush
• Vanishing Realms

...getting the picture yet? You can physically walk around your play area. You're not limited to standing on the spot in ANY of these. And this is pretty much 90% of my VR library. Even the wave shooters allow you to walk within the area they give you.

 

[Surfer]

Thanks i will check those out. I dont think you understand what i mean though when i say i would like to see proper room-scale because a lot of those games are not proper room-scale. I didnt realize in final approach you could walk about the environment. Is this a different mode? So i can walk from one end of my room to the other and this is replicated in final approach? wow thats pretty cool!

...getting the picture yet? You can physically walk around your play area. You're not limited to standing on the spot in ANY of these. And this is pretty much 90% of my VR library. Even the wave shooters allow you to walk within the area they give you.

Ohh right so according to what you're saying then... the Oculus can do room-scale too. You can move around an area, you are not limited to standing or sitting in one spot. The Vive is supposed to be all about room-scale isnt it?

I am due to buy a whole host of Vive games for my nephew if someone can say to me hey surfer shut it here is a proper room scale game no teleport movement; you actually physically move around (not just 1 metre ) if you have the space for it in your room. - i will buy it for him and play it.

But you can bet your ass i will be right back here if its a load of complete cobblers and isnt room scale at all. But i will be singing its praises if it is though

 

[Surfer]

As someone with 2 x Vive, a Rift (DK1, DK2, CV1) and Touch pre-order I have to agree with you about the room scale thing being "limited".

I've got two VR rooms, one at home (3m x 3m) and one at work (4.5m x 4.5m)

In both instances I've had the opportunity to game and try out custom developed software.

Regardless of the size of the room it always limits you as the virtual world is likely always bigger.

In Onward for example, sort of the jumping out of the way around a corner, it just makes sense to stay in the middle of the room and use the movement mechanic to get around. By moving to the side of the room you ultimately need to move back to the centre of the room when you move around again so that you can be most effective and no accidentally move into a wall when you get to a corner again.

Experiences and games that allow you to teleport (like Recroom) are again at no disadvantage by having a smaller room. To get across the play area you NEED to use teleport and when you do get excited and decide to move around your play space you usually end up pulling your cable out if the room is too big (literally in the work space we've got your can't use the far corner because it's further than the cable and I needed to reduce the room size to fit).

While there's definitely a benefit over "standing" room to "small room" the benefit does not scale well to "room size" and unless you've specifically custom made something that fits to the area you have (which we have, and it's a lot of fun) there's not a massive need for the space.

Saying that, the Oculus Rift headset cable is little limiting in that while I don't need a lot of space to move around I do want to have that space further from my computer/monitor

Thanks this is a good post ^^ that's what i'm talking about. Oculus does need a holodeck thingy like the Vive has so you can set room parameters (maybe you can do this with an Oculus touch update?)

 

[n3vrmind]

It depends where you put your tracking sensors or lighthouses and how you set your bounds within that, I have a reasonable sized main room and if i emptied it all out I could absolutely have 4.5m x 6m, but being practical I instead just use a 3m x 3m space that is clear except for a coffee table that is easily tipped on its side and moved out of the way.

Most games will know how big your defined space is but dont use to limit your movement, can walk beyond the chaperone boundaries and the games will still allow it, its your physical enviroment that wont as you will likely walk into whatever wall/object made you put your boundary there in the first place.

The few exceptions are if they are purposly designing the game so that you never have to move outside of the boundaries, like job simulator has different versions of the levels depending on how much space you have.

As the tracking 'fov' of the lighthouses is pretty wide, I have my desk/chair outside the space, but the lighthouses angled so they cover that too without relocating them, so I can play seated games at my desk and as I'm going to be sat I dont need to worry about having boundaries for safety

 

[n3vrmind]

Thanks this is a good post ^^ that's what i'm talking about. Oculus does need a holodeck thingy like the Vive has so you can set room parameters (maybe you can do this with an Oculus touch update?)

SteamVR implements this, if you play a game through SteamVR I fully expect you will have chaperone.

edit: note if there is an oculus API specific version and a steam version, you may need to use the steam version or revive. wont be enough to just link and launch the oculus specific version of the game through steam

 

[RoyMi6]

A recent Oculus Home updates included the ability to configure "Guardian" - which is the Oculus version of the SteamVR Chaperone system.

https://developer3.oculus.com/documentation/pcsdk/latest/concepts/dg-guardian-system/

And yes, if you play a SteamVR game with Oculus Touch the steam chaperone system kicks in. You can even setup the Chaperone if you just had the Rift/Touch

This guy answered these questions months ago when he got hands on: https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/4ojzp5/steamvr_supports_touch_now_i_thought_id_clear_up/

Specifically: https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/com...orts_touch_now_i_thought_id_clear_up/d4ddu75/

 

[Finguz]

If I played a lot of Elite Dangerous, driving games and others where I'm only going to be sitting down, I'd buy a rift. In all other cases the Vive offers more for your money imho.

I bought a Vive and I love it.

 

[africanos23]

Release 1.10.1

Touch: Set up Touch using the Oculus app, either separately or together with Rift. Find Tutorials at any time in your Oculus Library.

Guardian System: Lets you see when you're near the boundaries of the play area you've mapped out.

Touch: Experimental support for 2-sensor 360º and 3-sensor roomscale configurations. Additional sensor purchase required for roomscale configuration. When using an additional sensor, an additional available USB 2.0 or higher port is required. Detailed setup guide at ocul.us/360support

Oculus Store: See over 50 new apps and games supporting Touch.

Oculus Avatars: Create a customized avatar you can use throughout VR, including selected apps, games, and experiences.

Miscellaneous performance improvements, stability enhancement, and bug fixes.

 

[ArmitageShanks]

Thanks i will check those out. I dont think you understand what i mean though when i say i would like to see proper room-scale because a lot of those games are not proper room-scale. I didnt realize in final approach you could walk about the environment. Is this a different mode? So i can walk from one end of my room to the other and this is replicated in final approach? wow thats pretty cool!

There are two versions of Final Approach: the "pilot edition" and the regular version. The "pilot edition" is the Oculus non-room-scale version. The regular version is the one where you look over the miniature map and can walk around it guiding planes with your finger. And not just walk...but walk, crouch down, look at stuff close up etc. Full immersion.

Ohh right so according to what you're saying then... the Oculus can do room-scale too. You can move around an area, you are not limited to standing or sitting in one spot. The Vive is supposed to be all about room-scale isnt it?

With one camera and no Touch controllers, the Rift can "sort-of" do room-scale...provided you stay within view cone of the camera and don't wander off too far (I suspect the shorter tether will stop you before that happens). It's kind of like PSVR in that regard.

Adding more cameras means a larger play volume and less chance of occlusion with the Touch controllers. I believe Oculus are recommending at least 3 cameras for a comparative room-scale experience when the Touch controllers are involved. The cameras are still limited by their resolution and vertical field-of-view (I think it's 100x70 degrees), so you might still have some shadow areas that aren't covered immediately below the cameras if you mount them high in the corners. You'd probably lose a small amount of play area on the periphery, but generally it should work just fine in a regularly-sized room.

The Vive's lighthouses sweep a 120x120 degree arc - with two, it can literally cover an entire room edge-to-edge.

I am due to buy a whole host of Vive games for my nephew if someone can say to me hey surfer shut it here is a proper room scale game no teleport movement; you actually physically move around (not just 1 metre ) if you have the space for it in your room. - i will buy it for him and play it.

Chair in the Room comes to mind immediately - it's environments are about 2.5x2.5m so provided you have that sort of play area (and enough tether cable!), it disables the teleport mechanic and you're literally in a room. It's a psych/horror game though

Other games/experiences that are room-scale with no teleport that I can think of (or remember): theBlu, a few of the Lab demos, Fantastic Contraption (I think this has some minor teleporting, but the play areas are generally room-sized enough to just walk in), Job Simulator, Tilt Brush (has teleport, but rarely needed unless you want to step far back from your creation), Space Pirate Trainer, Trials of Tatooine, Walz the Wizard...

But you can bet your ass i will be right back here if its a load of complete cobblers and isnt room scale at all. But i will be singing its praises if it is though

I think once you try it you'll be wondering what the hell Oculus were thinking keeping you sitting down for so long The immersion is on another level when you can physically walk around and interact with things. Even games with a teleport mechanic allow you to move around freely in your local physical space so you can look around corners, step to the edge of a cliff (or over it!) etc.

 

[CapitalOne]

Final Approach full version is one of the best VR games IMO - it's like having an "aircraft trainset". Fully immersive!

 

[Surfer]

Job Simulator, Tilt Brush (has teleport, but rarely needed unless you want to step far back from your creation), Space Pirate Trainer, Trials of Tatooine

Job Simulator isnt room-scale, neither is Trials of Tatooine (unless they changed the latter) I think we will have to agree to disagree on what constitutes proper room scale as you keep mentioning games which i know are not proper room-scale (makes me doubt the other games you mention)Job Simulator you barely move half a metre. Trials of Tatooine it was xbox controller to move around the environment when i played a demo. I guess they changed that in the final version??? I take it you can now map the area size of your space then upload that into Trials Of Tatooine and it calculates movement gameplay based on your room space??

There are two versions of Final Approach: the "pilot edition" and the regular version. The "pilot edition" is the Oculus non-room-scale version. The regular version is the one where you look over the miniature map and can walk around it guiding planes with your finger. And not just walk...but walk, crouch down, look at stuff close up etc. Full immersion.

You can do all that with Oculus Touch and the Oculus Headset.... so yeah FULL immersion. In the game im playing currently, Dead Secret, you can walk around a little but can also peer round objects, look under objects, behind sofas, etc etc. Its very good implementation.

I will check out Chair in the Room, thanks.

 

[ArmitageShanks]

Trials of Tatooine you have to walk to access and interact with stuff. My largish room is actually too small for it (although I haven't tried with my rearranged setup). I didn't know you could even play it with an xbox controller (I don't have one, and why the hell would you want to? That sounds incredibly...lame).

Job simulator I'd agree is a little more standing than room-scale (although you can move, the game doesn't require you to).

If you want a good demonstration of room-scale without the price, get the Lab off Steam and try out the experiences on that with the Touch (assuming its compatible). It's got teleportation, but you really want to move around the environments as well.

 

[danoliver1]

Played a chair in a room last night in my standing only space and i couldn't reach half the stuff even using teleport.

 

[ArmitageShanks]

Played a chair in a room last night in my standing only space and i couldn't reach half the stuff even using teleport.

I think it was designed for a minimum 2.5x2.5m play area and teleport was added as an afterthought. It disables the teleport if your chaperone meets the room size requirements.

 

[Surfer]

Trials of Tatooine you have to walk to access and interact with stuff. My largish room is actually too small for it (although I haven't tried with my rearranged setup). I didn't know you could even play it with an xbox controller (I don't have one, and why the hell would you want to? That sounds incredibly...lame).

Is this it? I think i played a different star wars demo not this one. But is the video here the full experience?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG7FtyxVqb4

If you want a good demonstration of room-scale without the price, get the Lab off Steam and try out the experiences on that with the Touch (assuming its compatible). It's got teleportation, but you really want to move around the environments as well.

Ok thanks - i wont get to try it until Christmas but i'll update the thread.

 

[ArmitageShanks]

Is this it? I think i played a different star wars demo not this one. But is the video here the full experience?

That's the one...it's not very long, but it is free at least. The first time I tried it I had to lean through the chaperone over my sofa to reach the buttons - it needs quite a largish square space.

 

[Surfer]

Tomorrow Matthew i will be playing....

Chair in a Room (using the full room version not the teleport version)
TiltBrush
Space Pirate Trainer
Cloudlands VR minigolf.

Chair in a Room i am especially looking forward to. Happy Christmas