So, Corbyn Loves China. Interesting...

Caporegime
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Off the top of my head the US military capabilities dwarf both Russia and China combined in terms of budget and hardware and overall "power" - China might have massive man power and Russia can maintain parity in strategic assets but overall combined they aren't even close to being able to wage war at the level of the US.

That's why they have changed tact, and are attempting to undermine faith in the truth and democracy itself.
 
Soldato
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Agreed. I personally think it's an awful system and communism in its purest form is brilliant. Sadly communist states far too easily become a dictatorship kleptocracy. Can't actually think of one that hasnt.

indeed, nothings perfect, communism fails to account for the fact that power corrupts, capitalism fails to account that there always needs to be some poor sod at the bottom of the pile and democracy fails to account for the fact that giving power to people who want power isn't the best idea.

although until we invent an ai capable of making fair and reasonable decisions for all of us then i reckon we're stuck as we are.
 
Man of Honour
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Agreed. I personally think it's an awful system and communism in its purest form is brilliant. Sadly communist states far too easily become a dictatorship kleptocracy. Can't actually think of one that hasnt.

Problem is it always falls down due to trying to brute force past human nature even if the leaders themselves don't become corrupt and almost always ends up going towards authoritarianism or totalitarianism to try and keep it working.
 
Soldato
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'Communist China is responsible for the majority of success in slashing extreme poverty, a spokesman for Jeremy Corbyn claimed today.'

I’ve seen some comparisons between Communist China and capitalist India. Over the last 40 years, China has lifted hundreds of millions of people out of extreme poverty while India’s numbers have barely changed.

The CCP is so clearly a terrible regime (especially if you’re not Han) but they’ve achieved something incredible.

At what price to freedom and human rights is tackling extreme poverty worth?
 
Soldato
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Problem is it always falls down due to trying to brute force past human nature even if the leaders themselves don't become corrupt and almost always ends up going towards authoritarianism or totalitarianism to try and keep it working.

exactly - all idealogical systems try to change basic human psychology and it has never worked and it never will.
 
Soldato
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I’ve seen some comparisons between Communist China and capitalist India. Over the last 40 years, China has lifted hundreds of millions of people out of extreme poverty while India’s numbers have barely changed.

The CCP is so clearly a terrible regime (especially if you’re not Han) but they’ve achieved something incredible.

At what price to freedom and human rights is tackling extreme poverty worth?

I think the difference that we struggle to understand between China and democracies is that China is focused very much on the greater good rather than individuals.
That's why they have the worlds largest high speed rail network, that's why they will build roads around someones house if they refuse to move, they will deliver benefit to thousands of people by building that road and inconvenience one family.
 
Soldato
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They are not on the way to “eclipsing” America in power and influence terms either.
Of course they are, stop waffling nonsense, it's tiresome.

The People's Republic of China receives continual coverage in the popular press of its emerging superpower status,[11][12] and has been identified as a rising or emerging economic growth and military superpower by academics and other experts. In fact, the "rise of China" has been named the top news story of the 21st century by the Global Language Monitor, as measured by number of appearances in the global print and electronic media, on the Internet and blogosphere, and in social media.[13][14][15][16][17] The term "Second Superpower" has been applied by scholars to the possibility that the People's Republic of China could emerge with global power and influence on par with the United States.[18] The potential for the two countries to form stronger relations to address global issues is sometimes referred to as the Group of Two.

Source (not that you'll take any notice, sigh) = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potential_superpowers
 
Soldato
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Mention in the news yesterday.

What I find interesting in this is that, for many years, I have felt that modern China is the practical embodiment of a 21st century Nazi state.


So, is Comrade Corbyn really a closet Nazi at heart??

;) :D
You answered your own question
 
Man of Honour
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Corbyn loving a country with the terrible human rights record that always accompany his preferred economic approach, this is not a suprise, he is on record enough doing this time and time again.
 
Soldato
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Of course they are, stop waffling nonsense, it's tiresome.

Tiresome? It's my first post in the thread! :D

There's no doubt that they're in the ascendancy, but they aren't going to become the number one power for a very long time if ever, and achieving supremacy in the military domain will be even harder. The US have something like 800 bases in around 70 countries. The Chinese have got one base overseas.

Look at the US nuclear arsenal- around 4,000 to 5,000 active warheads deployable via a triad of delivery mechanisms- Missiles, planes (B52, B-1B, B-2, jets) and subs (14 Ohio Class). 10 Nimitz class supercarriers, active fifth-gen fighters, the list goes on. They effectively outspend the rest of the world put together on defence. Their forces are overwhelmingly the largest and most technologically advanced.

Their military-industrial complex is just vast, look at the contractors they can call up- Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, General Dynamics, GE, Honeywell, and so on. Defence spending with Lockheed alone is bigger than the entire economies of Jordan, Serbia or Bolivia!

They're also still very much wedded to the idea of being the world's policeman.

So, some perspective is required before getting carried away with China's advance.
 
Permabanned
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Interesting he glossed over the fact the cultural revolution killed 10's of millions of people in their own country. Either he too stupid to know this or too heartless to care

Mao's great leap forward almost certainly saved lives in the long run. It didn't get off to the best of starts though admittedly.
 
Man of Honour
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10 Nimitz class supercarriers

I don't think some people realise that just one US supercarrier group at full strength would be capable of taking on many countries on its own - a few of them would give China a tough time despite the numerical differences - though I think the US would be handicapped a bit by their own hubris being far too used to fighting against enemy that don't have a chance of fighting them on equal terms and reliance on systems that in reality haven't been as tested as they should, etc. and of late a lot of poor discipline and poor command.
 
Man of Honour
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Mao's great leap forward almost certainly saved lives in the long run. It didn't get off to the best of starts though admittedly.

I'm pretty sure it did not.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Leap_Forward

Even the lowest estimate puts the death toll at 23 million people. The most recent puts it at 55 million dead people.

There is no justification for the death tolls involved in communism.
 
Man of Honour
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Yeah and I wish it was your last as reading this fiction is dull. Do some empirical research then get back to me.

Your own evidence says nothing about them eclipsing the US only that they are a rising super power that might one day approach something close to the US and while the US's fortunes long term might not be so rosy its unlikely they will fall so badly that China will eclipse them.

EDIT: Did you overlook that some of the stuff you've linked to is talking about supplanting the US regionally i.e. making them second place in Asia behind the US rather than globally?
 
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