Car thieves

Caporegime
Joined
18 Oct 2002
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37,804
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block 16, cell 12
I remember when my cobra alarm went off on my mr2 which was parked behind the house in an unlit park and I had no choice but to go outside and investigate at like 3am. Armed with just a ceramic cup - I remember someone on gets saying, 'what were you going to do, offer him a cuppa etc...

Now I live elsewhere and drive a £300 beat up almera so I just don't care.
 
Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2002
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4,452
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Wolverhampton
Around here the police have just announced a new initiative. Get burgled, robbed, mugged etc. and the police simply don't care enough to send officers around, you have to phone up a 'resolution centre' instead.

http://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/news/stoke-on-trent-news/ello-ello-ello-police-now-1153930

The media are quick to spin this in exactly the way you've interpreted it (where the police are portrayed as not caring enough to send officers or do their job properly etc), but the reality is somewhat different.

Rather than having a 101 or 999 call centre that can only handle enquiries and create incident logs to dispatch officers too (which was all they used to do), most forces are now starting to train their call centre staff so that they can now complete and record crime reports over the telephone.

Back in the day, only a police officer could generate a crime report, the call handlers were not trained or allowed to do it (both for reasons of knowledge and understanding, and home office accounting rules which forces were routinely slated for if they did not follow, whether through administration errors or deliberate efforts to massage official crime figures to make themselves look good). When officers were plentiful, this was less of a problem. In times of austerity when police numbers have fallen, whilst demand for service has increased (significantly so, partially due to the growth in mobile phone use over many years), it is simply a numbers game where the forces do not have enough officers to send to every call for service.

What the 'Resolution Centre' is meant to do is properly triage the calls as they came in, and generate crime reports/crime numbers over the phone where appropriate. Call handlers are trained to ask more questions and take basic details about an alleged offence, and can either record the offence over the phone or can forward the job to the dispatchers who can direct police officers to attend directly, depending upon the nature of the crime and the opportunities to gather evidence. The questions will help decided whether there is actually any points in officers attending.

What this means is, your hypothetical high value car key burglary with CCTV, forensics, witnesses and evidence left at the scene will *still* get officers dispatched to attend and deal with it and investigate it properly and thoroughly in the way that people expect.

What it also means is that your lower level burglary or theft, say a garden shed that's been broken into, where there are no forensic opportunities, no witnesses, no CCTV and essentially nothing of investigative value, can be dealt with entirely by the phone. The victim gets a crime number and the case gets closed at source, when there no lines of enquiry to follow (The call handlers will ask basic questions - IS there CCTV? Are there witnesses? Did your neighbours see/hear anything? Is the property that has been stolen traceable in any way? Are there any obvious forensic opportunities or items left behind by offenders? If the answer to such questions is 'No' in each case, then the crime is unlikely to ever be solved and there is little that will be achieved by sending a police officer directly other than providing a basic level of reassurance).

When there's not enough officers to send, the rational option is to deal with some crimes over the phone where the actual presence or attendance of a police officer will achieve little of practical value (given that in many cases, there are simply no proportionate lines of enquiry to follow and thus no evidence for a police officer to gather). The idea is that it frees up officers time to go and deal with incidents where there is a real chance of gathering evidence and/or arresting offenders, rather than spending time going to deal with offences where there is no evidence and the only outcome is an officer applying some verbal 'There, There' cream, reassurance, and giving the victim a crime number.
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Soldato
Joined
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Wolverhampton
Forensics is usually done by civilian staff, rather than warranted police officers, just an FYI :)

Most forces will have a policy that forensics staff (FSI/SOCO) will attend residential burglaries as a matter of course. The force I work for has a policy that police officers should always attend too, whether this is before/after the forensics folk have been. The fact that the call centre exists to deal with the lower level stuff does not mean that officers are not sent to more serious matters.

Is is worth noting that forensics is not magic and is very expensive - in the example of a shed being broken into that I gave before, you are unlikely to get anything of useful forensic and evidential value off a rough wooden shed door, so FSI would not be sent to examine the scene, its a basic question of proportionality in terms of the investigation.
 
Soldato
Joined
7 Jun 2009
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No where
What did/didn't the police do? I find it very hard to believe that they "wouldn't care" if a dog had been killed, 3 vehicles stolen and the original registrations to look into.

Or is it a case of the police not catching anyone so in some people's minds that translates to they didn't care?

They sent a single person around a week later, didn't collect any video evidence, did no forensics on the left defender (seized axle).
Just handed a crime number and told basically that his insurance would cover it.

South Wales police care more about easy crimes than actually anything hard. My missus when she was in shared accomadation phoned she had a intruder in her halls (all girls) , trying peoples doors. Police told them there was no one available. I managed to get from port Talbot to her halls faster than the police response.

I have no respect for South Wales Police, every time I have had to deal with them. I get either screwed over or they decide to just do **** all.
 
Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2002
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12,712
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Manchester
Do you still live local Worthy?

Golf Rs are the desirable car right now, to your average man on the street, they're just a golf, nothing that stands out, but they're faster than most stuff in the cop's arsenal, and roomy enough to use to commit crimes in.

As for the police attendance debate, I'm firmly in the camp that burglaries should not be routinely attended by cops. In most cases, all you do is take some details and record a crime. If there's nothing to investigate, it's just a waste of time you could spend elsewhere.

There are so many jobs and so little cops, things have to be prioritised, and life and limb comes before property, always. That means the domestic or the concern always goes before the burglary.
 
Soldato
Joined
7 Nov 2004
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15,688
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East of England
I'm firmly in the camp that every residential dwelling burglary should be attended. When I say this, mean the proper ones, not the drug addicts calling up reporting that someone has "robbed their house" and stolen £5 off the table and "stolen" all there meds so they need a crime number to go to the doctors to get more.

Nothing has an impact on people as much as their house being burgled and if nothing else, that initial reassurance is so important. From a purely selfish point of view, it's also one of the very few times I get to see decent, tax paying, pleasant people who never call the police and who are genuine victims who have been subject to genuine crimes.

I'm sick of the 99% never getting to see a police officer, because we are too occupied with the 1% of druggies/alcoholics/idiots who take all our time. This happened to me the other day, some poor lady had her house broken into at 10am. By 3pm there was still no one to go. I made it my mission to get to her, but en route, I got diverted to a "threats event" at the local "supported living" accommodation (a glorified crash pad for druggies/burglars/people who get out of prison). The "vulnerable service user" there has been threatened over text that he was apparently going to be shot, by his ex girlfriend. On reading the text messages, I was unsurprised to find that he was in some ****ed 5 way relationship with lots of criminals and a prostitute who he considered to his girlfriend and she....obviously didn't. He has threatened her, the other "clients" of hers and she has finally had enough of the thousands of text messages he had sent her so "threatened" to have him shot if he didn't leave her alone.

All of the people involved with this had lists of convictions of every kind, from firearms offences, to burglaries, to supplying drugs so it took me 3 hours to deal with everything to do with this heap of crap and "safeguard the vulnerable victim". I never made it to the nice old lady who had waited in all day with her conservatory door smashed in and her living room looking like a tornado had gone through it. I think someone might have possibly got to her that evening, some 9 or 10 hours after she reported having been burgled. Grrreat.
 
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Nov 2003
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36,743
Location
Southampton, UK
I'm firmly in the camp that every residential dwelling burglary should be attended. When I say this, mean the proper ones, not the drug addicts calling up reporting that someone has "robbed their house" and stolen £5 off the table and "stolen" all there meds so they need a crime number to go to the doctors to get more.

Nothing has an impact on people as much as their house being burgled and if nothing else, that initial reassurance is so important. From a purely selfish point of view, it's also one of the very few times I get to see decent, tax paying, pleasant people who never call the police and who are genuine victims who have been subject to genuine crimes.

I'm sick of the 99% never getting to see a police officer, because we are too occupied with the 1% of druggies/alcoholics/idiots who take all our time. This happened to me the other day, some poor lady had her house broken into at 10am. By 3pm there was still no one to go. I made it my mission to get to her, but en route, I got diverted to a "threats event" at the local "supported living" accommodation (a glorified crash pad for druggies/burglars/people who get out of prison). The "vulnerable service user" there has been threatened over text that he was apparently going to be shot, by his ex girlfriend. On reading the text messages, I was unsurprised to find that he was in some ****ed 5 way relationship with lots of criminals and a prostitute who he considered to his girlfriend and she....obviously didn't. He has threatened her, the other "clients" of hers and she has finally had enough of the thousands of text messages he had sent her so "threatened" to have him shot if he didn't leave her alone.

All of the people involved with this had lists of convictions of every kind, from firearms offences, to burglaries, to supplying drugs so it took me 3 hours to deal with everything to do with this heap of crap and "safeguard the vulnerable victim". I never made it to the nice old lady who had waited in all day with her conservatory door smashed in and her living room looking like a tornado had gone through it. I think someone might have possibly got to her that evening, some 9 or 10 hours after she reported having been burgled. Grrreat.

I agree. Dwelling burglaries are the sort of jobs I'll get comfortable, do properly and make it clear I'm undeployable. If you spend the time, often you can get unexpected forensic hits or help build a in depth MO which can lead to convictions with decent sentences. I'm not one for "visible policing" per se, but this is worth our time.
 
I haz 4090!
Don
OP
Joined
18 Oct 2002
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8,004
Location
Manchester
Do you still live local Worthy?

I'm living in Atherton matey.

I get it out of storage once a week and take it for a hoon around. Neighbour sent her 10 year old kid round when I had it out for one day last week, saying he was scared. Half of me felt sorry for him, half of me felt a bit angry at the emotional blackmail.
 
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