Woman guilty of 'racist' Snap Dogg rap lyric Instagram post

Caporegime
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So here is another daily dose of outrage....

A teenager who posted rap lyrics which included racist language on Instagram has been found guilty of sending a grossly offensive message.

Chelsea Russell, 19, from Liverpool posted the lyric from Snap Dogg's I'm Trippin' to pay tribute to a boy who died in a road crash, a court heard.

Russell argued it was not offensive, but was handed a community order.

Prosecutors said her sentence was increased from a fine to a community order "as it was a hate crime".

She was charged after Merseyside Police were anonymously sent a screenshot of her update.

Lol, tagged and community service for posting a song lyric online.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-43816921
 
Caporegime
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There's also this

Angela Conlan, prosecuting, told the court that the words were posted to the bio section of Russell’s Instagram account, and then reported to police last year.

The content was then passed to Constable Dominique Walker, who is based within a specialist police hate crime unit.

The court heard that Ms Walker was the sister of Anthony Walker, who was the victim of a notorious race hate murder on Merseyside.

PC Walker told the court that she found the words on Russell’s Instagram account grossly offensive.

She said: “As a black woman I found the words offensive and upsetting. The words are offensive to both black and white people.”

PC Walker also asked Carole Clarke, defending, not to use the word n**** in the court because she found it so offensive.

Ms Clarke argued that the meaning of the ‘n’ word had changed over time because it had been popularised by hugely successful and popular rap artists such as Jay-Z, Eminem and Kanye West.

But PC Walker said that the ‘n word’ was always offensive, whether used by white or black people. She also said that it did not matter how the word was spelt.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/woman-who-posted-rap-lyrics-14543694
 
Man of Honour
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I just googled that song out of curiosity, and the video literally has him shooting some old man and robbing him and how to get away with it, then in the next scene, him drive by shooting a group of kids...

I sound like my dad here but...no wonder we lived in such a messed up world
 
Soldato
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Current laws are inadequate when it comes to the internet.

However, there are lots of works of art that may be quoted out of context to be offensive. That you are quoting such doesn't reduce the offence. It's not a free pass.
 
Soldato
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Whom specifically was harmed as a consequence of this Instagram post. Was it aimed at an individual? I didn't see that in the BBC story. It didn't mention incitement to cause harm, and who would listen anyway. So she has literally been convicted of using offensive language in general not at someone just in general. Rap, I'd probably hate it. Lyrics sound offensive but I don't think offense is enough harm to criminalise and punish a teenager. This is not like Thought Crime, this is Thought Crime for pities sake what is happening to the World.
 
Soldato
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Whom specifically was harmed as a consequence of this Instagram post. Was it aimed at an individual? I didn't see that in the BBC story. It didn't mention incitement to cause harm, and who would listen anyway. So she has literally been convicted of using offensive language in general not at someone just in general. Rap, I'd probably hate it. Lyrics sound offensive but I don't think offense is enough harm to criminalise and punish a teenager. This is not like Thought Crime, this is Thought Crime for pities sake what is happening to the World.
In a private email, conversation, phone call, or letter, it would have been fine. But broadcasting on an open internet profile isn't. People just need to get their heads around the difference
 
Caporegime
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Highlighting again that we need stronger free speech laws in this country - you've got some random black PC who has decided that either version of the n word is offensive when used by anyone and therefore they push to charge this person...

yes, in theory they could charge Jay Z or any number of rappers

she's literally just quoted someone else and put it on her Instagram -what if someone wants to report on that (whether a newspaper or a blogger) would they get charged for quoting the same phrase in order to report on it... banning language is just ridiculous
 
Caporegime
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In a private email, conversation, phone call, or letter, it would have been fine. But broadcasting on an open internet profile isn't. People just need to get their heads around the difference

OK so should all rappers who use the word get charged?
 
Caporegime
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see my previous post about context

The context of a rapper using it is usually rather public, your previous post refers to private conversations...

so same question again...

at what point is it not ok - is it ok in the original song? Is it OK in a youtube video? Is it OK to quote the lyrics of the full song in the description of the youtube video...

but it is not ok to quote part of the lyrics... all you've commented on is that it was posted publicly but that doesn't really address what I brought up
 
Soldato
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In a private email, conversation, phone call, or letter, it would have been fine. But broadcasting on an open internet profile isn't. People just need to get their heads around the difference

I disagree strongly, if offensive language had been aimed specifically at an individual or a vulnerable group I would accept that offensive words cause harm. General non-specific sue of offensive words requires in my opinion a much higher threshold to demonstrate harm such as might be justified by incitement to do harm. If that is missing then I feel it is a massive over reaction to criminalise people. I might personally think less of person that said that but convict and punish, ridiculous. I think more harm has been done to this young woman than she has done through her post. The punishment is utterly disproportionate with the so called crime.
 
Caporegime
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it's a song, an artistic piece.

Out of context, it's just an offensive statement on the internet.

yes I know it is a song, an artistic piece... you're not presenting an argument there you're making a statement

Why is it out of context? It isn't unusual to have someone quote some lyrics or a saying or a snippet of some speech, poetry etc.. on social media, especially on Instagram...
 
Soldato
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I disagree strongly, if offensive language had been aimed specifically at an individual or a vulnerable group I would accept that offensive words cause harm. General non-specific sue of offensive words requires in my opinion a much higher threshold to demonstrate harm such as might be justified by incitement to do harm. If that is missing then I feel it is a massive over reaction to criminalise people. I might personally think less of person that said that but convict and punish, ridiculous. I think more harm has been done to this young woman than she has done through her post. The punishment is utterly disproportionate with the so called crime.
Would it be ok as a bumper sticker? a t-shirt logo? a flag in your garden? I feel it wouldn't, really.
 
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