NHS Rant

[glenimp617]

Health trumps everything else

Can you get a loan to cover the shortfall after selling the car and use the rest for healthcare?

"And her quality of life is poor at the moment too due to the daily pain she is in. She either tries to sleep all day or is that full of pain killers she is like a space cadet for much of the day. Seriously not fair."

after reading that again, absolutely do everything you can to go private. It's a royal pain in the backside considering you are already paying for healthcare through taxation.

 

[ethan]

It really is ridiculous these days.

A family friend is currently going through a formal complaint, which thankfully is being taken seriously. She has a history of cancer and found a lump in her breast that grew over a few days.
She called her GP surgery and explained the situation only to be told that it didn't warrant an emergency appointment and would need to book a 'routine' appointment, first available in 6 weeks.

By formal complaint do you mean to the CQC?

 

[Sheff]

It sounds as if your local consultant is over capacity and therefore life threatening cases will bump everything else backwards, you may be able to be seen quicker if you choose a different hospital.

Waiting times are increasing across the board for different specialties as hospitals struggle to recruit enough consultants, and then lose the ones they have to other hospitals in a more attractive area.

 

[Alex_6n2]

The sheer size of the NHS means experiences can be so varied.

If you're unlucky enough to have an over subscribed GP with staff that aren't top of their class, you'll receive notably worse care than a well run GP. It also depends how interested/stressed your assigned medical representative is on the day of your appointment/issue.

My step father died of sepsis (Pneumonia root cause) after being sent home by his GP on three separate occasions because he "Wasn't that unwell". My grandfather died of a stroke having been improperly cared for after a heart attack. My grandmother died of sepsis because she sat in A&E for 5 hours in a corridor on a bed being ignored (whilst showing signs of stroke which was a big thing at the time).

However, two months ago I was ill (viral) and was sent to triage immediately by my GP. I was seen immediately, put straight into a bed, given a full works check up including x-rays, blood screening and consultant debates akin to an episode of "House".

The NHS now has the "Golden Hour" push if you are suspected of sepsis, after statistics were published showing how bad the UK sepsis situation was. Frankly this is just one of the many illnesses that the NHS needs to improve on though, especially the difficult/unknowns per OP!

Making radical changes to an organisation that employs half a million people is so difficult and I believe it needs simplifying first before it can start to improve the standards of care. Trusts are disconnected and isolated, staffing standards are inconsistent across the various pillars (General practice/Hospitals/specialisms) and the NHS is so short staffed that it makes doing the basics difficult on so many occasions.

It's a brilliant organisation on principle. But it needs better management and execution in my opinion. I don't advocate just throwing more money at it, because that won't fundamentally change the way it operates behind the scenes.

 

[ryhoper1]

Went through similar with my old man.

He was told by his specialist if he didn't get a operation within a certain time period it would be a matter of time until he ended up a paraplegic.

They scheduled some more thorough scans and planned a date to do the surgery. The problem was at the time they used to outsource processing the scan data to some country in Africa. They got lost so he had to wait for another scan appointment. This made them miss the planned date to do the operation.

After another 4 months they finally had a date set for the operation. He had to go into hospital the night before. He was taken down to theatre but before they started the operation he was moved back to the ward and the operation was cancelled. They never told us why but a few days later it was in the Daily Mirror about some **** who had jumped off a pier drunk into a foot of water. The surgeon who was mean to be doing my dads operation was mentioned by name, he had traveled down south to operate on him.

Around 4 months later he had another date, that later got cancelled after the surgeon hurt his hand while on a skiing holiday.

12 months after that they send him for more scans but decided it was too late and there was nothing they could do.

After that it has just been a case of prescribing him pain meds to try and manage it, the problem is now he has been on them that long they don't really do anything for the pain and cause more problems.

The only thing that did anything for the pain was morphine patches, but they left him like a zombie. My dad read something in the paper about people with heart conditions being on morphine long term. So he rang the doctor for advice and the Dr said oh ye you shouldn't be on them. So he had to stop them immediately and go cold turkey.

 

[Resident]

By formal complaint do you mean to the CQC?

I think she said she wrote an email to an address given to her for a NHS commissioner

 

[doodah]

Really sorry to hear about your wife and hope it somehow gets resolved as quickly as possible.

A friend of mine recently needed a serious follow up op regarding his stomach. Fortunately this time he went through private care, all done and dusted in a month or so. A couple of weeks after the op, he received a letter from the NHS consultant saying they could do a consultation meeting in a few months so God knows how long it would have taken.

Family members have had less than stellar experiences themselves. Your current situation highlights throwing money at it isn't the answer.

Any way, all the best with your wife.

 

[Secret_Window]

I have family members who have been experiencing this for 9 years. In my own experience I had to wait 9 months to see my counsellor and that was back in 2004.

Unfortunately it's the same problem with whoever is in government from my own experience. There's lots of problems in the NHS, lots of which has caused unnecessary suffering for family members that could be totally avoided, but there is also some equally good and amazing things the NHS does as well.

Some people have asked a few people in my family who have long term illnesses why they are so 'self-absorbed' with their illness, to which I tell them to say that they would be if they had cancelled appointments, delayed referrals, inaccurate letters from appointments, and huge delays in treatment. People's lives essentially go on hold when this happens as they are ill and are unable to work and live properly, it's not a choice - which many people do not the understand unless they have been in the same situation.

 

[CaptainRAVE]

The NHS is an absolute shambles. The sad thing is we are all at the mercy of it too. Having seen first hand what happens if you need them for a serious ailment, I hope I never do. I would happily pay for the system they have in the US. It might be all for profit, but at least they willingly do every test under the sun and put you up in the equivalent to a 5 star hotel. I grimace every time I go into one of our hospitals - dark, dingy and often lined with bins of clinical waste.

My dad suffered a stroke that he never would have had they identified his brain tumour in a scan 3 years prior. Then gets left in the ambulance garage for hours because there are no stroke beds. Then needs to the loo and no nurse is free to see him without one of us fighting for him. Good luck if you are in on your own with no one to fight for you.

My ex had an operation, is throwing up for hours after, nearly not being released as a result - turns out the treatment required a single injection, but this was expensive and they wouldn't use it until an absolute last resort. I'm like, I don't care, I'll pay for it, that is not an acceptable reason.

Madness.

 

[Secret_Window]

The NHS is an absolute shambles. The sad thing is we are all at the mercy of it too. Having seen first hand what happens if you need them for a serious ailment, I hope I never do. I would happily pay for the system they have in the US. It might be all for profit, but at least they willingly do every test under the sun and put you up in the equivalent to a 5 star hotel. I grimace every time I go into one of our hospitals - dark, dingy and often lined with bins of clinical waste.

But they don't cover pre-existing conditions so that wouldn't work for those who have serious long term conditions wanting treatment.

 

[arknor]

Top 3 EU countries for health care: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Europe

1. Netherlands - Insurance based system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_the_Netherlands)
2. Switzerland - Insurance based system (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Switzerland)
3 Denmark - Publicly funded (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Denmark) Note, GDP per capita in Denmark is $49,613 vs UK $43,620

Switzerland health care is expensive though and mandatory, if you don't have one the state will assign one to you which will be more expensive that doing it your self.
also the doctors/hospitals come to crazy figures for things totally taking advantage that it's someone's insurance paying.

You do get seen extremely fast though.

Even for dental stuff it's something like 4x plus the cost of what it would be going private in the UK.

A lot of people hop across the border to Germany instead


switzerland is one crazy country when it comes to anything to do with money, if your on benefits and don't send them bank statements etc they will literally stop your money and send the police to your house.
Don't pay your bills, the police will literally come to your house.

from what I gather for fighting in the street you aren't likely to go to prison, even the smallest financial issues and you are very likely to.

 

[ethan]

I think she said she wrote an email to an address given to her for a NHS commissioner

Would have been better to have reported it to the CQC since they have the power to force them to act immediately. My experience with commissioning teams is that they will Bury the issue if/after it gets resolved and there will likely be a similar issue effecting somebody else later. For example see my previous thread about the aggravation I have received from them when trying to deal with a person's complaint in Speakers Corner.

 

[Scrutinize]

@Ace Modder you (i.e. your wife) only need to go private for the consultant appointments which are typically £250-£500. They will refer you back through the NHS with expedience and it's not uncommon to see or be operated on by them anyway.

If you know the name of the consultant phone their pa and ask to see privately or confirm with the docs who they will be then phone directly.

You only really need to go private on the actual op if you have health insurance and it's of benefit or the treatment is outside of NHS tariff.

 

[ShortWarning]

Sounds about right. I feel for the NHS though, they're trying but are chronically understaffed.

Maybe I have a decent doctors but on the rare occasion I go I tell them what I want rather than let them diagnose (I've sustained quite a few injuries over the years), so rather than them suggesting physio I'll just flat out ask them to send me for an MRI etc and they always oblige. This was after waiting 3 years for my first elbow surgery and going through the rigmarole.

Edit - My brother went private for hernia surgery because they just wanted him to reset up "to see if it gets any better" while he waited for referral (should have taken 8 weeks, he's still waiting a year later). It cost him about 3k but it was all done (appointments + surgery) less than 2 weeks later.

 

[The_Abyss]

I've my own share of horror stories (mostly relating to my parents) with the NHS, but ultimately we get the service that we are willing to pay for. The NHS isn't sufficiently funded to meet the needs of the nation, and whenever the funding issue comes up instead the debate is either too much waste or too many immigrant so no more money for you NHS.

The NHS, like many public services, can be funded in two ways:

1) we fund it with how much we'd like to pay, in which case we should expect that it will insufficient to meet our needs from time to time; or
2) we fund it with how much it costs to meet our needs, in which case we will find evidence of waste from time to time and there will be services used that some dislike paying for

 

[andicole0]

As far as I understand it in most cases the GP holds the purse strings. 1st step would be to confirm the referral with the GP and that they are happy to/able to pay.
The next step would be to contact the actual hospital and let them know the 18 weeks has been breached, they will get a black mark from CQC if it has. If the hospital won't or can't confirm an appointment complain through the NHS patient portal and contact your local mp and whatever trust the hospital comes under.
There is an organisation called NHS-I (NHS Improvement) contact them and make a complaint.
Finally the group with the clout are the CQC (Quality Care Commission) these are the people who measure hospital performance enact 'special measures' where necessary and have been known to remove people not making the NHS work!
It is along way from the front line to the powers that be but processes are there in order to highlight patients who have slipped through the net.
If you need any help identifying people to contact please send me a trust, I can't make any promises but I know someone who understands the structure. We would need to know surgery name and hospital referred to, no personal details of course.
Andi.

 

[BowdonUK]

OP, try and find the consultant who works at the hospital which will probably do it, and then find them on the BMI website for a consultation. You'll probably need a GP referral, but this can be a formality with some GP's.. BMI also has their own GP's that can write referrals, as a fall back.

If the consultant agrees there is a problem then there is a 'chance' he can move the nhs appointment up the list. That as happened to me a few years ago when trying to get an issue diagnosed for over 18 months.

The initial consultation will be btween £100 to £300 (at the most). I find when a case becomes personal and if you have a good social connection then they will take an interest and pull any strings they can. It is a long shot, but worth a try?

 

[Housey]

My experience of the medical profession is mixed. I am lucky enough to have excellent private cover but I still find getting to the consultant depends on the individual personality of the consultant. Get a good one and you are sorted, get a bad one and it's like puling teeth and be prepared to become their worst nightmare to get satisfaction. I am currently under 3 x private consultants (ENT, Respiratory and Rheumatology) and the difference in their approach and organisation is stark. You have to own your health and you have to be firm and clear in what you expect as the consultant level is up there with lawyers and city traders as the most arrogant people I have ever come across. One will see me in his house and take as long as I need (he lives local) where as another feels I am doing him out of more lucrative stuff and doesn't ever give me a warm feeling. I had to make it clear I was private, thus paying and if he didn't want a battle he should perhaps offer a little more courtesy next time we meet. Firm, clear and with a smile but it's what it took to get him to do little more than treat me as his equal not some **** on his shoe.

Typically the catalyst for action is a consultant engagement, so perhaps look at a consultant who can see you privately, but treat you on the NHS, that might help if you have not tried that and keep the big cost down. Also, find the money if at all possible if not. Put it on your house if you can, sell something, but make sure your wife's health is primary focus as we only have 1 life (if you can do, if not fully respect that not digging at your personal circumstances).

 

[Housey]

Also send me a PM. One of my mates is a top Gastro specialist, I am happy to have a chat with him and see if he can help. Top top guy and 'worked' on me and my wife privately.

 

[SexyGreyFox]

Do they? How do we go about making a complaint?

PM'd