Weird issues that I can't quite put my finger on...

[Moleyman]

Hi,

I am having problems with a new prebuilt system that I have had for the last 3 months.

I don’t seem to be able to get a stable and reliable performance from it. I will try to go into as much detail as I can.

By this I mean I keep ending up having to do fresh installs of Windows 10 and starting over. I just can’t put my finger on what is wrong but you know when you know something just isn’t right.

I don't think I have any viruses or malware; I did post here a few days ago wondering if I might have had one (posted in the Windows 10 forum) and got some replies but the machine has now got more problems before I could try the last couple of things I would advise.

My machine specs are:

i9900K
H115i Pro cooler
Z390 Aorus Master with F8e BIOS (not the final F8 BIOS - only just discovered that the Final has been released)
32GB (2 x 16GB) Dominator Platinum 3200

1 x 1TB 970 Evo NVMe M.2 (bottom slot)
1 x 1TB 970 Evo Plus NVMe M.2 (middle slot under the GPU)
1 x 1TB 850 Evo SATA
1 x 500GB 850 Evo SATA
1 x 240GB 840 Pro SATA
1 x 500GBMX300 SATA
1 x 525GB MX500 SATA
1 x 6TB WD SATA

MSI Gaming X 1080ti GPU (from my previous build)
Seasonic Ultra Prime Titanium 850W PSU.
Windows 10 Pro 64bit v1809

All the drives are reporting as Good in CrystalDiskInfo and my temps seem fine.

I dual boot the machine - one boot for work and one boot for gaming. I hit F12 at startup if I want to switch boot drives.

So far, I've had lots of just what I can only call "odd" behaviour - thiings that i kind of ignored but now as more and more start to happen I wonder...

Main thing is I have had 2 separate incidents of Windows 10 getting stuck in a boot loop of “preparing automatic repair” but it can’t repair anything and I end up doing a fresh reinstall. The first time this happened I was booting from the 970 Evo and the 970 Evo Plus so when I did the reinstall (13th April) I used the 840 Pro and MX500 as a test. Yet less that 2 weeks later (last night, actually) I had the same Automatic Repair looping issue. This time though I did choose the “Reinstall Windows option but Keep My Files” option and this got me back to the desktop, so from this I believe it was my Work drive that had the issues.

I also seem to get a lot of CHKDSK running during the Boot sequence (where I can hit any key to cancel checking) - not every boot by any means but more that I would expect.

It has gotten to the point now where I dread pushing the power button on as I don’t know what to expect next

My next steps intend to be:

Update the Mobo BIOS to the final F8 which I noticed has been out for a month or so.

Only install and boot from one of the NVMe drives - the 970 Evo Plus. I will keep the 970 Evo, 840 Pro, the 500GB 850 Evo and the 6TB WD installed and disconnect the other SATA drives.

And see how things go this time.

My thoughts were did I have too many storage devices attached as the machine is maxed out of drives? I would imagine though that I should be able to use what I had but given I seem to be having CHKDSK running at boot a few times, who knows?

Maybe a fresh BIOS update will help? Does updating the BIOS ever help sometimes?

Could it be a Windows issue each time and not hardware - given how problematic v1809 seems to have been?

Does anyone have any clues, please?

It is starting to really become frustrating and has certainly taken the shine off of the new machine - to the point where I think I’m just not going to bother with it and just use my old 4770K machine instead (which, incidentally, was pretty damn stable).

Sorry for the ramble.

Many thanks for making it this far.

Moley

 

[Plec]

That's a premium spec - is the system clocked (if so remove it to eliminate as possible cause)?

Do you have all the (in my opinion useless) software suites installed which came with your motherboard and card - or have you only installed the latest drivers from Nvidia and chipset from Gigabyte? I suggest keeping your system as lean as possible while experiencing stability issues.

Do you use sleep/hybernate?

Do you run any other third-party monitoring software - antivirus/firewall?

Lastly, do you have a glut of apps running in the background on start up (loop back to hardware suites)?

EDIT: when you did the separate Windows installs did you only have the one drive installed during each install (if using separate drives)?

 

[Moleyman]

Hi

Thank you for taking the time to reply.

The machine does have an overclock profile in the BIOS but I have been running it stock Pretty much since day one.

Basically, when I reinstall the OS I pull the network cable out of the machine, install the OS, install the latest Nvidia driver from Nvidia website, install the INF chipset driver from the Gigabyte website and then the LAN driver also from the Gigabyte website. I don’t install the WiFi or Bluetooth drivers or anything else from the Gigabyte website. I then put the network cable back in the machine and let Windows update itself.

The reason I unplug the network cable is that I found that if I didn’t I couldn’t install the latest Nvidia driver (I got an error measage telling me something like the Nvidia driver isn’t compatible). This turned out to be because the Windows setup had already installed one that it had found so by not having a network connection Windows couldn’t install its version of the problematic Nvidia driver.

I run Malwarebytes Premium with Windows Defender as well as Glasswire.

I do install the iCue software, Logitech Gaming Software and a couple of other bits and pieces of reputable software SabNZB, MakeMKV, to name a couple off the top of my head.

I don’t use Hibernate. I don’t tend to use Sleep all that often but occasionally the machine will go to Sleep, yes.

Again, many thanks,

Moley

 

[Plec]

been running it stock Pretty much since day one.

Enough, to eliminate it as a possible cause for each corruption?

Basically, when I reinstall the OS I pull the network cable out of the machine, install the OS, install the latest Nvidia driver from Nvidia website, install the INF chipset driver from the Gigabyte website and then the LAN driver also from the Gigabyte website. I don’t install the WiFi or Bluetooth drivers or anything else from the Gigabyte website. I then put the network cable back in the machine and let Windows update itself.

The reason I unplug the network cable is that I found that if I didn’t I couldn’t install the latest Nvidia driver (I got an error measage telling me something like the Nvidia driver isn’t compatible). This turned out to be because the Windows setup had already installed one that it had found so by not having a network connection Windows couldn’t install its version of the problematic Nvidia driver.

Sound method - i do similar - Windows 10 is an interfering PITA.

I don’t tend to use Sleep all that often but occasionally the machine will go to Sleep, yes.

When i've run dual boot systems in the past, i've always disabled this feature - admittedly this was when i was trying to convince myself that 10 was better than 7. But, packed component builds (a lot of drives) - such as yours - i've always steered clear of hybernate/sleep with dual boot in operation. That said - i would be surprised if 10 hasn't resolved these issues - but then a corrupt driver/background app may still take issue. Again, maybe worth disabling while troubleshooting/eliminating possible causes.

Are both windows versions on the same drive?

 

[Plec]

EDIT:

I run Malwarebytes Premium with Windows Defender as well as Glasswire.

I do install the iCue software, Logitech Gaming Software and a couple of other bits and pieces of reputable software SabNZB, MakeMKV, to name a couple off the top of my head.

iCue sticks out in that list - i would not install this on your next fresh install, to rule it out as a possible cause. It's appeared a few times as an issue in the Upgrade Advice Forums with new builds - when its been removed issues have resolved (similar for some hardware suites). May not be your issue - but worth investigating.

 

[Moleyman]

Hi again

Re OC - I think so yes. I tried the overclock profile when I first got the machine to make sure it worked etc and then reverted back to the supplied Standard profile which has the XMP profile enabled in it.

Maybe I could try running Optimised Defaults for a while after I update the BIOS to see if that helps?

Re dual booting - they were one separate drives.

The first time I used the 2 x 970 NVMe drives - I honestly can’t remember which one I used for the work and which one I used for the game boot though.

The second time - a couple of weeks ago - I used the 840 Pro as my work boot and the MX500 as the Game boot.

Re iCue software - if I don’t install this then my machine sees the cooler as a H115i Platinum for some reason. It also oddly shows the cooler in the little system tray icon where you can Eject USB devices and it is possible to “eject” the cooler!!! But once the iCue software is installed everything is then correct.

Thanks again

Moley

 

[Plec]

Re OC - I think so yes. I tried the overclock profile when I first got the machine to make sure it worked etc and then reverted back to the supplied Standard profile which has the XMP profile enabled in it.

Is this not your own configured clock - by that i mean is it a pre-built/pre-installed clock?

If so, loading optimised defaults would defiantly be a solid foundation to start on, with your fresh installs.

 

[Moleyman]

Hi

I just edited my reply above to answer your iCue advice.

The machine came with two BIOS profiles - Standard which just seems to be base clocks with XMP enabled and Overclocked which is running at 4.9 with XMP enabled

The machine is plenty fast enough at the moment (when it is working) without the overclock hence running the Standard profile.

Thanks again for taking the time!

Moley

 

[Plec]

The machine came with two BIOS profiles - Standard which just seems to be base clocks with XMP enabled and Overclocked which is running at 4.9 with XMP enabled

You should be advised that you need to save your profiles on to a USB stick as you will lose your profiles if you do decide to flash to the latest BIOS.

Re iCue software - if I don’t install this then my machine sees the cooler as a H115i Platinum for some reason. It also oddly shows th cooler in the little system tray icon where you can Eject USB devices and it is possible to “eject” the cooler!!! But once the iCue software is installed everything is then correct.

From my 'limited use/installing' of Corsair AIOs - i've used the motherboard to control fan curve, so i've not connected the USB and not installed link/iCUE.

 

[Moleyman]

Hi

I’ll definitely back up my profiles before i start. Always a bit nervous updating the BIOS - any other tips or “gotchas” to be aware of? I think my board is a dual BIOS board.

Thanks for your help so far!

Moley

 

[labcoattech]

Personally I would remove everything apart from 1 stick of RAM, 1 boot drive, Re-install Windows and then see if it running stable. From there you can then add one item at a time and see if you get any issues or not.

 

[Plec]

I’ll definitely back up my profiles before i start. Always a bit nervous updating the BIOS - any other tips or “gotchas” to be aware of? I think my board is a dual BIOS

I would perhaps make the retailer you bought the PC from that you're having to flash the BIOS due to stability issues - and there is an IRST update within the F8 update.

And, obviously, be sure to update within the BIOS (Q-Flash) - newly formatted fat 32 pen drive and BIOS etc..

 

[Plec]

Personally I would remove everything apart from 1 stick of RAM, 1 boot drive, Re-install Windows and then see if it running stable. From there you can then add one item at a time and see if you get any issues or not.

Reading the above - running memtestHCI (400%) - would be a useful test while it's stable as your sticks are 'technically' overclocked for the system.

Which is why optimised defaults is a good foundation - but memtest may root out some instabilities...

But the above, will be step you will have to take if the above steps don't resolve things :/

 

[Moleyman]

Ok thanks.

Should I be installing the IRST driver and SATA drivers from the Gigabyte website as well?

I haven’t installed them before?

What actually does the IRST do? And will it update automatically when I do the BIOS update?

Thanks everyone.

Moley

 

[Plec]

I only installed IRST when running RAID (has some useful features - but none of use for your purposes) - which i don't any more thanks to m.2./SSDs etc.. (if you run 'service' - you will see if it's installed, but it shouldn't be)

As for the SATA driver - i suspect windows has taken care of that for you already - any yellow warning exclamation marks within device manager?

 

[Moleyman]

No, no yellow triangles.

The only thing I install from gigabyte is the LAN driver and the INF driver and that’s it.

I then let Windows find and install the rest.

Anything else I should be installing from gigabyte?

Cheers

Moley

 

[DoneADougalOnSofa]

I had a similar issue with 1809. Totally different rig, but nearly identical problem.
Installing the Samsung SATA driver instead of Windows' one solved it. I'd also get into Magician and check firmwares are up to date.

Maybe worth a pop...

Try disabling 'fast boot' in Bios too.

 

[Plec]

Anything else I should be installing from gigabyte?

Personally, i always install the chipset drivers from the manufacturer (and drivers in general) - but lots of members trust Windows to do it.

I only allow critical updates for Windows.

 

[Plec]

I had a similar issue with 1809. Totally different rig, but nearly identical problem.
Installing the Samsung SATA driver instead of Windows' one solved it. I'd also get into Magician and check firmwares are up to date.

Maybe worth a pop...

Good shout - completely forgot about that running through the to do list.

 

[DoneADougalOnSofa]

Think it was iastora.sys that was the culprit, if memory serves...