Petition to sack Chris Packham from BBC

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@Fett I don't really care if they're bred or not, it's the bit about them shooting far more than they can give away or deal with that bothers me.

I'm not going to argue semantics or what constitutes a breeding programme. They are shot yearly in such vast quantities here that they are buried in pits to dispose of the bodies.

You call it "pest control" I call it cruelty in the name of "sport". A lust for death.

Which is an odd mentality for people who consider themselves "conservationists". Toffs, yes. The estate is vast and owned by some multi-millionaire family.

I guess if you have millions in the bank you can call yourself a "conservationist" and go round blowing up the wildlife; nobody is going to stop them.

That's what groups like the "Countryside Alliance" really are. The Toffs Alliance who enjoy bloodsports.

It's difficult to have a conversation if one party cannot answer simple questions and reverts to bland, clichéd responses.

Again, where in Cornwall are grouse shot in their thousands, to the point the are buried in stink pits?

I'll answer for you. There is no such place. There are however estates that breed pheasants and partridges and shoot overly large bags, which I disagree with and will have no part in. But when you want to argue about conservation, shooting etc, it would make more sense to come form an informed platform rather than state inaccuracies. Considering the fight for heathlands between the gamekeepers, Packham and the RSPB...yes, semantics are important and you should at least be talking about the correct game bird.

However, we are diverting away from pest species to game shooting.

What do you think about shooting rats? And the RSPB shooting crows?
 
Caporegime
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I don't know anything about grouse, but they breed pheasants for release here.
Glad you said that - I think I mean pheasants not grouse round our way. It's one or the other ;) Same family anyhow lol.

Not sure where I got grouse from.

Whichever one it is, they shoot them en masse and then (we are very reliably informed from people on the inside), whilst they do their best to sell them, inevitably end up burying many of them in pits. Even after all the shooters have taken as many as they want with them.

Which means the number shot must be horrifically enormous.

They might not be "bred" per se, but there are vast areas of land they are allowed to roam/breed in, much of which belongs to the said estate.

Their numbers are allowed to swell prior to shooting season and then they are killed in vast numbers.

If this was really about "conservation" or "pest control", you wouldn't allow the build-up of the population to levels where it is then necessary to round up a bunch of your mates and their dogs, and have a jolly day out massacring the population.

That's about as close to "conservation" as filling your house with grain, chucking some mice in, and then once a year burning the house down.

Anyone with a brain knows it's about the "sport" and the thrill of blowing some birds brains out of its ass with a high-powered gun. With your dogs and your butler.
 
Caporegime
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It's difficult to have a conversation if one party cannot answer simple questions and reverts to bland, clichéd responses.

Again, where in Cornwall are grouse shot in their thousands, to the point the are buried in stink pits?

I'll answer for you. There is no such place. There are however estates that breed pheasants and partridges and shoot overly large bags, which I disagree with and will have no part in. But when you want to argue about conservation, shooting etc, it would make more sense to come form an informed platform rather than state inaccuracies. Considering the fight for heathlands between the gamekeepers, Packham and the RSPB...yes, semantics are important and you should at least be talking about the correct game bird.

However, we are diverting away from pest species to game shooting.

What do you think about shooting rats? And the RSPB shooting crows?
Yeah I have no idea where I got grouse from. Brain fart. Fairly sure I knew they were pheasants.

But that really doesn't change the situation much does it? Grouse vs pheasants... Not sure it would be possible to be in favour of killing one for sport and not the other...

They're still being slaughtered and then buried in pits.

Whoops I gave the wrong species. How does it change what's happening?

PS It's not like I got a crow confused with a turkey. They're fairly similar birds.
 
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You are confusing game shooting with pest control/shooting. Nothing about the general licenses or Packham have anything to do with game shooting.

You are so far removed from this issue you are now talking about a completely different subject.

This is about 16 types of bird that are considered pests (by DEFRA, Natural England etc), This has absolutely nothing to do with grouse, partridge, wildfowl (bar Canada Geese) or pheasant.
 
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Some of what you said is correct about game shooting, some is not. Numbers do not "swell" before the season. Some gamekeepers get a 30% return on birds put down. You release 10,000 pheasant and partridge...3000 will be shot between October and Feb. Want to guess what happens to to 60% of the remaining 7000? Do you now why game shooting is so expensive?
 
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Grouse are 100% wild, there are no breed and release.The amount of money that gets put back into conservation of the moors from grouse shooting is insane.Some thing most arm chair activist would not have a clue about.But i can asure you them very same arm chair warriors will be the first people to cry a river when they have to pay £5 for a loaf of bread or £10 for their favourite pint of beer, because pigeons have absolutley decemated the crops.
Last year alone we shot well over 30 foxes on the farm, and that didnt even scratch the surface, atleast we saved a few lambs and god know who many chickens.
No blood sports just looking after a livelyhood!!!
 
Caporegime
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Grouse are 100% wild, there are no breed and release.The amount of money that gets put back into conservation of the moors from grouse shooting is insane.Some thing most arm chair activist would not have a clue about.But i can asure you them very same arm chair warriors will be the first people to cry a river when they have to pay £5 for a loaf of bread or £10 for their favourite pint of beer, because pigeons have absolutley decemated the crops.
Last year alone we shot well over 30 foxes on the farm, and that didnt even scratch the surface, atleast we saved a few lambs and god know who many chickens.
No blood sports just looking after a livelyhood!!!
The real pest species is humans.

Shooting animals in order to keep prices of beer low... I've heard it all now.
 
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Anybody who says a grouse is similar to pheasant should really think hard about getting involved in a discussion about shooting birds.
0Bh7bCR
 
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The wood pigeon population has increased by 80% over the last 25 years. They have the ability, in their thousands, to decimate crop seedlings...like no other animal in the UK.

Do you think they have an impact on final yield prices?

@FoxEye , what is your suggestion to curb their appetite?
 
Caporegime
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When you're done editing your post and failing to link an image (here, let me help you: https://www.allaboutbirds.org/guide/browse/taxonomy/Phasianidae# - they're in the same family).

When you're quite done, want to tell me how burying hundreds of pheasants in a hole after your murderous rampage is totally OK because they're not grouse? :p

It's still blood sport; it's still nothing to do with pest control; it's still not conservation.

The Countryside Alliance and friends are liers using "conservation" as a poor excuse to engage in bloodsports.

And - to cap things off nicely - their ideas of "conservation" are often at odds with the scientific community.

But what they normally end up saying is "We're the real experts because we manage the land and the livestock. What can scientists tell us in their labs? We know much better about this "conservation" lark."

I'm forced to watch Countryfile every week so I'm quite well versed on the madness of farmers and their various bodies.
 
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Don't get all salty because you got confused about one of the three main game birds in the UK.

I am reading and answering everything you say, could you do me the same courtesy in this discussion?

Let's forget pheasants, partridges and grouse, this has no bearing on the thread subject really. Burying hundreds of dead birds is not right, in any way, shape or form and I would never defend it. Unfortunately some of the bigger shoots are purely money driven and yes, there are game shooters out there that should not be involved in any of this. They don't shoot sporting birds, they shoot large bags and they shoot birds that they are not capable of killing cleanly. These type of industrial-scale shoots are indefensible.

Back to the topic in hand, the removal of general licenses to shoot pest species (NOT game birds).

I asked a few questions, what do you think of shooting rats? What would you do about the decimation of crops by wood pigeons and their ever-burgeoning population?
 
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And so I don't upset anyone by editing a post:

You thought it laughable that pigeons could have an affect on the price of beer or bread. Do you think our millions of wood pigeons have no affect on the final yield price (of crops)?
 
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Common sense (and contributory evidence) has prevailed, the general licenses to kill pest species are back as of tomorrow:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...eCJyUc-ToTcgDY9bLSqoTr8xX9pHv1U_A1tCxbWg-erro

New licences
General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to conserve wild birds and flora or fauna (GL34)
Species covered: Carrion Crow, jackdaw, jay, magpie, rook, Canada goose, Egyptian goose, monk parakeet, ring-necked parakeet, sacred ibis and Indian house-crow

General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to preserve public health or public safety (GL35)
Species covered: Carrion crow, jackdaw, magpie, feral pigeon, rook, Canada goose and monk parakeet

General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to prevent serious damage to livestock, foodstuffs for livestock, crops, vegetables, fruit, growing timber, fisheries or inland waters (GL36)
Species covered: Carrion crow, jackdaw, magpie, feral pigeon, rook, woodpigeon, Canada goose, Egyptian goose, monk parakeet and ring-necked parakeet

Just a head's up for anybody on here who protects crops, lambs, song birds etc. Looking forward to the weekend.
 
Caporegime
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Common sense (and contributory evidence) has prevailed, the general licenses to kill pest species are back as of tomorrow:

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...eCJyUc-ToTcgDY9bLSqoTr8xX9pHv1U_A1tCxbWg-erro

New licences
General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to conserve wild birds and flora or fauna (GL34)
Species covered: Carrion Crow, jackdaw, jay, magpie, rook, Canada goose, Egyptian goose, monk parakeet, ring-necked parakeet, sacred ibis and Indian house-crow

General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to preserve public health or public safety (GL35)
Species covered: Carrion crow, jackdaw, magpie, feral pigeon, rook, Canada goose and monk parakeet

General licence to kill or take certain species of wild birds to prevent serious damage to livestock, foodstuffs for livestock, crops, vegetables, fruit, growing timber, fisheries or inland waters (GL36)
Species covered: Carrion crow, jackdaw, magpie, feral pigeon, rook, woodpigeon, Canada goose, Egyptian goose, monk parakeet and ring-necked parakeet

Just a head's up for anybody on here who protects crops, lambs, song birds etc. Looking forward to the weekend.
What a sad man. Taking pleasure from killing animals. Pathetic.
 
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Again, you have assumed something incorrectly.

I don't take pleasure in killing anything. However, there is a problem with corvids and wood pigeons that needs addressing. To solve that problem, yes, I am looking forward to trying to redress the balance after the hiatus.

I would be happy to post a video where over 200 lambs gave had their eyes and tongues pecked out by crows on a single farm, just during a short lambing season. The video shows a crow pecking a lambs eyes out, as it is being born. By the time it is halfway out of the sheep, it's died of shock. That's the reality and as I am unsure of rules about that sort of content, until a mod posts it's ok to do so, I'll refrain.

So, am I looking forward to making some sort of impact on the crow, magpie (population up 98% from 30 years ago and is the number 1 UK nest raider of song birds) and wood pigeon population to address a problem? Yes. Do I enjoy killing anything? No.
 
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