Driving a lamborghini huracan with no MOT!

Soldato
Joined
27 Mar 2013
Posts
9,121
A "free" system that requires you to posees a piece of techology that has a significant monthly cost attached to it is not "Free" (And nor is it universal either)

I know many people who either do not have mobile phones at all or only switch them on if they are actually wanting to use them to make a call.

(I also know several people who are not connected to the internet. They use mine for browsing but they do not have an e-maill address as such, so that "Free" option does not apply for them either)

I'm going to assume these people are 50+? A mobile is dirt cheap, you could get one for under 30 quid and if it's not a smart phone, it won't need charging up that often.
 
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Oct 2002
Posts
29,074
Location
Ottakring, Vienna.
A "free" system that requires you to posees a piece of techology that has a significant monthly cost attached to it is not "Free" (And nor is it universal either)
It's free. Just because some people are not capable of receiving it, does not affect it's "freeness"

If the system shouted the reminders for free over a loud hailer and deaf people could not hear it, this would not negate the fact that said reminder service was free.
 
Soldato
Joined
2 Aug 2012
Posts
7,809
That is an excellent analogy.


I didn't just say free however, I also said "Universal"

A government provided service that failed to provide for deaf people because they are deaf would likley fall foul of various anti-discrimination laws.

As I said, Is owning a mobile phone/having an internet account now a legal requirement?

The State can not claim to be providing a "Free" (Or "Universal") service to help people to meet their legal requirements if it isnt actually doing so because some people do not happen to have optional (And paid for) gadgets in their lives.

As for the idea that "People should just be better organised"

This actually strikes home particularly in my case.

Some people just arnt, and there is little that they can do about it in practice.

In particular, there are more people than you might realise who are functionally illiterate.(Even, and in particular, a lot of otherwise very smart people. The whole point about "Dyslexia" is that you have a subset of people who do very well indeed at the non-verbal aspects of IQ tests and other tests of objective intelligence but nevertheless do rather dismally at the verbal aspects of such tests)

Again, If you have the top 5% or so of smart educated and highly literate people creating systems that the entire rest of the population are just handed and expected to cope with. One shouldn't be too surprised when a significant minority fail to do so.

To my mind, one of the most important functions in a modern state should be to try to make legal compliance by citizens as easy and simple as possible.

Unfortunately, they typically heap complexity on top of complexity. And then it doesn't work properly anyway!

(See my other thread on how I seem unable to SORN a New-Old car because the DVLA system, despite having issued me a new V5 in my name, doesn't recognize that I am the new owner! (And WTF is the point of SORN anyway? It is just another useless layer of totally unnecessary paperwork to burden peoples lives who already have to endure far too much! :mad:))

Grumble-Grumble!
 
Soldato
Joined
2 Aug 2012
Posts
7,809
Tell us more about the significant monthly cost attached to a payg mobile.

If you are somebody living on a >£700/month pension, who walks 3 miles to the shops to avoid paying for petrol and parking charges, then a mobile phone, even a PAYG one is a significant additional expenditure.

It may be "Only" a couple of pounds a month. But all those "Couple of pounds a month" add up and one can easily end up on the wrong side of Micawbers Shilling if one doesn't keep an eye on it.

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.

It seems that you simply do not comprehend what it is like to live on a very limited budget. And millions of people do!

(She actually lives quite well, but only because she eliminates "unnecessary" expenditure right down to the very last penny. I have another friend who doesn't have either internet or a mobile who hasn't heated her flat in ten years. When she is flush she lights a coal fire. But her budget cannot sustain "Regular" monthly subscription-world type expenditures either)
 
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Oct 2002
Posts
159,534
It may be "Only" a couple of pounds a month. But all those "Couple of pounds a month" add up

If pay as you go mobile with a minimum £10 a year topup is beyond someones means then so too is running a car.

If you really can't manage a phone you can always just remember when your MOT is due. It's printed on paper for you.
 
Soldato
Joined
17 Dec 2009
Posts
10,254
It's one thing stopping a car with no MOT, but I know my local police force has turned round and said to stop reporting stationary cars with no MOT to them because they do not have the resources to deal with them. They will only stop cars being driven with no MOT, same with no tax, its a DVLA issue not a Police matter.

Apparently a load of people were walking around their neighbourhood streets checking cars because parking is such an issue in central Bristol, and they hoped that they could get some removed and free up some space so they could park closer to their homes, and then got all "but I pay tax!!!! its illllleeeeggaaaalllll!!!" when the police said "sorry, we are a bit busy dealing with Murder, Rape, and Burglary and haven't got the resources to properly Police those things at the moment"
 
Soldato
Joined
22 Nov 2006
Posts
23,304
It's one thing stopping a car with no MOT, but I know my local police force has turned round and said to stop reporting stationary cars with no MOT to them because they do not have the resources to deal with them. They will only stop cars being driven with no MOT, same with no tax, its a DVLA issue not a Police matter.

Apparently a load of people were walking around their neighbourhood streets checking cars because parking is such an issue in central Bristol, and they hoped that they could get some removed and free up some space so they could park closer to their homes, and then got all "but I pay tax!!!! its illllleeeeggaaaalllll!!!" when the police said "sorry, we are a bit busy dealing with Murder, Rape, and Burglary and haven't got the resources to properly Police those things at the moment"

Thats basically is like a green light to just not bother with the MOT :/

Someone left a broken, SORNed car on the road near where I live and it took about 2 years for the DVLA (or possibly council) to get on to the owner. They never actually sent someone to look afaik, just kept sending them letters.

Apparently if they are in a "dangerous state", i.e window smashed and glass everywhere. They are a lot more hot on it due to health and safety ;)
 
Last edited:
Man of Honour
Joined
25 Oct 2002
Posts
31,707
Location
Hampshire
There is no reminder system for MOT's and even the tax thing is a lot easier to forget than it used to be.

Incidence of "Untaxed" vehicles rocketed in the aftermath of going paperless, and this cannot possibly be simply because, overnight, hundreds of thousands of people suddenly decided to evade their tax liabilities.

Government delights in creating systems that simply do not work for ordinary people out in the real world! And then blaming the "Victims" of unworkable bureaucracies for the governments own stupidity and lack of imagination.

:mad:

There is a reminder system, you just have to sign-up for it: https://www.gov.uk/mot-reminder
In this day and age numerous things are done without paper reminders, I think some insurance is even paperless now.

As for the untaxed vehicles scenario, I don't think one can pin that solely on a move to paperless, as it coincided with a much more fundamental change to how vehicle tax works, whereby you don't transfer tax to the new owner when a vehicle is sold. I reckon even with a paper tax disc still in force we'd still have seen a rise in untaxed vehicles due to this.
 
Associate
Joined
28 Jul 2004
Posts
1,863
It's one thing stopping a car with no MOT, but I know my local police force has turned round and said to stop reporting stationary cars with no MOT to them because they do not have the resources to deal with them. They will only stop cars being driven with no MOT, same with no tax, its a DVLA issue not a Police matter.

Apparently a load of people were walking around their neighbourhood streets checking cars because parking is such an issue in central Bristol, and they hoped that they could get some removed and free up some space so they could park closer to their homes, and then got all "but I pay tax!!!! its illllleeeeggaaaalllll!!!" when the police said "sorry, we are a bit busy dealing with Murder, Rape, and Burglary and haven't got the resources to properly Police those things at the moment"

What's the point of the bit in yellow?
 
Soldato
Joined
12 Jul 2007
Posts
16,316
Location
South East
Thought I'd chime in along with the other eleventy people and say that the MOT website is always instant with its updates in my experience. I've actually sat in garage waiting rooms and been able to check before someone has wandered over to me to say my car's done!
 
Back
Top Bottom