Is this OLED screen-burn worth bothering about?

[Shimmyhill]

That's blue OLEDs. Blue OLEDs are less efficient than green or red which is why the blue subpixels are larger on samsung oled panels, for example, as they need to be driven with a higher current to match the luminescence of the other two. However, that doesnt apply to LG's TV OLED panels as they dont used coloured OLEDs - they use White OLEDs with coloured filters on top. White OLEDs last longer but the use of filters also leads to lower luminescence which is why LG's TV panels have a 4th subpixel which is pure white to boost brightness. The subpixels are still different sizes, but that's more to do with colour accuracy than lifespan.

2 years isnt any age for a TV, id absolutely expect it to be tip top

Samsung don’t make any OLED screens...

I have a B8 OLED and it’s hammered for games, thousands of hours and lots of Fortnite and no retention, same for YouTube - it has been properly setup mind and it was the same for plasma, almost 20 years of plasmas with no retention or burn in!

I have zero concerns about burn/retention on OLED and while there is a minor risk I’d much rather take that than live with an LCD.

Having looked at my settings I’m running isf expert dark room with OLED light at 54, brightness 50 on SD/HD - 100 seems madness outside of HDR and one HDR mode (poss DV) shouldn’t be on 100 either!

 

[MrRockliffe]

100% brightness is required for HDR and even then OLEd is up to only half as bright as the best LED panels.

Humans generally don't perceive brightness as max lumen output, but the contrast. Hence why a solar eclipse is quite dangerous - the sun doesn't get brighter, but because your eyes have adjusted to the darker environment, the sun seems brighter.

The accuracy of the HDR on OLEDs is what makes it look fantastic, even if the peak brightness isn't the same level as an LCD with FALD.

I have mine at 35 OLED brightness, which is plenty for my room during the day. For gaming, I move it up to 45, just to help me become a little more immersed.

I absolutely love my B8 - it's hands down the best purchase I've made in the last 5 years. Having a perfectly black display in the dark is awesome too

 

[MrRockliffe]

Samsung don’t make any OLED screens

They do for phones, which is what I assume he's talking about

https://www.sammobile.com/2017/04/20/samsung-galaxy-s8-detailed-screen-analysis/

 

[Grim5]

Humans generally don't perceive brightness as max lumen output, but the contrast. Hence why a solar eclipse is quite dangerous - the sun doesn't get brighter, but because your eyes have adjusted to the darker environment, the sun seems brighter.

The accuracy of the HDR on OLEDs is what makes it look fantastic, even if the peak brightness isn't the same level as an LCD with FALD.

I have mine at 35 OLED brightness, which is plenty for my room during the day. For gaming, I move it up to 45, just to help me become a little more immersed.

I absolutely love my B8 - it's hands down the best purchase I've made in the last 5 years. Having a perfectly black display in the dark is awesome too

Correct however as I have my panel in a bright room it does need to get bright otherwise the reflections can get bad

With HDR my panel defaults to max brightness if I drop the brightness it starts making the contrast look worse too

My panel has a peak brightness of 1400 lumens according to Rtings. I’ve not measured it but if it’s in SDR and I put the brightness and lights to max it’s so bright that I can turn the bulbs in the room off because the TV is brighter than the light bulbs - however I will never do this in day to day use, it’s like looking into the sun and my eyes literally start hurting instantly

 

[james.miller]

Samsung don’t make any OLED screens...

Samsung make more OLED panels than anybody else. They just don't make TV panels.

 

[Shimmyhill]

They do for phones, which is what I assume he's talking about

https://www.sammobile.com/2017/04/20/samsung-galaxy-s8-detailed-screen-analysis/

No point comparing mobile screen tech to tellies.

Correct however as I have my panel in a bright room it does need to get bright otherwise the reflections can get bad

With HDR my panel defaults to max brightness if I drop the brightness it starts making the contrast look worse too

My panel has a peak brightness of 1400 lumens according to Rtings. I’ve not measured it but if it’s in SDR and I put the brightness and lights to max it’s so bright that I can turn the bulbs in the room off because the TV is brighter than the light bulbs

You’re comparing a tech that can’t do absolute black to one that can, no point comparing lumens for lumens when the scale is different. OLED HDR is generally more accurate and can be retina burning bright and what you are doing is compensating for poor lighting conditions and knocking the accuracy of the image out further - that is of course fine and something you have to do due to lighting, I don’t like watching anything that I care about in anything other than a dark room!

 

[MrRockliffe]

No point comparing mobile screen tech to tellies.

Why not? The technology is the same, just a different pixel matrix. It's still an OLED

 

[200sols]

Samsung make more OLED screens than anybody else. They just don't make TV panels.

They did for a while, then realised the tech was not fit for mainstream release.

 

[MrRockliffe]

Correct however as I have my panel in a bright room it does need to get bright otherwise the reflections can get bad

That's another benefit of OLED - much stronger contrast in sunlight, and hence, reflection handling. You get all the benefits of a glossy display without the horrendous reflections

 

[Grim5]

They did for a while, then realised the tech was not fit for mainstream release.

Samsung is working on its own OLED TVs still, I forget the name but it’s a different type to LG and when/if they release it will be an oled panel that is not weak to burn in. The other thing they’re working on is Microled

Edit: Sammy’s version is called Quantum Dot OLED or QDOLED for short, promises LED brightness level and no burn in

 

[200sols]

Samsung is working on its own OLED TVs still, I forget the name but it’s a different type to LG and when/if they release it will be an oled panel that is not weak to burn in. The other thing they’re working on is Microled

Think they are working on a hybrid actually, something like QD-OLED they called it. But they cant eliminate the issues with OLED so its been pushed back further again last time I heard anything about it.

 

[Shimmyhill]

Why not? The technology is the same, just a different pixel matrix. It's still an OLED

They aren’t the same tho, completely different use cases - Samsung are on record saying they couldn’t make a large OLED screen with the tech used in phone screens.

Sony make a reference grade OLED panel around 20” and again can’t make a full sized one, don’t be fooled by think8ng that because it’s oled it’s the same - do you think that all LCD panels are the same?

They did for a while, then realised the tech was not fit for mainstream release.

They couldn’t make panels, they bet the farm on LCD much like Sony and Panasonic who are customers of LG now for their top tier products. It’s laughable that you say garbage like ‘the tech was not fit for mainstream release’ again I assume you feel the same about LCD and still run a CRT such is your demand for new tech to better old....

 

[james.miller]

Not really sure where you are trying to go with this shimmyhill. I mentioned Samsung's oleds because they use different sized sub pixels. Check the post I replied to and you'll see reply was in context.

Also, it's well known samsung couldn't scale that tech up for TV panels - LG couldn't either, which is why they use white subpixels. Again, my reply was in context. So what point are you trying to make?

 

[Shimmyhill]

Not really sure where you are trying to go with this shimmyhill. I mentioned Samsung's oleds because they use different sized sub pixels. Check the post I replied to and you'll see reply was in context.

Also, it's well known samsung couldn't scale that tech up for TV panels - LG couldn't either, which is why they use white subpixels. Again, my reply was in context. So what point are you trying to make?

It’s not really at you, it’s the whole argument that people are making in here about Samsung binning off OLED for LCD as if they decided one was better than the other - they hit a tech impasse and gave up putting all efforts into LCD, the fact they make small OLED screens for premium products tells you all you need to know about what tech is ‘better’

 

[jpaul]

They aren’t the same tho, completely different use cases - Samsung are on record saying they couldn’t make a large OLED screen with the tech used in phone screens.

there can be the cynical viewpoint, that managing burn-in/ageing is a significant reason why Samsung abandoned the TV oled market - they did not think an economic product could be built, but, that on the mobile market, they are less concerned by that constraint.

some of the mobile oled sub-pixel choice is to help with power reduction too, since, with addtional sub-pixels you can make slightly less accurate colours with significant power reduction.
- not sure, but is oled thinner than led (easier to integrate touch too?) such that oled is ultimately more cost-effective for mobile phones, but is currently sold as a premium, so bigger profits.

That's another benefit of OLED - much stronger contrast in sunlight, and hence, reflection handling. You get all the benefits of a glossy display without the horrendous reflections

not sure what you mean - they have the contrast, but not the brightness(also abl) to fully exploit that in high sunlight; the oled has the wide viewing angle, but the reflections are just down to anti-reflective layers, as opposed to something native about the technology.
[quick google https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-o...nels-general/2970154-reflections-lg-oled.html
The "picture on glass" models (E, G) do reflect more light than the B and C models. I have a C and unless there is a light source directly hitting the screen, I have no noticeable reflections. ]

 

[MrRockliffe]

They aren’t the same tho, completely different use cases - Samsung are on record saying they couldn’t make a large OLED screen with the tech used in phone screens.

Technology can be the same without having the same implementation. Sony make pro level stuff because there's more financial incentive to do so, same with Samsung. They spew out considerably more displays for mobiles, so they can invest more money in implementation and manufacturing methods, however the fundamental technology, i.e. how it works and pros & cons, are the same.

Same with an LCD - fundamentally, they're the same - a layer of liquid crystals, and in the case of a LED backlit model, has light produced by LEDs that shine through the layer. The amount of light is controlled by these crystals, which change orientation based on varying voltages. The panel type (IPS, TN) only builds upon this concept.

Samsung are heavily invested in LCD technology, and with LG throwing tonnes of cash at OLED development, there's little to no point doing it themselves.


Ultimately, there are pros and cons of each display type; as a consumer, it's up to you to understand them. No technology is inherently "better" - it depends on use case. But on the whole, OLED is a more advanced technology, which offers greater visual fidelity (hence why, as you mentioned above, Sony produce them for professional environments).

OLED suffers with permanent image retention - yes, but it's due to the nature of the technology. The pixels are made from organic material, and each pixel will wear at a different rate, especially so if displaying static content. With the right settings, and proper precautions, you can avoid it.

LCD can suffer with permanent image retention - I've seen it happen, but its FAR less common. However, you have other downsides to consider that affect the viewing experience, such as IPS glow, backlight bleed, clouding... I went through a number of LCDs that ALL had varying problems, but my OLED is flawless, but over the course of 5 years, it MAY experience burn in, during which time I'll send it back for a replacement.

 

[MrRockliffe]

not sure what you mean - they have the contrast, but not the brightness(also abl) to fully exploit that in high sunlight; the oled has the wide viewing angle, but the reflections are just down to anti-reflective layers, as opposed to something native about the technology.
[quick google https://www.avsforum.com/forum/40-o...nels-general/2970154-reflections-lg-oled.html
The "picture on glass" models (E, G) do reflect more light than the B and C models. I have a C and unless there is a light source directly hitting the screen, I have no noticeable reflections. ]

It won't remove a reflection in the sense of not seeing it, but the washed out effect you see due to poorer black levels on an LCD aren't as apparent. You do, of course, then have brightness limitations, as you described, but on the whole, OLEDs deal with reflections much better during my time working for JL (i.e. with multiple bright lights around the store).

 

[TheVoice]

100% brightness is required for HDR and even then OLEd is up to only half as bright as the best LED panels.

I know, that's why I said SDR.

I do plenty of gaming on mine, it's been fine.

They did for a while, then realised the tech was not fit for mainstream release.

That hasn't stopped Samsung before.

 

[james.miller]

It’s not really at you, it’s the whole argument that people are making in here about Samsung binning off OLED for LCD as if they decided one was better than the other - they hit a tech impasse and gave up putting all efforts into LCD

Well, when you are talking about TV-sized panels, they are one and the same thing. Im not sure anybody said anything about LCd being a better technology, but clearly it was better suited for large panels than the OLED they were producing for mobiles were.

the fact they make small OLED screens for premium products tells you all you need to know about what tech is ‘better’

You'll have to explain that one, it doesnt tell me anything other than Sasmung cant make (their) Oled panels viable for large format displays.

 

[juno_first]

Simply put, LCD if in a bright room or OLED for a darker room & better quality. It's a headache running an OLED as a main TV though... always trying prevent static images.
How about a regular LCD but in front of the backlight another LCD, perhaps just B&W with each pixel able to vary its transparency, call it the light filter LCD. Heck, maybe have 2 of these filter LCD's to get that pure black but allow 4000nits. To remove FALD glow around highlights set the pixels closest to the highlight to be darker. With some clever software wizardry it would work.