Virgin Media Discussion Thread

Soldato
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Good to see this fixed. I wonder if the same software issue might have been causing your lower than expected VPN speeds, too (in the other thread). Be interesting to see if you get achieve more than a couple of Mbps now.

So I have just tested downloading the same Ubuntu ISO without a VPN: 45.6 MiB/s avg

Then with IPVanish: 1.3 MiB/s avg

So as you can see...despite getting top speeds (now) at all times...I am sceptical about VM not throttling VPN. Closed IPVanish whilst still downloading and speeds were up to 57 MiB/s again! I have experienced the same with NordVPN and ExpressVPN (Although not to the same extent!)
 
Soldato
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I am sceptical about VM not throttling VPN.

I posted speed tests from half a dozen different VPN configs (WireGuard, OpenVPN, both together at the same time) in the other thread showing you I get >500Mbps on them all. Many other VM customers with appropriate setups get full speed also. If you want to blame VM and forget it, go ahead - but that doesn't make it correct. They (VM) are awful for a number of reasons, but throttling VPN traffic isn't one of them. You never answered the last time I asked, but what hardware and software are you using? What VPN config? Did you bother to test WireGuard (or even just a proper OpenVPN config) under Linux to rule out Windows (which is pretty awful for VPN anyway)? Have you tried IKEv2? Have you tried a less awful provider (the big names tend to use VPS and are oversubscribed)? If you want to actually fix it feel free to continue in your other thread, but if not it's a little disingenuous to keep repeating the 'VM throttle' line when it's been clearly shown that they don't.
8251464280.png
 
Soldato
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I posted speed tests from half a dozen different VPN configs (WireGuard, OpenVPN, both together at the same time) in the other thread showing you I get >500Mbps on them all. Many other VM customers with appropriate setups get full speed also. If you want to blame VM and forget it, go ahead - but that doesn't make it correct. They (VM) are awful for a number of reasons, but throttling VPN traffic isn't one of them. You never answered the last time I asked, but what hardware and software are you using? What VPN config? Did you bother to test WireGuard (or even just a proper OpenVPN config) under Linux to rule out Windows (which is pretty awful for VPN anyway)? Have you tried IKEv2? Have you tried a less awful provider (the big names tend to use VPS and are oversubscribed)? If you want to actually fix it feel free to continue in your other thread, but if not it's a little disingenuous to keep repeating the 'VM throttle' line when it's been clearly shown that they don't.
8251464280.png

I'm genuinely pleased for you :)

So yes, I shall blame VM and forget it.

P.S. Why don't you share with us what the 'appropriate setup' and 'hardware' is to achieve such speeds on VM.
 
Soldato
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I'm genuinely pleased for you :)

So yes, I shall blame VM and forget it.

P.S. Why don't you share with us what the 'appropriate setup' and 'hardware' is to achieve such speeds on VM.

Why blame VM and forget it instead of trying to fix it? It clearly bothers you because you keep posting about it, yet you never take on any offers to help you address it. That's the part I don't get. :p

I've shared my methods several times on here in various threads, including one on building your own router and setting it up with Linux, WireGuard and policy based routing. You only have to ask. Appropriate setup is mostly:
  • a fast CPU (high frequency single core for openvpn, many cores for WireGuard).
  • Linux and WireGuard, or a high end setup with tweaked OpenVPN with large MTU/Tunnel MSS to run the actual VPN (whether on router or per device).
  • No system bottlenecks (slow drives, high latency RAM or buses, low bus speeds, too little PCIe bandwidth, using PCI instead of PCIe NICs, using a non-Intel NIC etc).
On Windows about the only really high performing VPN protocol is IKEv2 but that's 'because Windows' not due to the VM or the VPN protocol directly. Windows has no kernel space acceleration available for most VPN protocols (including OpenVPN) and hence suffers poor speeds directly proportional to the hardware's ability to process in software - usually not in real time and certainly not at wire speed.

To make any real progress you need a decent Linux setup, a dedicated Intel NIC (Realtek and Killer are pretty crippled in comparison), the SH3 needs to be in modem mode and ideally you either implement a proper x86 Linux or BSD based router, or at least a decent ASIC/MIPS based one (depending on where you're hosting the VPN).

The VM connection is capable, you just need beefy hardware and software to take advantage of it. At half a gigabit plus you can't just plug in any old crap and expect it to work flawlessly, especially when dealing with something as complex as wirespeed on-the-fly encryption and decryption. Certainly there's nothing off the shelf that can or will do it. You're into x86 and enterprise/datacentre level networking. If you only want per-device VPN rather than a capable router then obviously speeds are dependent on that device, but it's easily possible to saturate 500Mbps on most modern x86 hardware as long as you're careful (i.e. only IKEv2 for Windows, using WireGuard in preference to OpenVPN, not relying on a mobo integrated NIC etc).

As I said if you wanted to have a go at fixing it, there are people who would happily help you back in your dedicated thread. If you want to troubleshoot and get your speeds back closer to where they should be, post up your hardware specs and network topology and equipment (NIC, drivers, OS, cabling, switch, router etc) in the other thread and we'll have a look at it for you.

ETA: My own setup as I've discussed before, is:

SFF Dell Optiplex 7010 (Core i7 3770, 8GB DDR3, SSD) with an Intel server quad port NIC (Intel Pro 1000PT). The four ports are in a PCIe x4 slot (it's a x4 card) and run WAN, LAN1 and LAN2 (DMZ/clearnet/servers). All cat5e to a Netgear ProSafe capless switch running cat5e to individual clients. I have a PoE switch for the LAN2/server net which has a Unifi UAP AC Pro feeding untrusted wifi clients on a separate VLAN. The router runs WireGuard and routes all LAN1 traffic through that VPN, while LAN2 gets passed directly through VM. Full speed on all devices, as the VPN/router is only running a barebones CLI install of Arch and Wireguard (with dnscrypt-proxy, dhcpd4 and shorewall). It uses 80MB RAM at idle and average load is 0.01 to 0.1. It uses 15 to 20% CPU under full load (530Mbps over WireGuard VPN), with HT disabled thanks to yet more Intel vulnerabilities.
 
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Soldato
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They are moving to DS Lite because Liberty are weird, so they're slapping carrier-grade NAT on IPv4 at the same time as they give you IPv6. Expect their CPE hardware to handle it incredibly poorly and it to take several years to resolve (see: static IP performance on business cable services).

Ack. That doesn't sound good. Although I do have a static IP address on their business plan and can't say I've noticed a lot of problems with it. Hopefully, it won't be that bad.
 
Soldato
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Why blame VM and forget it instead of trying to fix it? It clearly bothers you because you keep posting about it, yet you never take on any offers to help you address it. That's the part I don't get. :p

I've shared my methods several times on here in various threads, including one on building your own router and setting it up with Linux, WireGuard and policy based routing. You only have to ask. Appropriate setup is mostly:
  • a fast CPU (high frequency single core for openvpn, many cores for WireGuard).
  • Linux and WireGuard, or a high end setup with tweaked OpenVPN with large MTU/Tunnel MSS to run the actual VPN (whether on router or per device).
  • No system bottlenecks (slow drives, high latency RAM or buses, low bus speeds, too little PCIe bandwidth, using PCI instead of PCIe NICs, using a non-Intel NIC etc).
On Windows about the only really high performing VPN protocol is IKEv2 but that's 'because Windows' not due to the VM or the VPN protocol directly. Windows has no kernel space acceleration available for most VPN protocols (including OpenVPN) and hence suffers poor speeds directly proportional to the hardware's ability to process in software - usually not in real time and certainly not at wire speed.

To make any real progress you need a decent Linux setup, a dedicated Intel NIC (Realtek and Killer are pretty crippled in comparison), the SH3 needs to be in modem mode and ideally you either implement a proper x86 Linux or BSD based router, or at least a decent ASIC/MIPS based one (depending on where you're hosting the VPN).

The VM connection is capable, you just need beefy hardware and software to take advantage of it. At half a gigabit plus you can't just plug in any old crap and expect it to work flawlessly, especially when dealing with something as complex as wirespeed on-the-fly encryption and decryption. Certainly there's nothing off the shelf that can or will do it. You're into x86 and enterprise/datacentre level networking. If you only want per-device VPN rather than a capable router then obviously speeds are dependent on that device, but it's easily possible to saturate 500Mbps on most modern x86 hardware as long as you're careful (i.e. only IKEv2 for Windows, using WireGuard in preference to OpenVPN, not relying on a mobo integrated NIC etc).

As I said if you wanted to have a go at fixing it, there are people who would happily help you back in your dedicated thread. If you want to troubleshoot and get your speeds back closer to where they should be, post up your hardware specs and network topology and equipment (NIC, drivers, OS, cabling, switch, router etc) in the other thread and we'll have a look at it for you.

ETA: My own setup as I've discussed before, is:

SFF Dell Optiplex 7010 (Core i7 3770, 8GB DDR3, SSD) with an Intel server quad port NIC (Intel Pro 1000PT). The four ports are in a PCIe x4 slot (it's a x4 card) and run WAN, LAN1 and LAN2 (DMZ/clearnet/servers). All cat5e to a Netgear ProSafe capless switch running cat5e to individual clients. I have a PoE switch for the LAN2/server net which has a Unifi UAP AC Pro feeding untrusted wifi clients on a separate VLAN. The router runs WireGuard and routes all LAN1 traffic through that VPN, while LAN2 gets passed directly through VM. Full speed on all devices, as the VPN/router is only running a barebones CLI install of Arch and Wireguard (with dnscrypt-proxy, dhcpd4 and shorewall). It uses 80MB RAM at idle and average load is 0.01 to 0.1. It uses 15 to 20% CPU under full load (530Mbps over WireGuard VPN), with HT disabled thanks to yet more Intel vulnerabilities.

Thank you that is very insightful and impressive.

My Hardware (for the sake of completion):
i7-6700K
Gigabyte Z170x Gaming 7 mboard
Samsung NVMe 970 evo (512 Gb)
980ti
Win10 Pro

Network setup:
Cat5e cable to all wired devices
VM SH3 (router mode / wireless disabled) --> Wired ethernet --> Killer E2400
VM SH3 --> Unifi 8 port switch (US-8-60W) --> AP LITE / NanoHD
Current VPN provider: iPVanish (using IKEv2 protocol)

This setup on BT (using their superhub) does not treat VPNs the same way as (what I presume you are suggesting is the SH3s fault) the VM router. As I have said before on BT I get full download speeds through this hardware/VPN setup. I can see you have blamed Windows for my lack of speed (and clearly that was the problem affecting my non-VPN speed) but Win10 seemed to handle download speeds much better on BT than VM...so that doesn't really make sense.

I guess what you are saying is using the VM equipment will indirectly slow your speeds down when using a VPN, which in my book still makes it a VM problem, not mine. I shouldn't need to fork out another £500 on a new router, switches, dedicated PC to run Linux etc just to maximise speeds on VM (or is that appropriate?).

The latest Intel NIC I could buy for a decent price (which will shortly be returned - unless someone can convince me it is worth keeping) was the Intel PRO/1000 CT (EXPI9301CTBLK) from back in 2016.

Also, please check the other VPN VM thread, I did not start that thread, @RobTi suffering the same did.

I seriously do not have time nor the inclination to take the steps and associated costs to justify getting these speeds. Also, truth be told, I don't have the knowledge and insights that you obviously have into Wireguard (and associated protocols).

EDIT- I have just been messing around with settings on the SH3....looking up other threads..tweaking software settings and protocols...using IPVanish now able to download the same Ubuntu ISO image with VPN at 25 MiB/s - so some serious progress! Definitely a lot better than what I was getting!

And so yes I must admit that I was wrong...VM are not throttling VPN traffic...just providing rubbish hardware that needs serious setting up to get any speed out of it!
 
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Kol

Kol

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EDIT- I have just been messing around with settings on the SH3....looking up other threads..tweaking software settings and protocols...using IPVanish now able to download the same Ubuntu ISO image with VPN at 25 MiB/s - so some serious progress! Definitely a lot better than what I was getting!

Out of interest, in case anyone else has issues what did you change in the end mate? Fair that you highlighted it and followed up, too. Please to hear there's been some improvement.
 
Soldato
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Out of interest, in case anyone else has issues what did you change in the end mate? Fair that you highlighted it and followed up, too. Please to hear there's been some improvement.

So the settings I changed were the following:

Checked VPN was using IKEv2 - which it was.
SH3 - disabled IPV4 Firewall (this made the biggest difference)
Tweaks to QBittorrent:

Connection > protocol > TCP only
Connection > (change port to match VPN port)
Connection > untick all limits

Hope that helps.
 
Associate
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Anyone been getting terrible speeds?

Last week or two i've noticed i've been getting 10-21mbit/s vs the usual 200-220mbit/s

Tested everything i can think of so don't think its anything my end i left it a bit since it hadn't bothered me and i expected it to of changed up by now.


Another long boring wait in CS i guess.
 
Associate
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My speeds since Christmas have been all over the place, that plus Virgin wanting to charge me more than a new customer is why I'm going back to FTTC. Yes it's not as fast but I just want a stable connection and I'm not willing to pay Virgin £49 a month for Vivid 350 and not get 350 :(
 
Soldato
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Here we are...basically ended up just 'resetting the PC' - reinstalling windows 10 whilst keeping my files.


So after your tantrum in your Virgin VPN thread because it was repeatedly pointed out it was likely an issue your end and nothing to do with the ISP... it was an issue your end and nothing to do with the ISP. You’re welcome :D
 
Soldato
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Anyone been getting terrible speeds?

Last week or two i've noticed i've been getting 10-21mbit/s vs the usual 200-220mbit/s

Tested everything i can think of so don't think its anything my end i left it a bit since it hadn't bothered me and i expected it to of changed up by now.


Another long boring wait in CS i guess.

Only thing I can suggest is to be persistent. I've been having problems for ages but it wasn't until I actually got a decent diligent engineer who cared about doing a good job that it actually got solved.

Would also suggest setting up a thinkbroadband monitor: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/quality/create
 
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Only thing I can suggest is to be persistent. I've been having problems for ages but it wasn't until I actually got a decent diligent engineer who cared about doing a good job that it actually got solved.

Would also suggest setting up a thinkbroadband monitor: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/quality/create

Spoke to them this morning via web chat. They did something to the line it worked. 2mins later back to 10mbit/s. So another webchat and this time its been almost full speed but not quite. They seem to be getting worse as they claw more customers and the load on the cabinets gets too much. I suspect many people are having lower speeds and just not noticing and VM are getting away with it.

Just checked and again i am getting 10mbit/s

They won't compensate you either as its within guidelines.

What a joke.
 
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Virgin Media complaints department may's well not exist.
Pretty sure he told me to shut up at one point as well, but I couldn't actually understand it (As bad as it sounds, but at least it's coming from me, a half caste).
 
Soldato
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Spoke to them this morning via web chat. They did something to the line it worked. 2mins later back to 10mbit/s. So another webchat and this time its been almost full speed but not quite. They seem to be getting worse as they claw more customers and the load on the cabinets gets too much. I suspect many people are having lower speeds and just not noticing and VM are getting away with it.

Just checked and again i am getting 10mbit/s

They won't compensate you either as its within guidelines.

What a joke.

Live chat is a waste of time, get them on the phone. Being passive about it won't get you anywhere, phone them up and get it sorted. Do the obvious stuff like checking all the connections inside and out are tight and sound. Factory reset the superhub using the reset button for 60 seconds and then power cycle it. Do your troubleshooting first so you can say upfront you've tried X Y Z and that'll speed the call up.

If however you don't have the time to phone them I've found posting the signal numbers (http://192.168.0.1 / http://192.168.100.1 and then "Check router status") on their community forums can help. There are some really knowledgeable people on there that will help work out whats wrong. There are staff members on there that will eventually get to you and PM if there is a issue. The 3rd post here is a good quick reference on levels but the second post is much more in depth: https://community.virginmedia.com/t...e-Power-Level-dBmV-and-RxMER-dB/td-p/3669431#
 
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Live chat is a waste of time, get them on the phone. Being passive about it won't get you anywhere, phone them up and get it sorted. Do the obvious stuff like checking all the connections inside and out are tight and sound. Factory reset the superhub using the reset button for 60 seconds and then power cycle it. Do your troubleshooting first so you can say upfront you've tried X Y Z and that'll speed the call up.

If however you don't have the time to phone them I've found posting the signal numbers (http://192.168.0.1 / http://192.168.100.1 and then "Check router status") on their community forums can help. There are some really knowledgeable people on there that will help work out whats wrong. There are staff members on there that will eventually get to you and PM if there is a issue. The 3rd post here is a good quick reference on levels but the second post is much more in depth: https://community.virginmedia.com/t...e-Power-Level-dBmV-and-RxMER-dB/td-p/3669431#


Yeah great info i was looking at router settings just before this! After 4 attempts with web chat i gave up they just read from a script and use something called "Einstein" to check your router they stated there are too many devices connected to the router. Well they have been there since i had the service installed and never once had any issues till now. All they do is get you to run speedtest so yeah a waste of time.
Connection has been more or less fine for a couple of hours. I feel they are downscaling peoples connections to save bandwith because they are so bogged down getting as many customers as they can.

I will be looking elsewhere end of term VM have really gone down the pan this last year for some reason.
 
Soldato
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The phone people also read/follow a script but if you are upfront with what you've done in the way of troubleshooting (ie most of what they will suggest), they will often just remote check your hardware / levels and book you an engineer. That is what I had happen last week. Obviously it depends who you get and how competent they are but its miles better than the live chat where each person is likely dealing with 10-15 customers at a time.

I personally think its more that it is an ageing network badly need of investment, which we might see with the eventual adoption of DOCSIS 3.1. The trouble is in many areas like mine they basically have the high speed market to themselves, it is only in the very few places that offer actual FTTP (rather than the much more common FTTC) that they have any real competition on speed.

I'd be doubtful that they actually intentionally slow down peoples connections, I just think the overall network is badly maintained or maintained to the point of "good enough" due to the lack of real competition in an effort to maximise profits. The fact is that they are happy to give you free speed upgrades every 12-18 months but fail to do anything in over subscribed areas to improve the actual bandwidth available shows that. A faster speed looks good on paper but it doesn't mean anything if the reliability and actual bandwidth availability at peak times isn't there. I guess from their point of view there is more benefit to installations in new areas that improvement in existing ones.
 

Deleted member 209350

D

Deleted member 209350

I have a query...

Currently own a oldish virgin box, got a few HD channels but the box is just far too slow for my liking. On top of this I have recently purchased a new 4K TV and I wanted to set up freeview on it and was wondering if it were at all possible that I can take out the cable from the virgin box and plug it straight into the TV and then put on auto tune to get all the regular freeview channels?
 
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