Something super is coming...

StriderX · 14 Jun 2019 at 13:36

RTX is a gimmick, it's used in 1 out of several use cases when the full use case is still impossible (Global illumination, shadows, reflections and ambient occlusion).

That is with optimising those use cases like with Battlefield to improve performance at a loss of Rays.

Sargatanas2511 · 14 Jun 2019 at 13:37

StriderX said:
RTX is a gimmick, it's used in 1 out of several use cases when the full use case is still impossible (Global illumination, shadows, reflections and ambient occlusion).

Yet in the Navi thread people keep bringing it up as a reason to buy a 2070 over the 5700XT. It's a strange world we live in.

StriderX · 14 Jun 2019 at 13:39

Certainly when a modern high end game can use all of those procedures at reasonable frame rates on a reasonable resolution, then it can take the crown from traditional rasterisation.

The issue is how much rasterising cores would people want sacrificed?

Honestly Nvidia should just add an expansion card that just does Ray tracing and leave the Rasteriser alone, but maybe that's not doable or would provide too much latency.

DarrenM343 · 14 Jun 2019 at 13:50

StriderX said:
RTX is a gimmick, it's used in 1 out of several use cases when the full use case is still impossible (Global illumination, shadows, reflections and ambient occlusion).

That is with optimising those use cases like with Battlefield to improve performance at a loss of Rays.

That doesn't make it a gimmick though. It's a humble beginning of new technology. A gimmick is something that is hardly likely going to evolve into anything useful.

StriderX · 14 Jun 2019 at 13:58

DarrenM343 said:
That doesn't make it a gimmick though. It's a humble beginning of new technology. A gimmick is something that is hardly likely going to evolve into anything useful.

Like the humble beginning of PhysX?

Not that it's the same thing as it's fundamentally changing the visuals of the game and not just adding a bunch of crappy pieces of cloth to a game you can fiddle with, still though.

varkanoid · 14 Jun 2019 at 14:00

DarrenM343 said:
That doesn't make it a gimmick though. It's a humble beginning of new technology. A gimmick is something that is hardly likely going to evolve into anything useful.

Like 3D gaming, or VR...........

DarrenM343 · 14 Jun 2019 at 14:00

StriderX said:
Like the humble beginning of PhysX?

Not that it's the same thing as it's fundamentally changing the visuals of the game and not just adding a bunch of crappy pieces of cloth to a game you can fiddle with, still though.

Completely different. Tessellation.
Eventually nobody will care about RT - it'll just work

. Nobody gives a damn about tessellation these days but AMD were first to bring it to the market. Today it's there doing it's thing still, but hardly talked about. I believe it was also used sparingly when first released to reduce impact on performance.
Physx is no longer required but it probably has left its mark on physics handling&calcs.

KillBoY_UK · 14 Jun 2019 at 16:50

Sargatanas2511 said:
How many games support it and what cards can play those games with RTX on at any kind of decent frame rate?

StriderX said:
Like the humble beginning of PhysX?

Not that it's the same thing as it's fundamentally changing the visuals of the game and not just adding a bunch of crappy pieces of cloth to a game you can fiddle with, still though.

PhysX is still bring used to this day (Octopath Traveller on the switch uses it), just not the hardware kind which I'm kinda sand about personally.

"Normal" PhysX (like Havok) is alive and well.

KillBoY_UK · 14 Jun 2019 at 16:52

DarrenM343 said:
Completely different. Tessellation.
Eventually nobody will care about RT - it'll just work . Nobody gives a damn about tessellation these days but AMD were first to bring it to the market. Today it's there doing it's thing still, but hardly talked about. I believe it was also used sparingly when first released to reduce impact on performance.
Physx is no longer required but it probably has left its mark on physics handling&calcs.

I remmber the same covoations and arguments happening with Pixel shaders, It took till Morrowind and the Geforce 4 4600 TI (a classic) for that to change.

Sargatanas2511 · 14 Jun 2019 at 17:32

KillBoY_UK said:
PhysX is still bring used to this day (Octopath Traveller on the switch uses it), just not the hardware kind which I'm kinda sand about personally.

"Normal" PhysX (like Havok) is alive and well.

I believe ray tracing is the future, but further in the future than most think and cards are barely capable of a lightened version of it now and cost £1000+.

Any card below the 2080 is pointless to buy with the intention of using ray tracing and even the 2080 is borderline.

Safetytrousers · 14 Jun 2019 at 17:46

Sargatanas2511 said:
I believe ray tracing is the future, but further in the future than most think and cards are barely capable of a lightened version of it now and cost £1000+.
.

The 2080ti is capable. I'm happily playing SOTR all settings I want on at max except ray tracing at medium and I get mostly 60fps, and with g-sync I have no degrade in experience when there is a drop. If I was to turn DLSS on (which is nowhere near as bad as some people say) it would be rock solid 60fps.
Some of the lighting during interior play is continuing to be wondrous.

Scougar · 14 Jun 2019 at 17:52

2080ti and "mostly" 60fps. Seriously ... Good enough for a third person, but for that price.. I'd prob just turn that off. It just isn't capable yet. Needs at least another iteration to get to a place where it is almost no hit with the dedicated cores.

Rofflay · 14 Jun 2019 at 18:05

Everything is the future though 4k HDR what happened to that game changer? Now they want Raytracing it can not be done with 4k HDR for five years and this means Witcher 3 forget about adding more eye candy just take everything the same add RT 4k HDR you will not get 60fps without 4 RT cards about £4000.

By that time there will be something new the only reason RT is coming now is Nvidia see a short term monopoly and boy do they like to using them. Do not get me wrong even Quake looks good but not at 1080p it is a visual regression compared to 4k imo. 4k just looks so damm good alongside higher framerates im willing to shun Raytraced games until maybe 5 years time i might go back and play Tomb Raider raytraced at 4k.

easyrider · 14 Jun 2019 at 18:34

Scougar said:
2080ti and "mostly" 60fps. Seriously.

I know..it amazes me how people can defend a a card costing over £1000 that is just not fit for purpose :mad:

Scougar · 14 Jun 2019 at 18:41

They other part is when devs pull crap like adding effects when you enable RT that isn't even eat tracing. Literally no reason it couldn't have worked for non-RT cards. (See BF as prime example of this). It needs games to demo it and push it further.... But crap like this no.

Need honesty with features.

If they release this at the same price as current card, kinda good. Who doesn't like more for the same money? I see some sites going on about much more RT power in the cards.. er no... still not properly capable.

Scougar · 14 Jun 2019 at 18:47

easyrider said:
I know..it amazes me how people can defend a a card costing over £1000 that is just not fit for purpose

Not sure if serious or facetious?

BigBANGtheory · 14 Jun 2019 at 19:01

More fill-in cards I reckon until Q2 2020

Rofflay · 14 Jun 2019 at 20:00

Scougar said:
They other part is when devs pull crap like adding effects when you enable RT that isn't even eat tracing. Literally no reason it couldn't have worked for non-RT cards. (See BF as prime example of this). It needs games to demo it and push it further.... But crap like this no.

Need honesty with features.

If they release this at the same price as current card, kinda good. Who doesn't like more for the same money? I see some sites going on about much more RT power in the cards.. er no... still not properly capable.

Raytracing reflections on wood is hilariously bad... even puddles sort of get to me i am more of a guy who thinks raytracing makes shadows rich and makes the worlds lighting look good. But when you see everything in wood and puddles like a mirror it becomes a gimmick to overload your gpu and make it so you think your gpu is underpowered.

*hand rubbing*

gpuerrilla · 14 Jun 2019 at 20:08

BigBANGtheory said:
More fill-in cards I reckon until Q2 2020

Was there this many cards ten years ago in the price brackets? I recall getting a 8800 and thought the variety about was plenty. Having all these 10/16/20 series is ridiculous.

Grim5 · 14 Jun 2019 at 22:16

Scougar said:
2080ti and "mostly" 60fps. Seriously ... Good enough for a third person, but for that price.. I'd prob just turn that off. It just isn't capable yet. Needs at least another iteration to get to a place where it is almost no hit with the dedicated cores.

The 2080ti is super capable with ray tracing at 4K 60 In single player games.
It’s just multiplayer it cannot hit the frames because everyone wants 144hz