Watch the video again - only about 5gb vram is being used on both cards - borderland 3 doesn’t need much vram even a 6gb care is fine.
What you were looking at is system RAM. Why is system ram showing 50% higher usage in DX12 though lol
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RIP <=8 GB Vram
- Thread starter Poneros
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Watch the video again - only about 5gb vram is being used on both cards - borderland 3 doesn’t need much vram even a 6gb care is fine.
What you were looking at is system RAM. Why is system ram showing 50% higher usage in DX12 though lol
Soldato
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Ah yes, thank you. That is right (I'll correct my prior post). But yeah it still does beg the question why it's using so much system ram
Oh is it? Let’s count the number of owners in the Radeon 7 thread vs 2080ti thread again shall we
So you're saying the number of posts on one forum provides more accurate statistics than Steam's global survey? lol
Caporegime
Yes he is!
I'm just challenging the person who said the Radeon 7 was becoming popular.
Yet on these forums there are only 34 Radeon 7 owners and 90 rtx 2080ti owners. Poor radeon, it's numbers can only go down since it's no longer in production.
As for steam: I can't even see the Radeon 7, can you?
https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/Steam-Hardware-Software-Survey-Welcome-to-Steam
2080 = 0.83%
2080 ti = 0.48%
2070 = 1.34%
2060 = 1.23%
1660ti = 0.89%
5700/5700xt/radeon 7 = nowhere to be found
Man of Honour
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Strokes 16GB Radeon VII.
Heh, the card will be obsolete before 16gb is needed.
Radeon VII is a limited edition card, with worldwide sales perhaps not more than 5000 pcs.
35 owners on the forum. I have one but haven't yet had my name added to the owners list.
Not that one more makes any difference
Associate
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Amusingly this video is a 4gb card, AMD Fury, that has allocated RAM as VRAM. Both Fury cards perform worse than an 8gb RX 580, but I don't think this is a VRAM issue as a 3gb 1060 beats the Fury too
Soldato
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That's not the issue here. Borderlands 3 uses the Unreal Engine which has historically been fined tune for Nvidia (Yes, this is finally changing with the release of GOW4 and hopefully B3 as AMD sponsors more UE games using DX12).
What will happen is that by December 2019 AMD will release driver improvements with their annual driver boost update. By then DX12 should be out of beta and fine tuned for this game.
However, (and I do agree) there has been criticism that the game itself isn't as fined tuned as it should be (volumetric fog needs to be disabled). A 2080ti should get of a 1080p results at 1440p @2:42 mark of the video.
Which is actually in the video you provided. Did you not see that commentary? I'm not sure what the issue is but the performance hit shouldn't be that dire for this game IMO.
Furthermore, this is in DX11 not DX12. With AMD GPUs they jump ahead in DX12 (as shown at the near the beginning of the video). Perhaps the performance issues in DX11 are elevated in DX12 (once matured) IMO.
HU stated they didn't use DX12 because it wasn't as smooth as DX11. For who AMD/Nvidia? That part is nebulous. He further states that a Patron member told him that DX12 worked better in DX12 for his 2080ti!! However, as their own graph shows, the 2080ti falls behind in DX12. It's not hard to paint a clear picture of what's going on here...
Edit:
At a guess; if AMD is more involved in PC games that use DX12 I would speculate that they are enforcing Async Compute via Parallelism among other aspects that favor AMD.
I would love to see 1080ti/2070S/2080S playing this game in DX12 using MSI AB OSD. I would like to see the GPU temps/fps/vreg temps/power consumption.
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Soldato
Are you saying you would choose a 3.4% increase in average fps vs an 8.5% drop in 1% lows?
Strokes 16GB Radeon VII.
Snap. So smooth
Looking forward to big Navi, the midrange 5700xt seems decent
Soldato
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Ah, here we go...
You had to keep quoting me there for the whole thing.
Point is I'm not seeing on mass complaints about issues using DX12. And by HU own admission patron(s) echo the same thing. The only difference is that the 2080ti is showing a lower frame rate in DX12.
Therefore, it would be prudent to show DX12 results with a caveat of a possible addendum when DX12 is out of beta for Borderlands 3.
DX12 should be a lot better. But you need low level programming skills to use it well. Something lacking in today's gaming industry 
The people with real talent (like John Carmack etc) moved on long ago. It's largely graduates just out of programming 101 who don't know this stuff.
The people with real talent (like John Carmack etc) moved on long ago. It's largely graduates just out of programming 101 who don't know this stuff.
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Soldato
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Well, that didn't take long. I found an article that correlates exactly what I was saying about featuring DX11 in games that use UE4.
As you can see AMD clearly pulls ahead when using DX12 which is why I questioned HU's omission of DX12 results. Furthermore, the reviewer there didn't indicate any suttering issues using it. However did state (in part):
This explains why DX12 portion of the game is still in beta and what fixes should be in the works for an updated release of DX12 in the game.
Driver bug, plain and simple. RTG needs to address this and fix polaris issues in the game.
Par for the course as they say. If you are using an AMD Video Cards and you buy a AMD Sponsored Game that uses Unreal Engine 4 make sure you enable DX12 in order take advantage of the enhancements made to the engine to get the best performance possible. Even if that means waiting until a better version/release of DX12 is made available (in this case).
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/borderlands-3-benchmark-test-performance-analysis/5.html
DX12 should be a lot better. But you need low level programming skills to use it well. Something lacking in today's gaming industry
The people with real talent (like John Carmack etc) moved on long ago. It's largely graduates just out of programming 101 who don't know this stuff.
Well, it's not that cut and dry. Yes, you want a game engine to work as close as possible to metal. Which is why consoles are so efficient. However, there is a conundrum between AMD and Nvidia that was talked about but IMO forgotten. And, it is how do we do this in DX12? Well AMD has-had Mantal which is now Vulkan. But there is MS in the mix of this now and they are pushing DX12. But there is a divide as to how DX12 Async Compute to "work" on the GPU.
AMD GPUs work better with more Parallelism. And, also prefers hardware scheduler and other hardware related features. Which is why AMD cards draw more power then Nvidia.
Nvidia GPUs work better with more Concurrency with Pre-Emption using context switching, etc. And, also prefers to use software (IE: CPU) for their scheduler, etc. Which is why (IMO) there are so many "stutter" threads, topics, posts as any given game is more cpu limited. Keep in mind with Turing Nvidia gpus do run better at parallelism then with Kepler, etc.
Both of which are fighting for. IMO AMD is winning because...consoles... In particular next gen gaming but I digress.
Parallelism works best with AMD's GCN. But with RDNA that has changed a bit (does anyone still remember abit...digress again). It's not wholly clear how RDNA will impact Parallelism. But by the looks of Time Spy results still does pretty bad at Concurrency with context switching, etc (IE the way Nvidia wants DX12 to work). Side note: If you take a look at Time Spy and Fire Strike you may wonder why 5700XT does so much better at Fire Strike...
Anyway, RDNA (from what I've gathered) is suppose to help make DX11 games perform better but it's still not the level of how Nvidia does it. But I've not found a lot on RDNA and will admit haven't researched it that much to further comment.
But hopefully one day all these games will be on DX12/Vulkan. Well, it will once next gen consoles are released.
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Soldato
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Although I'm probably over simplifying how it works it goes a little something like this:
AMD use of Parallelism in Async Compute can complete multiple Graphics and Compute tasks at the same time. It can run several computations in parallel. This is how GCN was designed to work. Problem is not all games work that way and causes inefficiencies in GCN. IE: Games can only use up to 2/3 of GCN as a whole but at time even less. Which is why RDNA was born. You cannot get most gaming engines to consistently feed GCN like that.
Nvidia uses Concurrency with Pre-Emption in Async Compute which can still complete multiple Graphics and Compute tasks but it's not done all at the same time. It's broken up "if you will".
Here is an example:
Top part is how GCN likes things done.
Bottom is how Nvidia likes things done.
Now I must say I did forget something. And it's called Pre-emption. Something Nvidia does very, very well in.
CS = Context Switching...
One of the main reasons why GCN didn't do so well in DX11 was because of how the data was feed in "serial"
This is what made Nvidia way of doing things so well. And, why Nvidia does well in DX11. That's the advantage Nvidia has over Radeon.
Now that's not to say this is how all DX11 games were ran.
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Soldato
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IMHO, I too thought that developers were "bias" but now, not so much. I realized that it was the rules that Microsoft set for DX10, DX11, DX12, for example.
Now there was the Assassin Creed "Gate" where the developer removed DX10.1 at the behest of Nvidia as it made Radeon cards faster in that game. The others were tessellation "Gate" in Crysis (2? and Hawx). As well as the use of physx to replace basic rasterization that was normally used in games (Batman, Borderlands 2, etc). I recall Need For Speed Shift were it was determined that physx calculations were used for tire physic, etc. So, I know there are a few examples.
But for games like GTA V, Witcher 3, Watch Dogs, Saints Row, etc there is no real excuse why AMD hasn't improved on those games by now to show it betting nvidia.
Edit made to get to the point.
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