Paedophile gang not dealt with by both the Police and social services.

[Greebo]

Oh sorry I forgot that they are only capable of looking into one incident at a time LOL, my bad, even if this laughable excuse was true, the crimes weren't a one off and were continuing for years, there is absolutely no excuse for this. I know you enjoy crying into your cheerios over budget spending by the conservatives, but it doesnt excuse refusing to investigate ongoing mass rape and abuse of children. A senior police official should be in prison for decisions like these, who are they to decide who is allowed to continuously break the law or not, just do your job. Maybe if they stop dressing up as rainbow Easter eggs for LGBT events they could actually remove dangerous animals from their city.

Yet this enquiry and investigation doesnt support your conclusion? It states it was dropped due to lack of resources. So if you were a senior police officer and you were faced with choices, which one would you choose?

Yes, its disappointing this was chosen to be dropped but that is what happens when you cant do everything. Sorry to burst your far right "all pedos must die" bubble.

 

[NVP]

Read the Rotherham investigation reports. I believe the one by Alexis Jay is probably the most detailed as it included the findings of earlier reports.

Thanks, will find them tonight.

 

[Efour]

Which is? Could you spell it out?

The "muslim" connection. It's like the French connection but with less Gene Hackman.

 

[Hotwired]

Right...I'll try again. Someone, an individual ultimately makes a decision of where resources are allocated throughout the whole country. That would be the PM as first lord of the treasury. They them have many tiers beneath them but all can report upwards about significant issues theyre facing and extra, emergency,l funds can be made available should the situation be deemed to warrant it. Knowing this was happening people should have been asking for the resources to counter it. Either they didn't ask or the person who chooses where resource goes decided to spend it elsewhere. So that's who you look at. It may go all the way to the top, it may not. That needs to be investigated. An individual is ultimately responsible. That individual could be Blair, Brown or Cameron. Or it could be Susan or Frank in child services or the police. Either way someone, somewhere made a conscious decision to not push this further by either omission of information or funds.​

What we know for sure is that the police started an investigation on obviously compromised resources and resources were cited as the prime reason for it being dropped.

The report said Operation Augusta subsequently identified at least 57 children "as potential victims" and up to 97 "persons of interest" involved in the crimes against them.

However, it said while the investigation had the "intention of tackling the problems identified within the scoping phase... it soon became apparent this would not be quickly achievable given the resources".

The report found the operation was ultimately "prematurely closed down... before it could complete its work", a decision that was driven by a desire to "remove the resources", rather than by having "a sound understanding that all lines of enquiry had been successfully completed or exhausted".

That sums it up right there.

The initial stage of the investigation got as far as identifying over 150 people that would need further investigation to decide if there was a crime being committed. With our excellent retrospective vision we now know there was crime being committed but it's obvious that this was stopped dead right at that point because it was not yet a certain crime but it would definitely blow the resource budget to find out.

This is exactly what I mean by lose-lose decisions being made because of a shortage of resources. It sounds like fear of wasting restricted resources and not having hard evidence to go on or support a pitch for more money because that itself required the resources they didn't have.

You want it to boil down to blaming an individual but everyone involved can conceivably have made the correct decision out of the options they had and still we end up with a horrible outcome because it wasn't possible to have all of the facts we now know.

 

[Threepwood]

The "muslim" connection.

All peados are muslims? Or all muslims are peados? Sorry, I don't understand, can you explain what the biggoted view is a bit better?

 

[ttaskmaster]

Remember that Secret Police thread from not so long ago?
This is the sort of thing we'd want them for... and since a 9mm round only costs about 70p, compared to the many thousands it'd take to build a strong enough case to secure proper convictions, along with the maintenance costs for lifetime sentences, I'd say that takes care of any budget concerns, too.

 

[Dis86]

What we know for sure is that the police started an investigation on obviously compromised resources and resources were cited as the prime reason for it being dropped.



That sums it up right there.

The initial stage of the investigation got as far as identifying over 150 people that would need further investigation to decide if there was a crime being committed. With our excellent retrospective vision we now know there was crime being committed but it's obvious that this was stopped dead right at that point because it was not yet a certain crime but it would definitely blow the resource budget to find out.

This is exactly what I mean by lose-lose decisions being made because of a shortage of resources. It sounds like fear of wasting restricted resources and not having hard evidence to go on or support a pitch for more money because that itself required the resources they didn't have.

You want it to boil down to blaming an individual but everyone involved can conceivably have made the correct decision out of the options they had and still we end up with a horrible outcome because it wasn't possible to have all of the facts we now know.

What you're completely neglecting there is the information from the council and social workers and their actions or lack there-of. As I've already pointed out to you there are budgets available specifically for instances like this - they were not sought.

 

[G-MAN2004]

Do we have a list of names yet? Oh wait... we really don't need them, do we?

Edit: had a quick browse... "Mohammed", "Yaqoob", "while others described going to ‘sex parties’ of 20 Asian men."

Shocker

 

[Hotwired]

What you're completely neglecting there is the information from the council and social workers and their actions or lack there-of. As I've already pointed out to you there are budgets available specifically for instances like this - they were not sought.

That first part needs more than a one liner, how does it relate to what I was saying.

The second part I don't believe you're using any source (link?) however you're ignoring me describing a catch 22 situation where the scope for the investigation (154 people) turned out to be too big to continue within budget and to request funds they'd need more proof of crime (I bet the murder cases didn't go unfunded) which they couldn't get without completing the investigation...

 

[Dis86]

That first part needs more than a one liner, how does it relate to what I was saying.

The second part I don't believe you're using any source (link?) however you're ignoring me describing a catch 22 situation where the scope for the investigation (154 people) was too big to continue within budget and to request funds they'd need more proof of crime (I bet the murder cases didn't go unfunded) which they couldn't get without completing the investigation...

I suggest you actually read more...They had resource allocated and withdrew it.

 

[Efour]

All peados are muslims? Or all muslims are peados? Sorry, I don't understand, can you explain what the biggoted view is a bit better?

No I can't sorry. Ask someone that actually cares. There's loads already posting.

 

[BowdonUK]

The thing is this kind of stuff was literally in plain sight.

I remember dropping a friend off many years ago in the town near me and when I cut down a side road to get to his estate, there were literally young girls standing on the street as prostitutes. They were also standing at bus stops. On that occasion the police did act as when I drove again through there I saw a police van parked up and nobody was around. But it had been going on for years. I suspect it moved to other areas.

We can talk about why it happens or what motive certain people have or not. But the fact is these children have been (probably still are from what I've heard) for YEARS.

I don't really know how a person who saw this going on with their own eyes didn't react. I can understand they want to keep their job and not rock the boat, but damn, I don't know how they can sleep at night.

The only fear I've seen from the establishment was when they wanted a channel 4 documentary to be banned before an election because their dislike of the BNP was greater than spreading awareness of this and making children safe.

 

[Hotwired]

I suggest you actually read more...They had resource allocated and withdrew it.

They did not have the resources to investigate 154 people to determine if a crime was being committed so the resources that were allocated initially were withdrawn. I see that as it being too big for the budget to even investigate and too vague to secure further funds.

Show your source if you're seeing something different.

 

[Dis86]

They did not have the resources to investigate 154 people to determine if a crime was being committed so the resources that were allocated initially were withdrawn. I see that as it being too big for the budget to even investigate and too vague to secure further funds.

Show your source if you're seeing something different.

It's in the article on the BBC site.

"The police operation was "prematurely closed down" after senior officers decided to "remove resources", it said."

Not insufficient resources. Not resources weren't allocated. Removed resources. They were there and took them away.

 

[Threepwood]

No I can't sorry. Ask someone that actually cares. There's loads already posting.

Okay, sorry. You cared enough to post what you did so I thought you may be able to clarify.

Would anyone else care to comment on what the bigoted view is that could be true? I'd like to imagine it, to be able to comment.

 

[Hotwired]

It's in the article on the BBC site.

"The police operation was "prematurely closed down" after senior officers decided to "remove resources", it said."

Not insufficient resources. Not resources weren't allocated. Removed resources. They were there and took them away.

You mean the section I quoted and highlighted in green the bit which explains why they removed the resources? And then I wrote a decent sized post about?

This quote?

The report said Operation Augusta subsequently identified at least 57 children "as potential victims" and up to 97 "persons of interest" involved in the crimes against them.

However, it said while the investigation had the "intention of tackling the problems identified within the scoping phase... it soon became apparent this would not be quickly achievable given the resources".

The report found the operation was ultimately "prematurely closed down... before it could complete its work", a decision that was driven by a desire to "remove the resources", rather than by having "a sound understanding that all lines of enquiry had been successfully completed or exhausted".

Not enough resources to investigate. Therefore a waste of resources. Resources reallocated.

This is literally posted up the page and you even replied to me.

 

[wesimmo]

You think these organisations don't CONSTANTLY go cap in hand to their minister in Whitehall with all the problems the budget cuts cause?

Appointments at the very top of the organisation are political and if you're not cutting back your department until it fits the budget you're going to be out because you have two jobs at that level and one of them is to implement government policy while the other is to run the organisation.

Right there in the article we've got the initial attempt at a police investigation fighting over resources, space and staff with murder investigations and it looks like the murders won out. There's also mention of a social worker voicing concerns about their side being overwhelmed if they tried to take on all the children they had concerns about.

No question has been answered. The budget cuts are from the government. The organisations cut services or try to half-ass as many as they can with the reduced budget. I have doubts ground level staff can be blamed. Oh and the government issued the budget cuts because the country is broke.

So when services fail and the inquiry comes back to say an attempt was made and then got cancelled for budget reasons you would blame... who?

We've got about half a dozen people trying to sell a non-article or inquiry supported line which suggests they're bringing an agenda and not reading the article at all.

Quite.

If we're going to start the ultimate blame game, it's Conservative voters who are at fault. If we'd put taxes up and put more money into the public services then there wouldn't have been funding issues. (I realise this is hyperbole)

Having direct experience of being in public service budgeting, I can tell you about councils etc who are basically going through their services and seeing what they don't legally need to do and dropping those services because they can't afford it.

Obviously they've asked for more money, it's just not there.

 

[wesimmo]

The various constabularies appear have the funds to investigate hurtful words on the internet, but not crack down on a nonce gang run by the usual suspects.

Yeah, that’s totally a budget driven decision.

How long do you think it takes the police to investigate a moron being offensive on Twitter versus a full investigation into a huge number of people hiding their activities?

Do you know how police are targeted by the government? Could the targets the police have to work to actually mean they pick and choose easy crimes to solve so they can tick a box and say they hit them?

 

[MookJong]

You would assume wrong then. Perhaps read some more?

Woooooosh

 

[Dis86]

Quite.

If we're going to start the ultimate blame game, it's Conservative voters who are at fault.

This happened under Labour.