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NVIDIA ‘Ampere’ 8nm Graphics Cards

Caporegime
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
32,615
Yes, that's what they are doing. The new Xbox is going to have Variable Rate shading and Ray Tracing, those are not features of RDNA but are features that AMD say are coming to RDNA2. We know this, it was part of the Xbox X announcement from Microsoft.

The new consoles are coming on a new process(7nm Euv+) because RDNA2 is optimised for that process.

And lastly you forget that this is a custom SoC designed for consoles, It's going to be more power efficient than a discrete card for a PC would be for the same performance.


I believe RDNA1 does have variable rate shading but it is not enabled in drivers, probably more hardware failures like several of the vega features than were never enabled.
But VRS gets you about 5% performance and it is not free performance. The developers have to put ina lot of work to amke sure only suitable surfaces see a reduction in shading rate.
 
Caporegime
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
32,615
^^ Indeed. AMD has just launched 15w 16 thread zen 3 APUs. The same could power a console, even 45w potentially. And we know from benchmarks, the 45w part is faster than a i7 9700k in multi thread loads - so assuming games make use of those 16 threads - a 45w APU can be faster than a desktop 9700k at gaming, that's insanse!

Still leaving 200 to 250w for the GPU - plenty for a high end gpu. You take that 5700xt, produce it on 7nm+ using RDNA2 architecture, use the efficiency gains to add a few extra CU's and voila you have over RTX2080 performance.

Where it gets really interesting. Let's say we make it on 7nm+ with RDNA2, but don't add any extra CU's - so we have the 5700xt with whatever architecture IPC gains only. Gaining nice efficiency in the process - so now we have a 170w GPU. This architecture uses Adaptive Shading - if every game supports it, that instantly boosts the performance by 15% - now once again we can make these performance claims against PC's.

Adaptive shading doesn't boost performance by anywhere near that much, and it requires active developer support.

But your power figures are wildly optimistic. Console tend to be design around about a 100-140w load average when gaming. They may peak higher at times, and Sony/MS may be willing to push that but they wont run 300w average.
 
Soldato
Joined
6 Feb 2019
Posts
17,464
Adaptive shading doesn't boost performance by anywhere near that much, and it requires active developer support.

But your power figures are wildly optimistic. Console tend to be design around about a 100-140w load average when gaming. They may peak higher at times, and Sony/MS may be willing to push that but they wont run 300w average.

Have you seen what the new xbox looks like? It's 60% bigger than the biggest xbox console produced in the current generation. Next gen machines are big *because* they will drawing more power than ever before.

And this extra 60% is not because they need space for performance components, in fact space should go down moving from mechanical drives to a nvme SSD etc. The extra space is mostly for cooling. This is just a rumour: but windows central reported the xbox uses a very big fan to draw hot air out of the case (think 180 to 200mm), hence it's width and the remaining space is taken up by "innovative cooling solution", which includes heatpipes - heatpipes are rarely seen in consoles as heatpipes aren't needed for dissapating small power draw where you can have the heatsink direct on the die. Larger loads where you have unique heatsink designs are helped by heatpipes transporting heat effectively
 
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Soldato
Joined
20 Apr 2004
Posts
4,365
Location
Oxford
Yes, that's what they are doing. The new Xbox is going to have Variable Rate shading and Ray Tracing, those are not features of RDNA but are features that AMD say are coming to RDNA2. We know this, it was part of the Xbox X announcement from Microsoft.

The new consoles are coming on a new process(7nm Euv+) because RDNA2 is optimised for that process.

And lastly you forget that this is a custom SoC designed for consoles, It's going to be more power efficient than a discrete card for a PC would be for the same performance.

at most those cores will be RDNA + RT like the GTX 1660 is Turing -RT. Its still VERY unlikely they be a massive same node jump in PPW in such a short time frame.
 
Soldato
Joined
19 Dec 2010
Posts
12,019
Personally I'd love the new Xbox to be as powerful as the rumours suggest, Ill probably buy one anyway.

Actually I think I am going to go with the PS5 this time around. Skipped the PS4, so the PS5 would be a nice change from a Microsoft world.
 
Soldato
Joined
28 May 2007
Posts
10,049
You won’t be disappointed. I am loving catching up with all these exclusives on my PS4 Pro. Just make sure you have an OLED TV ;)

Not as good as an HDR OLED tv but i play my ps4 pro on an HDR 4k IPS monitor and it does a pretty decent job. All my Favourite single player experiences are on PS4 as the games are polished to the max and you can tell time was taken to make the experience.
 

TNA

TNA

Caporegime
Joined
13 Mar 2008
Posts
27,172
Location
Greater London
Not as good as an HDR OLED tv but i play my ps4 pro on an HDR 4k IPS monitor and it does a pretty decent job. All my Favourite single player experiences are on PS4 as the games are polished to the max and you can tell time was taken to make the experience.
Like you I am into single player experiences. Done HZD, playing Spider-Man now and next up is God of War :D

Got Final Fantasy 7 Remake and Resident Evil 3 Remake on pre-order. After that I will get Last of Us 2 ;)
 
Soldato
Joined
19 Dec 2010
Posts
12,019
Have you seen what the new xbox looks like? It's 60% bigger than the biggest xbox console produced in the current generation. Next gen machines are big *because* they will drawing more power than ever before.

And this extra 60% is not because they need space for performance components, in fact space should go down moving from mechanical drives to a nvme SSD etc. The extra space is mostly for cooling. This is just a rumour: but windows central reported the xbox uses a very big fan to draw hot air out of the case (think 180 to 200mm), hence it's width and the remaining space is taken up by "innovative cooling solution", which includes heatpipes - heatpipes are rarely seen in consoles as heatpipes aren't needed for dissapating small power draw where you can have the heatsink direct on the die. Larger loads where you have unique heatsink designs are helped by heatpipes transporting heat effectively

I agree with this, everyone is forgetting about how much bigger the new case is. I think the it will consume more power than any previous console. Digital Foundry reckons it will use 300W!!
 
Soldato
Joined
19 Dec 2010
Posts
12,019
at most those cores will be RDNA + RT like the GTX 1660 is Turing -RT. Its still VERY unlikely they be a massive same node jump in PPW in such a short time frame.

Why do you think the new Xbox X is going to use the same power as the previous one? Microsoft have shown that they will increase power consumption to get the performance. Look at the difference between the Xbox one and the Xbox one X. Depending on the game there could be 60/70 watts or more in the difference. There are already sites that think the Xbox X will use a lot more than 200W.

We’ll see.

We shall indeed :) I still think the top Xbox X of the series running at 2080 speeds is much more likely than it running at 2060S speeds.
 
Soldato
Joined
11 Jan 2016
Posts
2,563
Location
Surrey
For me its a 3080ti + one of these new AIO badboys slapped on it


That looks AWESOME!

I'm potentially contemplating both, one for desktop and other for Alienware amplifier with in the living room.

Part of me thinks they'll go back to staggered release where the ti comes out after the non ti.
 
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