******Official Star Citizen / Squadron 42 Thread******

Soldato
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You go from talking about pre 2016 to present without explanation Panos.

Pre-2016 backers could have paid as little as $30 for SQ42 and SC depending on when they backed, possibly less if they'd got one of the annual special limited packages. Anyone backing back then had several years to get a refund if they wished, something CIG didn't legally have to do for those part of the kickstarter and early phase.

Squadron 42 chapter 1 is aimed to be around 20 hours, not 8 with approx 70 missions. Not sure where your 8 hours come from although tbh the numbers constantly change on various sources and I'll only trust it when it's actually out.

8 hours is the main campaign, the rest is side missions per chapter.

circa 2016 CIG decided to split all packages from the 3 games. Marine, SQ42, SC and you had to buy each one individually.
Until that point, KS or other pledges (eg the AMD voucher) and even the cheapest ship purchase, included all 3 games (Marine, SQ42, SC).

It was also the point where the annual pyramid scheme with the "annual special limited packages" appeared to have people cough more money to the project.

Finally would be madness anyone got in before 2016 to refund as it includes at least Chapter 1, SC and Marine. However up that point the "whole SQ42 game" was included. Which Chris now split to 4 different games to get more money in. Completely shafting those who believed bought the whole SQ42 campaign when decided to given money for it.

Your post also agrees on what I wrote is correct, however you spin it in favour of the CIG. So is fine to change the terms and conditions, including the refund process, year later after people gave their money in good faith all way back in 2012-13?

No sane and intelligent consumer would agree on that for heaven sake. What we have here is pure scam and money grab, where CIG changes the terms and what people "actually" bought several years later.
 
Soldato
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Oxfordshire
8 hours is the main campaign, the rest is side missions per chapter.

circa 2016 CIG decided to split all packages from the 3 games. Marine, SQ42, SC and you had to buy each one individually.
Until that point, KS or other pledges (eg the AMD voucher) and even the cheapest ship purchase, included all 3 games (Marine, SQ42, SC).

It was also the point where the annual pyramid scheme with the "annual special limited packages" appeared to have people cough more money to the project.

Finally would be madness anyone got in before 2016 to refund as it includes at least Chapter 1, SC and Marine. However up that point the "whole SQ42 game" was included. Which Chris now split to 4 different games to get more money in. Completely shafting those who believed bought the whole SQ42 campaign when decided to given money for it.

Your post also agrees on what I wrote is correct, however you spin it in favour of the CIG. So is fine to change the terms and conditions, including the refund process, year later after people gave their money in good faith all way back in 2012-13?

No sane and intelligent consumer would agree on that for heaven sake. What we have here is pure scam and money grab, where CIG changes the terms and what people "actually" bought several years later.

What the hell is marine? There is the PU & SQ42. There is no marine :/

You mean star marine and arena commander, they come with the PU as standard.

SQ42 has around 20 hour campaign with 70 missons, split over 21 chapters in it to make the episode up.

The episodes have been a thing since 2012 since the 6 million stretch goal was all backers got episode 1 for free with their pledge and everyone would have to buy episode 2 & 3.

So no it wasn't randomly split into three to make it shorter. If anything it's expanded since we have full planets now to fly too which were not going to be planned into SQ42 previous.

Edit: And SQ42 & SC split actually makes sense tbh. They should (maybe/hopefully) be two AAA games upon their respective releases. It doesn't' change what backers whom brought before got and going forward people can choose what they want. Early backer bigger reward. That seems like 90% of all crowed funded systems.
 
Last edited:
Soldato
OP
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14,492
Your post also agrees on what I wrote is correct, however you spin it in favour of the CIG. So is fine to change the terms and conditions, including the refund process, year later after people gave their money in good faith all way back in 2012-13?

No sane and intelligent consumer would agree on that for heaven sake. What we have here is pure scam and money grab, where CIG changes the terms and what people "actually" bought several years later.

I haven't spun anything in CIGs favour, point out any inaccuracies or full out lies in my post before starting your nonsense. Do I agree with parts of what you said, of course, I'm a critic of some of the BS CIG has pulled over the years, while they do learn from them sometimes they have a habit of repeating them shortly after - particularly in the marketing department and when it comes to outsourcing.

You state " would be madness anyone got in before 2016 to refund"

Also "So is fine to change the terms and conditions, including the refund process, year later after people gave their money in good faith all way back in 2012-13?"

You contradict yourself though, "What we have here is pure scam and money grab".

Hold up so is it good that people refund or not because you seem to think it's both a huge scam and value for money. Where CIG changed the refund T&C they did so giving plenty of notice and in some instances did in the favour of the community (Kickstarter etc have no requirement for refunds, it's left up each KS project to decide. yet KS backers were given them)

I actually think we're probably in the same ball park when it comes to our trust/like of practices CIG have undertaken.

Star Marine incidentally is not a stand alone game, it's a game within the game and was meant to be there to keep backers entertained and allow tweaking of FPS mechanics generally. It's development was originally botched by CIG and Illfonic, mostly CIG though as they appointed a games developer with little experience and very little understanding of what they were making - in part as SC was so early in development. Why they thought they could outsource a key component of all of the games is beyond me but it's one of their biggest and most embarrassing **** ups to date.
 
Caporegime
Joined
17 Mar 2012
Posts
47,578
Location
ARC-L1, Stanton System
Q3 2019
AI: Complete
Game Play: Complete
Core Tech: Complete
Ships:
Idris M: 49/64. Javelin: 60/70


Q4 2019
Characters:
Titan Suit: Scheduled

AI:
Ace Pilot: 1/12.
Landing Take-Off and Landing: Complete.
Use Cover: 4/8.
FPS Weapon Types: 106/111.
Gun Ships: Complete.
Walk and Talk: 32/51

Gameplay:
Stealth: 3/7.
Conversation System: 5/12.
Vents Hatches: Scheduled.
FPS Close Combat: Complete.
Player Status System: 31/52.

Core Tech:
HDR Colour Processing: Scheduled.
Gas Cloud VFX: 16/25.
Atmospheric Effects V2: 1/6.
Physical Damage System: 2/13.
Cloth Sim V2: 8/25.
Shield Effects v2: Scheduled.
Load / Save: 11/21.
Player Interaction System Improvements: 42/75.
Procedural Asteroids v2: Complete.

Ships:
Greycat Industrial Cydnus: 11/20.
Vanduul Cleaver: 18/21.
Vanduul Void: 31/40.
Vanduul Driller: 28/40.
Drake Cutlass Red: 2/14.
MISC Hull-C: Scheduled.
Vanduul Kingship: 26/40.
Vanduul Stinger: 33/42.
Weapon Racks: Scheduled.
Vanduul Hunter: 31/34.
RSI Bengal: 29/47.


Q1 2020
Characters:
Basilisk Armor - Advocacy: 6/14.
Gunner 10/14

AI:
FPS: Stealth v3: 3/6.
FPS: Navigation v2: 8/14.
FPS: Realistic Firing v2: 6/12.
FPS: Combat Behaviors v2: 11/19.
Flight: Wingman Commands: Scheduled.

Gameplay:
Body Dragging: 6/21.
Death Animations Improvements: 9/13.
Object Push and Pull: Scheduled.
Zero-G Push and Pull: 1/2.
NPC Healing: Scheduled.

Core Tech:
General Rendering Performance Improvements: Scheduled.
Image Quality & Cinematic Rendering Improvements: Scheduled.
Mesh & Geometry Streaming Improvements: 1/4.
Real Time Reflection Improvements: Scheduled.
Large Scale Shadow Improvements: 1/4.
Physics Queue Refactor: 15/92.


Q2 2020
Characters:
Shipjacker Heavy: 9/15.

AI:
Flight: Atmospheric Combat: Scheduled
FPS: Cover Usage v2: 2/6
Flight: Mission logic additional controls: 4/7
Flight: Mission Improvements v2: Scheduled
Core AI Improvements: 13/27
Flight: Formations: 6/19
Social AI v2: 85/93
FPS: Grenades: 1/3
Vanduul Combat Behavior: 7/29
FPS: Close Combat: (shouldn't be here, was brought forward and completed)
FPS: Titan: Scheduled
Companion AI: 2/16

Gameplay:
Mounted Guns: 2/3.
Mag Boots: Scheduled.
Locomotion v2: 4/12
Seated Item Handling: Scheduled
Cockpit Interaction: 0/3
Player Slide: Scheduled
Player Swim: Scheduled
Player Locomotion Stairs Improvements: Scheduled

Core Tech:
Weapon and Item Customization: Scheduled

Weapons and Items:
Basilisk Deployable Shield: Scheduled


Q3 2020

BETA

All logged so i can see what moves ^^^^^

Update SQ42 18/01/2020 Green = Changes. Red = delays / moves

Q3 2019
AI: Complete
Game Play: Complete
Core Tech: Complete

Ships:
Idris M: 49/64. Javelin: 60/70


Q4 2019
Characters:
Titan Suit: Scheduled

AI:
Ace Pilot: 1/12.
Landing Take-Off and Landing: Complete.
Use Cover: Complete
FPS Weapon Types: Complete
Gun Ships: Complete.
Walk and Talk: Complete

Gameplay:
Stealth: 3/7.
Conversation System: Complete
Vents Hatches: Complete
FPS Close Combat: Complete.
Player Status System: 36/64.

Core Tech:
HDR Colour Processing: Scheduled.
Gas Cloud VFX: Complete
Atmospheric Effects V2: 1/6.
Physical Damage System: 2/13.
Cloth Sim V2: 8/25.
Shield Effects v2: Scheduled.
Load / Save: 11/21.
Player Interaction System Improvements: 45/79.
Procedural Asteroids v2: Complete.

Ships:
Greycat Industrial Cydnus: 11/20.
Vanduul Cleaver: 18/21.
Vanduul Void: 31/40.
Vanduul Driller: 28/40.
Drake Cutlass Red: 29/48.
MISC Hull-C: Scheduled.
Vanduul Kingship: 26/40.
Vanduul Stinger: 33/42.
Weapon Racks: Scheduled.
Vanduul Hunter: 31/34.
RSI Bengal: 29/47.


Q1 2020
Characters:
Basilisk Armor - Advocacy: 6/14.
Gunner 10/14

AI:
FPS: Stealth v3: 3/6.
FPS: Navigation v2: 8/14.
FPS: Realistic Firing v2: 9/11.
FPS: Combat Behaviors v2: 14/20.
Flight: Wingman Commands: Scheduled.

Gameplay:
Body Dragging: 8/21.
Death Animations Improvements: 9/13.
Object Push and Pull: Scheduled.
Zero-G Push and Pull: 1/2.
NPC Healing: Scheduled.

Core Tech:
General Rendering Performance Improvements: Scheduled.
Image Quality & Cinematic Rendering Improvements: Scheduled.
Mesh & Geometry Streaming Improvements: 1/4.
Real Time Reflection Improvements: Scheduled.
Large Scale Shadow Improvements: 1/4.
Physics Queue Refactor: 15/92.


Q2 2020
Characters:
Shipjacker Heavy: 9/15.

AI:
Flight: Atmospheric Combat: Scheduled
FPS: Cover Usage v2: 2/5
Flight: Mission logic additional controls: 4/7
Flight: Mission Improvements v2: Scheduled
Core AI Improvements: 13/27
Flight: Formations: 6/19
Social AI v2: 85/93
FPS: Grenades: 1/3
Vanduul Combat Behavior: 7/29
FPS: Close Combat: (shouldn't be here, was brought forward and completed)
FPS: Titan: Scheduled
Companion AI: 2/16

Gameplay:
Mounted Guns: 2/3.
Mag Boots: Scheduled.
Locomotion v2: 4/12
Seated Item Handling: Scheduled
Cockpit Interaction: 0/3
Player Slide: Scheduled
Player Swim: Scheduled
Player Locomotion Stairs Improvements: Scheduled

Core Tech:
Weapon and Item Customization: Scheduled

Weapons and Items:
Basilisk Deployable Shield: Scheduled


Q3 2020

BETA
------------------------------------------------------------

6 Complete.
7 Changes.
 
Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2012
Posts
4,146
Location
Oxfordshire
I am not really sure about a lot of what is said;
  • where has the graphics downgrade directly come from in terms of 3.0 to 3.3 mentioned?
  • Why are we suggesting a development alpha should not have bugs or issues?
  • Why was only half the news about why they wanted to charge for the viewing of CitCon missing the fact it was for a full pro camera crew etc to run it all for them and do all the setup, sound, etc rather than doing it in house.
  • Why suggest about the finance stuff considering they have provided the info: https://cloudimperiumgames.com/blog/corporate/cloud-imperium-financials-for-2018
  • The number of studios doesn't even make sense to comment on other than it actually gives them multiple time zones to work in and elements such as tax relief or talent pool in different parts of the world
  • Why bring up Derek Smart whom has no idea about this and can't develop his way out of a paper bag. It was only about 12 months of real talk and only to a small demographic
  • Some people like the flight model, some don't, hey that is called development. It has gone through at least 3 reworks and will go through more
  • The point A to point B is exactly what the game has lots about and so that is not a negative at all. Part the reason I enjoy my time
  • The unbearable grind is the gameplay, you either like these gameplay loops or don't.
  • You don't have to purchase anything beyond starter and now you can rent most ships in game by earning monies in game yet this was ignored completely
Not suggesting there isn't issues, things wrong but it is negative and doesn't come across neutral at all. It is like skimming all the headlines about the game and making points from there. Also if you read his reply to any slight criticism or view point he just gets rather defensive and dismissive that anyone else might enjoy travelling about in cities, space and similar and do mining and cargo runs etc. It really isn't a good summary of where SC is today because it doesn't give any details on what is in there at all. It just talks about some points and puts them in a negative like.

Seems like a hit piece really.





Now in regards to a few things then and what is in game now;

Missions
  • Delivery
  • Maintenance
  • Mercenary
  • ECN Alert
  • Service Beacon - Other player
  • Investigation
The missions can be done solo or shared with other players. Some are meh tbh at least in my view but they are there and will be expanded on, hopefully with 3.9 they link to the economy system that was shown at last Citcon which should make the system more dynamic and diverse then.

Mining - Current Gameplay Loop
Then there is also the mining gameplay loop that has just been expanded so there are two different ships, a single seater and a multi-seater with different abilities. The mining involves flying, scanning and mining itself. Different attachments provided different mining abilities.

There is also the FPS mining that you can do whilst on foot, for instance if you decide to enter a cave on the planet surface as an example. This requires you to have a multi-tool and the ability to store the mined material

You then sell your mined material at different locations, all whilst giving different prices at different locations (this should be dynamic soon)

Vehicles/Ships
There is around 90 flyable ships and drive-able vehicles (some are variants) in game currently that you can purchase inside the game with in-game currency by completing the above missions or gameplay loop

Ships have components in them, these can be brought and swapped to change the performance of the ship such as shield generators, coolers and similar. These are physical items rather than just stats on a page so in later iteration the idea is that they can be damaged, wear out and can be repaired by the player (for most part, some items too big etc for the largest of ships).

Weapons are also similar in that they also can be switched out and changed for different types again allowing further customisation of the ship you own.

See this page for more on the components and similar: https://starcitizen.tools/Ship_Components

Locations
There are a number of different locations all currently in a single star system named Stanton, from planets to space stations to moons and asteroid fields.
  • Port Olisar - Orbital station located near Crusader (planet WIP)
  • Levski - decommissioned mining facility on Delemar (asteroid)
  • Grim Hex - Orbital station located near Yela (moon)
  • Lorville - Landing zone/city of Hurtson (planet)
  • Area 18 - Landing zone/planet city of ArcCorp (planet)
  • New Babbage - Landing zone/city of Microtech (planet)
  • 9 moons currently in game
  • Planets and moons have various outposts on their surface for locations to land, sell mined material or for mission based elements
It is buggy and broken most the time and things fail etc. That is where it is at in development but there is this whole system to explore and you can have 50 players in game per instance which is more than say Elite Dangerous or No Man Sky support.

Patch 3.7.0 was by far the most stable and honestly pretty playable. 3.8.0 has gone backwards in terms of that because of SSOCS which although in premise is simple and many other games use it, the issue here being due to the scale and how things work in terms of AI or trains on planets and similar they can get a little wonky at moment till they get functions all correct then issues will remain.

So yes there are plenty issues, plenty left to do but there is a reasonable foundation. The game engine is getting there and the tools to create everything is moving forward well. V4 planets are a big step in right direction. Everyone whom has a go seems to talk how it is a space game, but in a space there are planets and why do we explore space, to find new planets/locations. Why? Human nature really. So without them making large effort on what is out there to explore as you fly through space why would you play it?

That was always my issue with Elite Dangerous and to this date has pretty much been the same, why explore. To collect resources, okay great I get that.Why though, what do you do then? You buy a new ship right? To then either just shoot each other or collect more resources? I haven't played in a while but that was the premise of previous gameplay loops I can remember.

So what CIG is doing is really adding more points of interest to vist and explore to allow an expansion of those game loops. The materials wants and needs feed direct into the manufacturing of the ships, components and in future locations of the universe. That to a point is in now. It needs expanding, improving and similar but it is there to a fashion and you can test where that gameplay loop is.

Longer term it means a lot of these loops feed into elements such as having own land and somewhere to place your hanger on planet etc. To explore from there, find somewhere to settle, to defend, to attack, to trade. That is kinda the NMS side of it. Bases etc will be very different in terms of modules currently planned but should hopefully make a viable direction and reason for all of the other gameplay loops to feed around.

And all those gameplay loops feed into wanting to purchase other ships, upgrade them, repair them, paint them etc. That goes full circle. At moment we have the gameplay loop there now you can rent and purchase ships in game and you can do some basic gameplay.

So yeah at least that is a view for me on where SC is now and a little on where it looks to be going over the next few patch releases.

If you want to have a look through in more detail this page is handy https://starcitizen.tools/Star_Citizen_Wiki
 
Soldato
Joined
22 Jul 2012
Posts
15,885
Location
London
@Grim5 To expand a little on this part of @Curlyriff 's post:

Missions
  • Delivery
Collect packages from one location and deliver them to another for varying amounts of money.
  • Maintenance
Go somewhere and collect some form of waste that you either sell or dispose of
  • Mercenary
Escort NPC ships and defend them from pirate attacks
Clear out a nest of outlaw ships and/or mobile sentries
Go down to a planet, take out the sentry turrets with your ship, then land and and clear out the bunker in an FPS mission
Etc...
  • ECN Alert
Usually random protection missions that pop up. Accept or ignore.
  • Investigation
Locate a missing (dead) person, usually in a cave. Earn more by FPS mining valuable ore while you're there.
Investigate a wrecked ship. Locate the black box and/or account for the lost crew.
  • Bounty Hunting
Accept missions to hunt down criminal NPC's or even better, other players with a crimestat rating.



All of these things can be done with friends via mission sharing. Nothing like teaming up to hunt down player bounties or take out a fleet of pirates :D

Then there's mining ore. Do it in a dedicated mining ship, or on foot in caves, planet surfaces, or out in the asteroid belt if you know how to get there.
Depending on your tastes, it's either tedious or chill. FWIW, it's something I enjoy, and it can be very profitable.

Perhaps you prefer trading? Using a ship that has some degree of cargo capacity, you buy and sell various commodities, travelling from one moon/planet/station to another.
What do you do with all this money you're trying to earn? Buy guns/armour etc, upgrade your ship systems/weapons, or even save to buy ships in game.
You can look at it as grinding for credits, or you can enjoy the process. It really depends on you.

There is no hand holding story here. It's an open world, go find your niche kind of thing that really works best when you find other people to play with - and you will if you interact via the game chat. The community is generally really good.

While I'm loving it, play it daily and have no regrets, I'm not sure I'd recommend it to a friend as things stand. There is plenty to do and it's lovely to look at, but it is still an alpha, and you may want to wait and see how things develop before you invest.
Right now, there are a fair few bugs, but it's improving and most of us just deal with and have a lot of fun regardless.
 
Soldato
Joined
22 Nov 2009
Posts
13,252
Location
Under the hot sun.
But like, what is there to do in the game? The game's website is very confusing to navigate

Have you considered to play X4 Foundations? It has more stuff to do in the game than SC, like participate in factional warfare. Build stations and supply lines.
Do missions from just courrier, to trade, to search for things, take over ships or even build stations. On a proper TRUE background simulator where every NPC is fully simulated and persistent.

-----------------------------

lol this guy...
lol at this project an all it's supporters.

Guess what. Another year another list of changes to what was promised just a month ago to have the ship sales going.
Thats 7th year in row, Roberts pulls the same holiday season scam.
Many in here laughed when we pointed over half decade ago that the game won't be released even by 2020. And here we are talking now for not even been released by 2030......

 
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