Fix it rather than flinging it in land-fill?

[rxodium]

How valuable is my time and money. If it's more than the item that needs fixing, it goes in the bin. If it's less than the item that needs fixing, I'll give it a crack. I think the "right to repair" debate is much more important. Despite legislation in Europe being passed to provide replacement parts to professional repairmen, it's still limiting on the actual consumers ability to repair.

I had to clean the soap and powder drawer of a washing machine last year. Even with legislation passed for 2021, if I had I broken any of the parts, I wouldn't be able to call up my manufacturer and ask for parts, because they'll only supply the parts to "professionals".

 

[stockhausen]

. . . If it's more than the item that needs fixing, it goes in the bin.
. . .
think the "right to repair" debate is much more important.
. . .

Why on Earth would you care?
You are unwilling or unable to repair anything so it can just go to land-fill.

 

[Tinders]

The issue is that to keep our system going, companies need us to keep buying stuff. If we are honest how many of the new bits of tech we buy are that much better than what we have today, phones and tv's are the prime example.

That said, i'd like to repair where i can, i have a degree in Electronics, but I would struggle with a TV unless the problem could be googled, getting a circuit diagram is impossible in some cases, couple that with tiny tiny components. I repair the easy stuff like dysons and washing machines, but microwaves and TV's generally do go to the tip, and yes mine is filled with lots of them. I picked up Kuro from mine, no stand but it was still working.

 

[rxodium]

Why on Earth would you care?
You are unwilling or unable to repair anything so it can just go to land-fill.

Because if it can be repaired, the people should have a right to repair it.... whether I choose to repair or not. Cool your jets.

 

[Monkeynut]

Something I find extremely frustrating dabbling with electronics - how often in consumer stuff just a few pence more makes a huge difference between not really upto the job and robust long life - I guess they want people buying new stuff regularly though but in the current environment I'm surprised that isn't frowned on more.

On a related note I think they should start regulating the car industry to ensure commonality in parts, easy replacement of many consumable, etc. parts and so on and the ability to strip out a lot of it come end of life of the vehicle and reuse much better than is the case today. Too many times I've found vehicles that just to replace a bulb for instance you need to undo like 18 screws, remove two panels and 10 pairs of hands just to do what should be a simple 15 second task

I must admit my Dacia the bulb was literally a 10 second job of removing a cover by hand, pulling back a clip, replacing a bulb and putting it back together. Servicing trivial as well.

 

[Greebo]

i know plenty of wealthy people and they use gumtree.

there will be people from all walks of life who are either ignorant or brain dead or too lazy to sell on stuff. it's not about having too much money to not care. i follow a very affluent woman on ebay who sells stuff that is crazy expensive on there after she is done with it. you are talking £20K cartier jeweleery, etc at substantial discounts.

Some do but an awful lot of people dont bother because of the hassle and having strangers come to the house.

 

[FoxEye]

Now this idea of "Repair events" sounds inspired - and obvious - why just Tooting?.

How often does one see modern TVs and PCs dumped at alleged "recycling" centres? Most of these devices are substantially modular and surely they can often be repaired?

You can't beat planned obsolescence anyhow.

So what if the TV works if the vendor disables all the smart functionality after 5 years? "We're retiring this app for this model. You will no longer be able to do x,y,z. For literally no reason than to sell the newer version."

So yeah, stuff can be made to last longer and you can repair stuff that fails.

But you can't beat the vendor when they choose to stop your perfectly fine older model from doing what it's always been able to do, because it's old.

And then there's the planned obsolescence in things like washing machines, where all new models have sealed drums that can't have their bearings replaced. So once the drum has gone it's off to buy a new washing machine, instead of replacing a $5 part.

Welcome to the world of business. Environment be damned, we've got to shift more product.

 

[FoxEye]

Something I find extremely frustrating dabbling with electronics - how often in consumer stuff just a few pence more makes a huge difference between not really upto the job and robust long life - I guess they want people buying new stuff regularly though but in the current environment I'm surprised that isn't frowned on more.

I'm sure it is frowned on by most of us.

What that doesn't translate into is the company giving a damn. Greta can strut all she likes and you and I can frown all we like, but nothing will change.

If any govt tried to bring in legislation they'd face a massive legal batter with every company under the sun fighting to keep the status quo.

We live in a world where we pay lip service to the environment, but will never take concrete steps to do anything against the vested corporate interests and their profit margins.

e: Call me pessimistic but I don't think we can go against the vested corporate interests. I don't think it's possible. I think our whole civilisation is based on profit first and foremost. Nobody can tell a vendor to increase the longevity of their products. It's just not conceivable. Nobody has the power to do that.

The issue is that to keep our system going, companies need us to keep buying stuff.

This. It's the founding principle of modern society. Thou shalt (must) consume.

If you're not consuming, you're a bad person and you're hurting the economy. Here, have some credit.

e:

It's interesting, is it not, that the only sustainable societies we've ever created are those that subsisted from the land.

Whenever we've moved beyond subsistence, and congregated, not once has any sustainable civilisation been formed. Not once.

And 21st century Western civilisation is as unsustainable as they come. I feel sorry for those who don't understand this.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

You can't beat planned obsolescence anyhow.

So what if the TV works if the vendor disables all the smart functionality after 5 years? "We're retiring this app for this model. You will no longer be able to do x,y,z. For literally no reason than to sell the newer version."

So yeah, stuff can be made to last longer and you can repair stuff that fails.

But you can't beat the vendor when they choose to stop your perfectly fine older model from doing what it's always been able to do, because it's old.

And then there's the planned obsolescence in things like washing machines, where all new models have sealed drums that can't have their bearings replaced. So once the drum has gone it's off to buy a new washing machine, instead of replacing a $5 part.

Welcome to the world of business. Environment be damned, we've got to shift more product.

You can buy a fire stick, chrome cast, etc for £25.

So why would anyone buy a new tv if all it took was a few quid to buy a smart device

 

[FoxEye]

You can buy a fire stick, chrome cast, etc for £25.

So why would anyone buy a new tv if all it took was a few quid to buy a smart device

Fair point. It was merely an example of the strategies that vendors will use to "retire" an old product - even one that still works.

Some of them can be worked around as you suggest.

 

[rebel rebel]

I had to take a Microsoft tablet back to pc world as the charger broke. They then sent it to Germany to be looked at. A month later they sent me a brand new tablet... But with the original charger.
When I went back to PC World they said we don't fix the same problem twice, and I got a full refund, 13 months after I purchased it.

Baffling really. All they had to do was give me a new charger.

 

[Orionaut]

You can't beat planned obsolescence anyhow.

So what if the TV works if the vendor disables all the smart functionality after 5 years? "We're retiring this app for this model. You will no longer be able to do x,y,z. For literally no reason than to sell the newer version."

So yeah, stuff can be made to last longer and you can repair stuff that fails.

But you can't beat the vendor when they choose to stop your perfectly fine older model from doing what it's always been able to do, because it's old.

Welcome to the world of business. Environment be damned, we've got to shift more product.

Windows 7, Windows 7, Windows 7!



AIUI, nearly half of all pc equipment globally (Including a lot of specialist and very expensive medical/industrial equipment) is still running on Windows 7. It is not only doing everything that the users want it to do, it is also incapable of being upgraded to windows 10 because win 10 is too demanding for the older machines, MS dumped backward software compatibility years ago and win 10 drivers etc for older hardware are not available. MS should not be permitted to be able to obsolete hundreds of billions dollars worth (over a Trillion perhaps if you were looking at replacement_with_new cost) of perfectly satisfactory machinary just because they cannot be bothererd to continue supporting the OS.

If they wont do it volentarily, the US Government should do a "standard oil" on their ass and force them to!

 

[adolf hamster]

But that is such a 20th Century approach from the time before people were forced to recognise the looming pollution / rubbish problem.

There was a time (I believe) not so long ago when people seriously convinced themselves that we could continue to "dump" our rubbish in Asia whilst importing their cheap consumer products; they now (optimistically) want us to stack up or bury our rubbish locally while continuing to buy their "disposable" consumer goods.

this is the point, we want to discourage goods being so disposable, so they should be either easily recyclable or have a long service life to compensate.

 

[OLDPHART]

Just repaired my 3year old 49" Samsung curved smart tv loss of sound, via watching a couple of Videos on YouTube.

Most modern tv's have 3 PCB's- mainboard, t-con, power supply and just a few cable's connecting each other.

After taking the back cover off my tv, you could see the 3 PCB'S.

It was the mainboard l had to change, which cost £20 of ebay came tested and 30 day warranty.

The mainboard was easy to replace 4 screws, 3 cable's to reconnect.

Switched it on we have sound job done.

A lot easier to repair than a PC even if its the PSU board or the t-con fails.

Would love to know how much a tv engineer would charge.

Saying that l repaired my oven as well needed a new heating element.

Been building PC's for nearly 20yrs so had no worries opening up my TV.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

Fair point. It was merely an example of the strategies that vendors will use to "retire" an old product - even one that still works.

Some of them can be worked around as you suggest.

I don't think software updates is one of them for a TV tbh.

TV's are constantly innovating. Every year there is a better one or a bigger one or a bigger and better one.

People usually upgrade to get a bigger or better tv not because an app stopped working.

 

[FoxEye]

I don't think software updates is one of them for a TV tbh.

TV's are constantly innovating. Every year there is a better one or a bigger one or a bigger and better one.

People usually upgrade to get a bigger or better tv not because an app stopped working.

At the very least let's call it "gentle encouragement".

Right now we have to use a Fire TV stick on our (not so very old) Samsung because the smart apps no longer work reliably.

That means an extra device and remote.

Now there is an (additional) incentive to drive us towards a new TV, because the smart features will be better (or just work) and maybe we can ditch the Fire TV stick.

But the bigger point is that nobody can force any product vendor to keep supporting their older products.

And fundamentally it's against their interests to make old products fully functional for too long (beyond what society deems to be the min lifespan, aka 3 or 4 years for most electronics).

Someone mentioned Windows 7 above. Not even the US government could force MS to keep supporting Windows 7.

Fundamentally our desire for re-use and recycling is limited by our inability to force producers to support using and maintaining their older products.

 

[Rofflay]

We live in a disposable society sadly, For goods and humans. @FoxEye i have an old HP311c laptop in the kitchen and the keyboards failed. Throw it out right?


Hell no software keyboard to the rescue, I am saving it from landfill until it actually dies. #Doingmybit

 

[Psycho Sonny]

At the very least let's call it "gentle encouragement".

Right now we have to use a Fire TV stick on our (not so very old) Samsung because the smart apps no longer work reliably.

That means an extra device and remote.

Now there is an (additional) incentive to drive us towards a new TV, because the smart features will be better (or just work) and maybe we can ditch the Fire TV stick.

But the bigger point is that nobody can force any product vendor to keep supporting their older products.

And fundamentally it's against their interests to make old products fully functional for too long (beyond what society deems to be the min lifespan, aka 3 or 4 years for most electronics).

Someone mentioned Windows 7 above. Not even the US government could force MS to keep supporting Windows 7.

Fundamentally our desire for re-use and recycling is limited by our inability to force producers to support using and maintaining their older products.

I think this was an issue with older original gen smart tvs.

The tech inside them was crap. The processors and memory not good enough for modern versions.

I used to use a fire 4k TV in the bedroom but ditched that when I got my new Sony.

The downstairs LG is about 3.5 years old and all the apps still work fine.

Yours must be one of the first few generations of smart TV. They were and tbh a lot still are rubbish these days. LG and Samsung seem to be the best.

 

[FoxEye]

I think this was an issue with older original gen smart tvs.

The tech inside them was crap. The processors and memory not good enough for modern versions.

I used to use a fire 4k TV in the bedroom but ditched that when I got my new Sony.

The downstairs LG is about 3.5 years old and all the apps still work fine.

Yours must be one of the first few generations of smart TV. They were and tbh a lot still are rubbish these days. LG and Samsung seem to be the best.

If the ecosystems weren't totally closed people could install and upgrade their own apps.

The open source community can do wonders even with older hardware. Even with really old hardware.

It's undeniable that having a closed system and not fixing bugs or updating apps in older models is done to drive uptake of newer models. It's really not controversial - we all know this is 99% of the reason.

Once something is 4 or 5 years old it's left to die. Even simple fixes are not implemented. Nothing is upgraded despite (most likely) there not being a technical impediment to doing so.

eg: on my oldish Samsung app the browser no longer works. Nor does the Netflix app. It would probably be extremely simple to push a newer browser version or a newer Netflix app. But they aren't available because the Samsung store is closed system, and they won't let you update.

 

[arknor]

OP you want to see why recycling is a waste of time then get a job at one of those companies who specialise in recycling
check out the computers, graphics cards, cpus etc that big business is literally throwing away instead of donating to schools or whatever.

its INSANE that we are the ones being lectured to recycle but big business is throwing away computers just a few years old.

theres hdds and ssds not damaged physically as well, bet they are covered in TBs of people data