Soldato
A lot of people are forgetting how poor the first two series of TNG was. It wasn't until series 3 that TNG really got good. Perhaps this will be the same.
New Star Trek series - 2017
- Thread starter Spit
- Start date
Soldato
@PlacidCasual - stick with it. It gets far, far worse 
Yeah, but at least season 1 and 2 of TNG had their moments. First season, you've got stuff like "Where No One Has Gone Before", "11001001", "The Arsenal of Freedom", "Heart of Glory" and "Conspiracy". All decent episodes. Hell, even add "Hide and Q" because John DeLancie makes anything better. Most of the rest of them had bits that worked, bits that didn't. Truly terrible episodes? "Justice" is pretty awful. So is "Angel One". And "When the Bough Breaks". But a special mention for "Code of Honor" which has no redeeming features at all beyond the fact that the end credits eventually come up. Badly written, badly made.
TNG S2 had "A Matter of Honor", "The Measure of a Man", "Time Squared", "Q Who" and "Peak Peformance" which were all good. A whole bunch of fairly dull episodes, plus the change in doctor not helping. And some out-and-out terrible episodes ("The Royale", "Manhunt", "Up The Long Ladder" is pretty sucky, and the execrable "Shades of Gray" clipshow made on no budget and half the time that they'd usually have for an episode).
An aside - lots of STD fans point to TNG and say 'well, the first two seasons of that were rubbish'. Leaving aside my disputing of that 'fact', I don't get why that is any kind of defence for STD having been bloody awful at times?
Yeah, but at least season 1 and 2 of TNG had their moments. First season, you've got stuff like "Where No One Has Gone Before", "11001001", "The Arsenal of Freedom", "Heart of Glory" and "Conspiracy". All decent episodes. Hell, even add "Hide and Q" because John DeLancie makes anything better. Most of the rest of them had bits that worked, bits that didn't. Truly terrible episodes? "Justice" is pretty awful. So is "Angel One". And "When the Bough Breaks". But a special mention for "Code of Honor" which has no redeeming features at all beyond the fact that the end credits eventually come up. Badly written, badly made.
TNG S2 had "A Matter of Honor", "The Measure of a Man", "Time Squared", "Q Who" and "Peak Peformance" which were all good. A whole bunch of fairly dull episodes, plus the change in doctor not helping. And some out-and-out terrible episodes ("The Royale", "Manhunt", "Up The Long Ladder" is pretty sucky, and the execrable "Shades of Gray" clipshow made on no budget and half the time that they'd usually have for an episode).
An aside - lots of STD fans point to TNG and say 'well, the first two seasons of that were rubbish'. Leaving aside my disputing of that 'fact', I don't get why that is any kind of defence for STD having been bloody awful at times?
I know it was a different time and they needed to fill the air time but I'd love to have seen what a 10 episode condensed season of tng utilising the budget of a normal 24(?) ep run would have looked like. With the time to shoot and prep of a full season too. They had some great writers.
We're definitely a lot less forgiving of dips in quality these days.
We're definitely a lot less forgiving of dips in quality these days.
Soldato
If you can find a copy of it, you guys should watch "Chaos On The Bridge" - a documentary made by William Shatner about the behind-the-scenes mess that TNG came out of. It's truly amazing that it turned out as well as it did. The cliff's notes:
- Gene Roddenberry fought like hell to retain control of his 'baby', past the point of reason
- His lawyer (Leonard Maizlish) was going around altering scripts (a big no-no and violation of WGA rules!) and generally infuriating the writers and makers of the show
- All the Original Series veterans who had joined the show at Gene's request to help him make it were gone by the end of the first season, mostly due to Maizlish
- Gene wasn't a well man and was getting progressively worse
- Season 2 saw the '88 WGA strike (which is why S2 is 22 episodes not 26), infighting, and control of the show finally being wrestled out of Gene's grasp by Rick Berman and Michael Piller
Soldato
- Joined
- 13 May 2003
- Posts
- 8,850
Ok I’m up to episode 4 as E4 shows them. It’s ok, nicely made not too ridiculous although the Spore Drive is a dumb idea. Good luck retconning that out later on. Burnham is ok, if not particularly likeable. No major missteps so far.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 21 Nov 2004
- Posts
- 45,037
Season 2 gets better.
I noticed it on E4 yesterday (Sunday at 9pm). Is that a sign of everyone having watched it on Netflix and so little audience left or that it is rubbish and no broadcaster wanted it in a decent time slot? Possibly a little of both?
I guess the Netflix exclusive rights ran out and E4 got the broadcast rights.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 21 Nov 2004
- Posts
- 45,037
Sorry, what I meant is that it is in such a terrible time slot on a pretty quiet channel.
Soldato
- Joined
- 13 May 2003
- Posts
- 8,850
So I've got the first Mirror Universe episode( ep9?), I'm actually quite enjoying the show. Burnham still isn't that likeable and yes she is the centre of all of the action all of the time. I think this is a failure of writing they've fallen into a trap by having a non-episodic show and trying to keep the number of characters actively involved low all the effort falls on the same characters and Burnham above all. If this had been thought out better I think roles should have been more widely shared as seen in other Trek.
The changes from canon are not preferable but they are tolerable. I still think the spore drive is dumb and plainly canon breaking but I just try to ignore it. Lorca remains the most interesting character and I'm liking the Tyler twist that no doubt will soon be revealed. Just hope they don't screw the pooch on that one.
The changes from canon are not preferable but they are tolerable. I still think the spore drive is dumb and plainly canon breaking but I just try to ignore it. Lorca remains the most interesting character and I'm liking the Tyler twist that no doubt will soon be revealed. Just hope they don't screw the pooch on that one.
Man of Honour
- Joined
- 21 Nov 2004
- Posts
- 45,037
Keep watching, it isn’t.
The show definitely improved once the mirror universe story started.
Still loads of problems with it though.
Soldato
The spore drive is a great concept, but it's just not Star Trek. Kurtzman knew this when he plagiarized the entire idea from Anas Abdin, of course, and he and the rest the lazy Disco writers have struggled with integrating that in to ST cannon since.
Soldato
)
Soldato
The problem is if they fudge it then that ruins Trek for a while as its not a viable money maker, so if they are going to do it they should do it properly, or not at all.
Associate
- Joined
- 1 Aug 2009
- Posts
- 1,625
I cannot see this happening, it would not make any money
Everyone knows that except Abrams, Kurtzman, and the executives at CBS. That's why I won't be surprised to see it happen and tank right into the ground.
STD is done at the end of Series 3. Netflix bailed out. CBS threatened to sue, Netflix won at arbitration, and STD had to do two months of reshoots to finish out the series.
Soldato
Thought I’d read somewhere it’d been okayed up to season 5?
Soldato
I wish CBS just sold it back to paramount and we can get back to normal trek type series.