RAM speed on B450 Mortar Max

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 09:49

Not sure if this is a RAM or Motherboard issue, so posting it in general.

I built a new rig for my eldest on his birthday as follows:
MSI B450 Mortar Max
Ryzen 5 2600
Team Group Dark T-Force 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-25600C16 3200MHz kit

The RAM defaults to 2400MHz, as expected. After installing Windows and getting everything up and running, I tried to get the RAM up to its rated speed.

Nothing doing. It won't POST at either XMP profile. Just goes through the failed POST loop and defaults back to 2400MHz.

After a bit more experimenting, it seems that I can't actually change the RAM speed from default at all. Even trying it at 2800MHz, 2600MHz. It refuses to POST.

The fact that it will only POST at default speeds and allow no changes at all makes me lean towards seeing this as a motherboard issue. I wonder if I need to try changing some other settings that might not be tracking the XMP? Something like RAM voltage (goes to 1.37 for 3200MHz XMP it seems), or SoC voltage? Anything else?

Any suggestions would be gratefully received. The lad is very happy with the PC as it is, and I know the RAM speed won't make much of a difference, but I can't leave it alone...

VaderDSL · 28 Mar 2020 at 10:05

You’ll need to mess with Ram, SOC, VDDP, VDDG voltages probably.

I have a b450 tomahawk max with team group 3600mhz ram.

XMP would result in the machine not even getting passed the CPU debug led check. I could get up to 2900 ish MHz on the ram at stock volts any higher it would fail to post.

I had to increase SOC, VDDP, VDDG volts to :

keenan · 28 Mar 2020 at 10:08

Have you updated the motherboard to the latest bios?

Try to manually set the memory speed instead of using XMP.

Set DRAM voltage to 1.35v
Set SOC voltage to 1.1v

Reboot to bios again.

Now set Memory speed to 3200Mhz with timing on Auto and see if that posts..

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 11:12

Cheers, guys. I will try those settings once he has a screen time break in a bit. Good to know what are safe voltages to be putting in. I've never had to alter SoC volts before, nor bothered tinkering with RAM beyond standard profiles.

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 14:16

Okay, had another play around, and a couple of things are worth noting.

1. Inputting the settings from Ryzen DRAM calulcator don't work. I even imported the XMP settings for the RAM. It won't POST even at safe 3200MHz settings, 1.37 RAM voltage, 1.025 SoC at set out in RDC under recommended settings). It looks like I just can't change anything on the RAM settings without it refusing to POST.

2. The RAM is this set, bought from here not long ago:
My basket at Overclockers UK:

1 x Team Group Dark T-Force 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-25600C16 3200MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black/Grey (TDGED4= £89.99

Total: £98.69 (includes shipping: £8.70)

It clearly says on the first line under the product description that it's Samsung B-die RAM, but CPU-Z and Thaiphoon report it as Hynix. The listed voltage support is also wrong (as would be expected given it's the wrong RAM manufacturer). I don't know what's happened here with respect to the product listing, but I did buy this thinking it was B-die, so I'm a bit miffed to find this out.

Wondering if this is an issue with the BIOS as @keenan suggested. Not sure if it's worth the risk of updating the BIOS right now for a few fps increased on the lad's games, but this is annoying.

LuckyBenski · 28 Mar 2020 at 15:08

strumpusplunket said:
It clearly says on the first line under the product description that it's Samsung B-die RAM, but CPU-Z and Thaiphoon report it as Hynix. The listed voltage support is also wrong (as would be expected given it's the wrong RAM manufacturer). I don't know what's happened here with respect to the product listing, but I did buy this thinking it was B-die, so I'm a bit miffed to find this out.

This is concerning. Was the RAM factory sealed or is there a chance it could have been switched / mistaken for another pack? I'd check the labels and the package. Vulcan use those heatsinks for a lot of different RAM sets.

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:11

UnLuckyBenski said:
This is concerning. Was the RAM factory sealed or is there a chance it could have been switched / mistaken for another pack? I'd check the labels and the package. Vulcan use those heatsinks for a lot of different RAM sets.

Tbh, I'm not sure, as it was a birthday present, my son opened it. I didn't notice anything amiss with the packaging when I wrapped it, but then I didn't really check and I didn't open it myself.

I think I'll raise this in the CS forum and see what they say.

VaderDSL · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:16

What was the SKU/manufacturer part number on the invoice?

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:18

VaderDSL said:
What was the SKU/manufacturer part number on the invoice?

The stock ID on the invoice matches the stock ID on the product page linked above, but only the first six characters of the MPN appear.

Edit: Just dug out the packet. The stock ID and MPN matches the listing, but the RAM is not Samsung B-die, and is not 1.35V for 3200MHz on the SPD...

VaderDSL · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:32

strumpusplunket said:
The stock ID on the invoice matches the stock ID on the product page linked above, but only the first six characters of the MPN appear.

Edit: Just dug out the packet. The stock ID and MPN matches the listing, but the RAM is not Samsung B-die, and is not 1.35V for 3200MHz on the SPD...

Jeez, well good luck with the ticket!

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:37

VaderDSL said:
Jeez, well good luck with the ticket!

Cheers.

I mean, I'm still thinking that even if it is Hynix RAM, I should be able to change the RAM settings a little bit without it completely refusing to POST?

But yeah, will see what OcUK say...

orbitalwalsh · 28 Mar 2020 at 16:55

Ryzen 2*** still fun and games with ram. 3*** much easier even on older gen boards

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 17:17

orbitalwalsh said:
Ryzen 2*** still fun and games with ram. 3*** much easier even on older gen boards

I thought the 4** boards were better, too? I've got two other Ryzen 2600s (one X, one non-X) in other systems, and fortunately found the experience to be pretty much set XMP and go. This is the first issue I've had. Don't know whether to blame the board, BIOS, CPU or RAM, tbh.

Joxeon · 28 Mar 2020 at 17:51

strumpusplunket said:
I thought the 4** boards were better, too? I've got two other Ryzen 2600s (one X, one non-X) in other systems, and fortunately found the experience to be pretty much set XMP and go. This is the first issue I've had. Don't know whether to blame the board, BIOS, CPU or RAM, tbh.

Have you tested the ram on your board to see if it still has the same problem and vice versa with your ram in your sons board?

strumpusplunket · 28 Mar 2020 at 18:00

Joxeon said:
Have you tested the ram on your board to see if it still has the same problem and vice versa with your ram in your sons board?

Heh-heh, no not yet!

I know this is an obvious step in the troubleshooting process, but I was hoping to find an easier solution before getting to that, 'cause it is a little bit of a pain. Probably I will get around to trying over the rest of the weekend, though.

freddie64 · 29 Mar 2020 at 09:54

Regarding the product listing.

When OCUK started sell the RAM it may have been Samsung B-die, but the manufacturer may have changed it to Hynix and never told OCUK about the change.

If you are thinking of sending them back i would exchange for this RAM.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cruc...gb-kit-2-x-8gb-ddr4-3200-udimm-my-20b-cr.html

chippy08 · 29 Mar 2020 at 10:21

The price of the Ballistix sport has gone up nearly £50 is there a lack of ram around.

strumpusplunket · 29 Mar 2020 at 12:21

freddie64 said:
Regarding the product listing.

When OCUK started sell the RAM it may have been Samsung B-die, but the manufacturer may have changed it to Hynix and never told OCUK about the change.

If you are thinking of sending them back i would exchange for this RAM.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cruc...gb-kit-2-x-8gb-ddr4-3200-udimm-my-20b-cr.html

Yeah, I guess this is what happened. I found a review site talking about expecting b-die with these, but finding out they were Hynix in CPU-Z. Should still be able to get it to run faster. That Balilistix does look better RAM. I don't remember noticing that when pricing up the build, so maybe I overlooked it. Only £10 more than what I paid for the TeamGroup stuff, too.

Starting to think that, despite feeling a bit put-out that it's not b-die RAM, it's not going to be worth the hassle of sending it back.

It should still work better than it does, so I still think something else is going on here, and as has been said, if the Ryzen 3*** series and above do have better memory controllers and play more easily with RAM it should end up being okay when we upgrade the CPU anyway.

Now to decide if I can be bothered to start swapping RAM between the PCs in the house to see what we can do (which will include dragging the lad off his PC long enough to mess around with it, which he's not keen on since he only got it on Friday...)

strumpusplunket · 2 Apr 2020 at 21:19

Ok, so I stripped down and rebuilt the system this evening since I was adding some case fans anyway, and when I booted back up I had another play around in the BIOS and... well, the RAM works at its rated speed now.

So I don't really know what was wrong, but looks like it might have been a bad connection somewhere.

The fact that it's Hynix and not b-die is still a bit galling, and will surely impact its overclocking potential when we upgrade and push the system some more, but I don't think I can be bothered returning it now given it works at 3200MHz okay.

JollysH1 · 4 Apr 2020 at 22:20

According to the latest info from MSI That RAM isn't on the supported list https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/B450M-MORTAR-MAX#support-mem-14
Not sure how important that is.