Boiler - Repair or New?

[zom247]

Had a Worcester Greenstar 24i installed for just over 11 years now, been great but recently it's been loosing pressure. Topping up works for a day or so and then it drops back to zero. Had my annual gas safety done the other day and he said the expansion vessel has gone and needs replacing. All seems simple enough but apparently this boiler has to be removed from the wall, system drained and it's going to take a whole day which he's quoted me almost £500.

If it's going to cost this much to repair I'm thinking it might be worth putting that money towards a new one. If I go down the new boiler route would it be worth getting a combi boiler? The house is 3 bedrooms, bathroom and an Aqua Lisa power shower with the pump in the loft, tank in airing cupboard and water tank in the loft. The current boiler is in the kitchen and if we went the combi route I'd like it put upstairs in the airing cupboard if possible. However, when we had the Greenstar installed I seem to remember that the plumber said it would be a real pain putting it upstairs due to piping etc and so it was easier to replace in the kitchen. Not sure how having a power shower would be like with a combi.

My sister had a new boiler installed last year by Heatable and she said they were excellent. Anyone here used them?

Thanks for any help

 

[Pabl0]

Ask him to quote for an external expansion vessel instead.

 

[Danm54]

Shouldn't need a full drain down for that, the iso valves on Worcesters are normally very good and won't leak.
Change the PRV while it's off the wall as well, they can get debris on the valve seat once they've had a bit of use.

There's probably not that much difference in price to fit an external one, I'd allow time to drain down for fitting an external vessel just incase the system didn't hold a vacuum while I fitted a tee.

Either way, £500 sounds excessive.

 

[The_One]

Hes ripping you off

can fit a remote vessel ideal place is in the airing cupboard where your hot water tank is

2 hours max job

 

[pallys]

Ripping you off should cost half that, but I bet it don't even need replacing.

When you say top-up do you mean with water?

I've had a gas guy saying the same to me in the past also and had to tell him to switch boiler back on and leave - he tried to decommission it wanted £250 to change vessel

Anyway, when you press the Schrader valve you shouldn't get any water coming out, bit of initial mist is ok. If water comes out of valve then vessel needs changing as internal diaphragm broken. Else Keep pressing until no more air.comes out. Now Get boiler pressure to like 0.1bar either by draining water or topping up with water.

Connect bike tyre pump to Schrader valve and pump until needle goes from 0.1 to 1 bar, on a cooled.down boiler.

If that doesn't work then get another gas guy to come in and change prv and repressure vessel, as prv probably leaking also.

If not confident then get another gasman to do it for you, definitely don't change prv yourself.

What your gas guy should have done is repressure the vessel, it's part of the service,. usually have to ask, mine loses pressure every 4 years.so I ask.for it to be topped up. My first guy I asked to.topup and he said look needle moving is broken. Idiot. If you pressurise to atmosphere it won't move but he was.still pressuring to closed system.so needle moves.

Schrader valve on mine is knackered so i got a valve extension on it with a better sealed cap with rubber washer so air don't leak.

 

[moon man]

can also be the chrome bendy pipe connecting expansion vessel to system or it was on mine once ,solid with gunk ,got a doner boiler so i swapped over tank anyway ,oil boiler though so i do some stuff to it myself ,pump motor solenoid ,diverter valve ,but i let my heating guy do the tank and prv ,80 quid including service

 

[fobose]

My old house had a Worcester boiler, I think it too was a 24i (sounds very familar). Anyway, I had the same issue but the guy said it's so much labour to put a new one in, an external one would be cheaper. He charged me £170. Took about 30mins to complete.

 

[DampDog]

Ditto. My old Vaillant boiler started losing pressure on a regular basis a couple of years back (boiler is 14 years old) Fitted an external expansion tank in the airing cupboard. Took him about 2 hours and set me back £160. Touchwood, it's been absolutely fine since.

It is tricky with old boilers. There is always a worry that what if something else goes wrong due to age it may become a money pit. That said expansion vessels in particular, do wear out and are an easy fix.

 

[zom247]

Ripping you off should cost half that, but I bet it don't even need replacing.

When you say top-up do you mean with water?

I've had a gas guy saying the same to me in the past also and had to tell him to switch boiler back on and leave - he tried to decommission it wanted £250 to change vessel

Anyway, when you press the Schrader valve you shouldn't get any water coming out, bit of initial mist is ok. If water comes out of valve then vessel needs changing as internal diaphragm broken. Else Keep pressing until no more air.comes out. Now Get boiler pressure to like 0.1bar either by draining water or topping up with water.

Connect bike tyre pump to Schrader valve and pump until needle goes from 0.1 to 1 bar, on a cooled.down boiler.

If that doesn't work then get another gas guy to come in and change prv and repressure vessel, as prv probably leaking also.

If not confident then get another gasman to do it for you, definitely don't change prv yourself.

What your gas guy should have done is repressure the vessel, it's part of the service,. usually have to ask, mine loses pressure every 4 years.so I ask.for it to be topped up. My first guy I asked to.topup and he said look needle moving is broken. Idiot. If you pressurise to atmosphere it won't move but he was.still pressuring to closed system.so needle moves.

Schrader valve on mine is knackered so i got a valve extension on it with a better sealed cap with rubber washer so air don't leak.

No idea what a Schrader valve is mate! It's loosing pressure all the time I think. It was re-pressurised and now it's back down to zero on the dial. Had another gas bod in and first thing he said was put an expansion vessel in the airing cupboard where the tank is and it would probably cost about £250. Spoke to my original guy again and he's going to do me another quote for external expansion vessel fitting, he was already going to change the PRV so we'll see what price he comes back with.

Just had a look at that valve and sure he tested that. I topped it up with water via the filling loop.

 

[Bug One]

If it's loosing pressure - then I'd want to know why and were from. It's probably not the boiler itself. More likely a tiny leak somewhere in the pipework. That's what needs investigating.

As for fixing the boiler itself - Worcester themselves do a fixed price call-out for £275. Any issues with the boiler are covered under that.

 

[The_One]

If it's loosing pressure - then I'd want to know why and were from. It's probably not the boiler itself. More likely a tiny leak somewhere in the pipework. That's what needs investigating.

As for fixing the boiler itself - Worcester themselves do a fixed price call-out for £275. Any issues with the boiler are covered under that.

If the expansion vessel is gone it will lose pressure out the prv when pressure goes too high

As for Worcester its FROM 275 and it doesn't cover everything

 

[Bug One]

If the expansion vessel is gone it will lose pressure out the prv when pressure goes too high

As for Worcester its FROM 275 and it doesn't cover everything

I used them them last year. It's £275 unless a limited set of extreme issues.

"Boiler repairs will cover your Worcester boiler and its Worcester controls for labour, VAT and most parts. However, should the boiler require a significant/structural part, (such as a shell, a tank or back plate), or if the boiler is beyond economical repair, then the engineer will quote a revised charge on the day."

 

[LeeUK]

Going to end up paying more to have an old water cylinder system ripped out and combi put in compared to a combi-combi swap job.

 

[PiKe]

Get a quote from a different plumber.

 

[The_One]

I used them them last year. It's £275 unless a limited set of extreme issues.

"Boiler repairs will cover your Worcester boiler and its Worcester controls for labour, VAT and most parts. However, should the boiler require a significant/structural part, (such as a shell, a tank or back plate), or if the boiler is beyond economical repair, then the engineer will quote a revised charge on the day."

I can tell you now

1) Worcester will not take a boiler off the wall for £275

2) Worcester will not carry out work on rest of the system and fit an external vessel

 

[Bug One]

I can tell you now

1) Worcester will not take a boiler off the wall for £275

2) Worcester will not carry out work on rest of the system and fit an external vessel

He's been quoted £500+ for fixing an expansion vessel - which would be fixed for £275 by going to Worcester directly.

No need to take it off the wall or fit an external vessel. Instead of bodging it - get it fixed properly, for less.

 

[The_One]

He's been quoted £500+ for fixing an expansion vessel - which would be fixed for £275 by going to Worcester directly.

No need to take it off the wall or fit an external vessel. Instead of bodging it - get it fixed properly, for less.

If the Worcester boiler is fitted close to the ceiling or close to something above it the boiler will have to come off the wall to remove the vessel

 

[zom247]

He's been quoted £500+ for fixing an expansion vessel - which would be fixed for £275 by going to Worcester directly.

No need to take it off the wall or fit an external vessel. Instead of bodging it - get it fixed properly, for less.

I've been quoted almost £500 for draining the system, removing boiler from the wall, changing the PRV and replacing the expansion vessel in the boiler. Most of the cost is labour as he reckons it will take all day.

It has to be taken off the wall for a new expansion vessel to be fitted - been told that by 3 different gas engineers now. Also been told that it's cheaper to have an external expansion vessel fitted and it will do the same job. Currently waiting for some more quotes for the external option and going to call Worcester as they have an Out of Guarantee Service which is what I think you've mentioned.

 

[zom247]

If the Worcester boiler is fitted close to the ceiling or close to something above it the boiler will have to come off the wall to remove the vessel

Yes, this is why. Was fitted pretty close to the ceiling when installed.

 

[pallys]

Out of interest, when you got gas man round ask em which boiler they recommend where vessel can be replaced without having to take boiler off wall. Seems like wb moved to a bad design.

I got a bosch where vessel can be changed without boiler off wall, is from 2003.

Parents got a Bosch where gas man fitted an external vessel as part of the install which I though was really clever thinking. That was around 2010.