Motorsport Off Topic Thread

b0rn2sk8 · 24 Jun 2020 at 11:08

I don’t doubt they have split them into separate companies under one holding company but how they have structured things like loans and assets around it has a huge impact.

It’s well known that inter group loans from one division to another can take the whole lot if one goes under.

Either way it sounds like a right mess over there.

Steampunk · 24 Jun 2020 at 11:09

b0rn2sk8 said:
Whts gone wrong there? By the sounds of it the road car division has tanked the whole group? I guess the F1 team hasn’t exactly helped recently either.

The problem with McLaren is they've been doing very poorly on the track for the last few year (less F1 income) and rich people who can afford their road cars don't buy them in a pandemic if they can't go out shopping for cars and then driving them around. McLaren have a lot of debt from having to buy out Ron Dennis, and the shutdown of F1 has happened just when they need an income and cash flow to run the team, road cars, and service their debts.

Now they are trying to get loans on the same assets twice, hence going to court. They people who hold the historic cars as collateral for the first loan are miffed at McLaren effectively trying to sell them again to someone else as collateral for a second loan.

The debtors might be willing to make a deal rather than see McLaren (and their money) go down the drain, but if they see it as throwing good money after bad, they might prefer to see McLaren go down, pick over the bones of the company, and get their money back by selling the historic cars and other assets they would be left with in the event of a McLaren bankruptcy.

Mr Jack · 24 Jun 2020 at 11:37

this_is_gav said:
Frankly if it looked like a noose and those in other garages didn't, then I can understand the initial outcry, given the issues in America and elsewhere at the moment. If every garage's pull cord was the same then it's stupid to have ropes fashioned like nooses, but obviously NASCAR will look idiotic themselves too.

My guess, is that someone had tied up the cord in the way that leaves a loop hanging at the end, and the rope coiled above it rather than it actually being tied in a noose. Someone saw it and hastily overreacted. There's apparently video showing that it was there in 2019 so perhaps it will come to light.

Wallace himself never saw the noose in person and didn't say all that much on the matter either. NASCAR itself rushed to a conclusion and they were the leading voice of disgust (rightly, if only morally).

To be honest, it's not been a total catastrophe. It's further endorsement of NASCAR's (public at least) relatively fresh approach in opening up to minorities, much to the fury of some of their supposed hardcore fans. NASCAR is still a very, very southern sport and its local fans have a reputation for being notoriously closed in their acceptance of anyone who doesn't fall within their exact beliefs. It's good that NASCAR has again stood up against those voices so there is that.

Yeah, making the mistake looks foolish, but overall I think NASCAR come of this looking good: they reacted correctly to the situation as they thought it was.

Steampunk · 24 Jun 2020 at 12:04

Mr Jack said:
Yeah, making the mistake looks foolish, but overall I think NASCAR come of this looking good: they reacted correctly to the situation as they thought it was.

In most situations, it's better to check the facts and then react correctly, instead of a knee-jerk response that's the wrong thing to do because you didn't find the facts and reality of a situation first.

hominid · 24 Jun 2020 at 20:49

It's all about virtue-signalling these days.. Report a noose, give the guy a parade quick to placate anticipated mob influx - it would only take less than 10 seconds to see that it was not a noose.

They are making things up to try to keep racial tensions high, I think, in the hope that some loon white, or black, supremacist goes postal. Even after it's been proven false the media, mainly CNN and MSNBC, are still pushing it as truth. Bubba is still trying to carry it on even though it's been 100% discounted, people are idiots.

It's Smollett 2.0. The media are pushing the narrative instead of just reporting, the constant barrage of crap day after day just doesn't stop - it feels like the world has gone to pot over the last few months and will continue the downward spiral.

413x · 25 Jun 2020 at 13:30

Wonder how good the racing point "cough" old merc "cough" will be?

It will surely scoop up 4th at the least! Maybe even 3rd.

I know it's within the rules , but it's tough for likes of the independent mid field

Prize money for 4th
-
(Car costs from buying merc 2019 car
+ team costs and drivers etc)

= profit?

If so, proceed!

this_is_gav · 25 Jun 2020 at 14:18

413x said:
Wonder how good the racing point "cough" old merc "cough" will be?

It will surely scoop up 4th at the least! Maybe even 3rd.

Probably, but it's rarely that simple. They might be fourth fastest, but Williams were faster than Red Bull for much of 2014, and more reliable, and they still finished 85 points behind them in the championship.

The teams with better resources will often have the strategy and nous to overcome sheer speed. Someone should remind Ferrari of that.

JRS · 25 Jun 2020 at 17:50

Regarding the NASCAR noose debacle:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1276191344491401220

It does look a little bit noose-y. I think the crew member who reported it could be forgiven for thinking that it was tied like that as a statement.

Mr Jack · 25 Jun 2020 at 18:59

JRS said:
It does look a little bit noose-y. I think the crew member who reported it could be forgiven for thinking that it was tied like that as a statement.

Yeah, 100% reasonable to think that was tied as a noose and when it happens to be present only in the garage of the one black guy...

Flibster · 25 Jun 2020 at 21:28

JRS said:
Regarding the NASCAR noose debacle:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1276191344491401220

It does look a little bit noose-y. I think the crew member who reported it could be forgiven for thinking that it was tied like that as a statement.

There's a sort of noosey theme to it.

englishpremier · 25 Jun 2020 at 21:46

413x said:
Wonder how good the racing point "cough" old merc "cough" will be?

It will surely scoop up 4th at the least! Maybe even 3rd.

I know it's within the rules , but it's tough for likes of the independent mid field

Prize money for 4th
-
(Car costs from buying merc 2019 car
+ team costs and drivers etc)

= profit?

If so, proceed!

They don't have a Merc car though since aero can't be shared. All they can do is try their best to copy those bits. A bit like Haas, that haven't been particularly quick other than on one or two occasions.

And if another midfield team can't beat a 1 year old car design, then they deserve what they get.

vanpeebles · 25 Jun 2020 at 22:07

The best thing McLaren have made in recent years was those hospital trolleys.

this_is_gav · 29 Jun 2020 at 11:26

Mercedes new 2020 livery.

We will race in black in 2020, as a public pledge to improve the diversity of our team – and a clear statement that we stand against racism and all forms of discrimination.

https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/en/news/2020/06/silver-arrows-return-racing-renewed-purpose/

That looks mean as ...

Greboth · 29 Jun 2020 at 11:32

Oooo I like that. A simple colour change it's gone from one of the blandest to one of the best looking cars.

UTmaniac · 29 Jun 2020 at 15:00

It will get banned at any night race, too ninja.

Ninco! · 30 Jun 2020 at 18:00

It does look good!

Wish the fancy steering had been used - its going to remain as one of those eternal what if questions!

CaptainRAVE · 30 Jun 2020 at 22:49

Ninco! said:
It does look good!

Wish the fancy steering had been used - its going to remain as one of those eternal what if questions!

Oh, they aren’t using it? Have they said that officially now? I thought the latest was that they were considering using it in Austria. I really want to see it in action.

Loving the new livery. One of my all time favourites.

this_is_gav · 1 Jul 2020 at 09:15

They're free to use it for this season if they choose to, and I've not seen them saying they won't.

I suspect it depends on the track and tyre performance in practice. If it's there to control tyre temperatures or wear as expected, and that outweighs (pardon the pun) the weight penalty (or careful placement of ballast) then they'll run it.

Frankly, if they suspect they've got a car vastly quicker than everyone else then they might not need to run it or use it anyway, just to avoid any potential protests (as empty as they appear at the moment).

MissChief · 1 Jul 2020 at 11:02

this_is_gav said:
They're free to use it for this season if they choose to, and I've not seen them saying they won't.

I suspect it depends on the track and tyre performance in practice. If it's there to control tyre temperatures or wear as expected, and that outweighs (pardon the pun) the weight penalty (or careful placement of ballast) then they'll run it.

Frankly, if they suspect they've got a car vastly quicker than everyone else then they might not need to run it or use it anyway, just to avoid any potential protests (as empty as they appear at the moment).

Red Bull said if they used it they’d lodge an official protest. If that protest gets upheld both Mercedes cars could be excluded from the results. Given that the season is likely to be at most 12-15 races losing that much ground in both the WDC and WCC isn’t something Mercedes wants to take a chance with. It also sounds a little like they aren’t that confident they have the fastest car again.

JRS · 1 Jul 2020 at 11:12

MissChief said:
It also sounds a little like they aren’t that confident they have the fastest car again.

Meh. Heard that one before. I'm pretty sure that they'll be quickest once this circus gets going.