Yeah I get you. I think it's fairly straightforwards though: the performance they offer relative to new products, minus any risk of it dying and reduced warranty period is what dictates their value. In the absence of competitively priced new products relegating 2nd hand electronics into obsoletion just isn't happening because the newer products just get more expensive every year.
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NVIDIA ‘Ampere’ 8nm Graphics Cards
- Thread starter LoadsaMoney
- Start date
Soldato
It is straight forward. How old are the cards, 1 maybe 2 years old depending on when they were bought. Warranty varies but may only be 2 years. If you pickup an RTX now thats out of warranty then its not worth 80-90% of original price - period. Is the 2080+ a strong enough card for most gaming - yes. But it cant cover the high end res' and fps with features otherwise everyone would just roll over and get one and thats the end of upgrading for PC gaming.
I agree that it shouldn't be worth that much, but people aren't viewing the card in isolation as a 2 year old used product. They have to look at their options and think "well, I can buy this card 2nd hand for 150 quid less and take a calculated risk on it lasting, or I can buy it new for 150 more brand new" because there's nothing else they can spend their money on to achieve the same performance. The only alternative is to wait and hope, which, fingers crossed, will be worth doing this year. Some people won't care if a new GPU comes out in a few months that is better. They just want the best card they can afford now.
Soldato
Yeah I can stomach that, but if it was £1199 say brand new and the guys now selling it for £1049 (or heck even £999) I wouldnt be interested no. The danger is like you say you wait for these new cards and they end up being out of reach price wise - say a 3080 is £1200 and the 3070 is another 6 months away, well dont sell the card if your not willing to take a risk.
Realistically most of us will be hoping for a card better than a 2080/5700XT and lower in price than the flagship. Talking the £500 segment if it will surface just hoping you know.
Realistically most of us will be hoping for a card better than a 2080/5700XT and lower in price than the flagship. Talking the £500 segment if it will surface just hoping you know.
Why? I have several times in my life sold my card before the new cards have come out and "won". I remember selling my card for £145 about 2 weeks before the 8800 came out for £118 and the 8800 was faster. Should I have warned the buyer that if the rumours were true that a new card might be coming out that would be faster and cheaper than the card he was buying?
In general, people have decided to accept that the next version of an electronics item will always cost more than the older one and as such the prices go up and up every year until another company shakes the market. We've been waiting for AMD to do that for a long time but it hasn't happened.
just look at oneplus phones they broke into the market with a cheap flagship but look at the prices now? Just as bad as apple and Samsung.
In relation to 2nd hand sales, you can't blame people for selling at high prices.
But surely they realize that the price of used GPUs is contributing the high price of the new release? Nvidia/AMD can see what their products are selling for 2nd hand so they know you now have £800 to go towards your new card when you sell your old.
In summary the market is broken, people are broken.
just look at oneplus phones they broke into the market with a cheap flagship but look at the prices now? Just as bad as apple and Samsung.
In relation to 2nd hand sales, you can't blame people for selling at high prices.
But surely they realize that the price of used GPUs is contributing the high price of the new release? Nvidia/AMD can see what their products are selling for 2nd hand so they know you now have £800 to go towards your new card when you sell your old.
In summary the market is broken, people are broken.
come on. new cards are expensive because the old ones sell for a lot 2nd hand? its the other way around. i bought a Titan Pascal for £450 with a block, because i couldn't stomach the price of a new 2080 ~ £600/650, but that wasn't the reason the 2080 was expensive.
Loads of people either keep their cards until they're worthless, pass them on to friends/family or don't think to try to move them on and a bunch of people wouldn't consider going 2nd hand either. The 2nd hand market does mean there's money for people to upgrade every cycle but a lot of people keep their cards a lot longer than that.
Loads of people either keep their cards until they're worthless, pass them on to friends/family or don't think to try to move them on and a bunch of people wouldn't consider going 2nd hand either. The 2nd hand market does mean there's money for people to upgrade every cycle but a lot of people keep their cards a lot longer than that.
I didn't say that's the only reason.there is lots of factors that contribute. for example you just chose to ignore the first part of my post.
It is a bit of both (Chicken and the egg problem). If a person gets a good price for their old card it makes stomaching the higher price of the new card easier.
In your example that person only had to pay up £150 for a 2080 (plus the £450 you gave them). Imagine if you had only paid £250 for your card, they then need to fork out £350 to cover the cost of a 2080. The stings a lot more and they would have to stop and think about it.
exactly.
Soldato
I always used to flip cards just before the new ones come out, back when SLI was the thing it meant you would pay for one of the new cards with the money you got selling the old ones, this was when you could get a decent card for £400.
Soldato
The context of this conversation has gotten slightly muddied, and due to the ridiculous name calling that ensued yesterday, I'm only responding to people who quote me directly on the subject as you have here.
This particular thread of the conversation was prompted by me saying that I don't get the desire to downgrade and sometimes go without a GPU just so that this person can extract the maximum cash from a second hand buyer, prompted by the inclination that the card will be worth a lot less in a few weeks time. Personally, it's not something I would do because a) I want to enjoy my card until I upgrade and b) I wouldn't treat people like that.
It's a personal perspective, and at no time have I said anyone is wrong to do it, all I'm saying is that it's unacceptable to me. I wouldn't sell like that to a family member or personal friend and I'm just not desperate enough for cash that I'd do it with a stranger either.
Of course people can sell whenever they like, and of course the buyer should consider the value in what they're buying. However, there are people who deliberately offload in the full knowledge that the buyer is getting a really poor deal. I'm not one of those people, I see it as no better than retailers price gouging - we're all quick to criticise that.
I was described as sanctimonious yesterday regarding this, and I'll accept that there are people who see it all as fair game and view me that way as a result. That description was fine by me, everyone has different standards & opinions but it's worth bearing in mind that a discussion forum is a place to share them and we won't always agree.
This guy summarises my thoughts well.
The context of this conversation has gotten slightly muddied, and due to the ridiculous name calling that ensued yesterday, I'm only responding to people who quote me directly on the subject as you have here.
This particular thread of the conversation was prompted by me saying that I don't get the desire to downgrade and sometimes go without a GPU just so that this person can extract the maximum cash from a second hand buyer, prompted by the inclination that the card will be worth a lot less in a few weeks time. Personally, it's not something I would do because a) I want to enjoy my card until I upgrade and b) I wouldn't treat people like that.
It's a personal perspective, and at no time have I said anyone is wrong to do it, all I'm saying is that it's unacceptable to me. I wouldn't sell like that to a family member or personal friend and I'm just not desperate enough for cash that I'd do it with a stranger either.
Of course people can sell whenever they like, and of course the buyer should consider the value in what they're buying. However, there are people who deliberately offload in the full knowledge that the buyer is getting a really poor deal. I'm not one of those people, I see it as no better than retailers price gouging - we're all quick to criticise that.
I was described as sanctimonious yesterday regarding this, and I'll accept that there are people who see it all as fair game and view me that way as a result. That description was fine by me, everyone has different standards & opinions but it's worth being in mind that a discussion forum is a place to share them and we won't always agree.
This guy summarises my thoughts well.
Fair enough, I hadnt seen all the posts.
Some people in life see this as a problem and wouldnt do it. To me its no different to deciding to sell my car before a new model comes out and the second hand prices drop.
Anytime anybody does that they are offloading in the full knowledge that the buyer is getting poor deal. But market price is market price. It is what somebody else is prepared to pay.
And can easily be affected the opposite way. i have offered £150 on a item which cost a seller £350 and he's advertising it for £250, purely because some shop like Curry's has a 3 weeks sale on for £200. If the seller is prepared to wait he will get more than £150 for it. Same with anybody buying a GFX today. If they are prepared to wait they will get it cheaper after the new cards come out (and not just based the extra performance for the same money but that the market will be swamped with second hand cards for sale so the price will drop)
Soldato
Nvidia are happier selling fewer cards, at a higher price (for the same profit of selling many more cards at a lower price). Rather short sighted as all this tactic will do is kill off PC gaming. New consoles and cloud gaming are going to only accelerate this decline.
How do we fix this? Stop pre-ordering £1200 GPU's that you haven't seen benchmarks of. Try and control yourself for gods sake.
How do we fix this? Stop pre-ordering £1200 GPU's that you haven't seen benchmarks of. Try and control yourself for gods sake.
Why is a big deal been made out of some people thinking of selling their current GPU before the next gen drops?
This is nothing new, it happens in the months before each GPU release.
This always done because people think that their GPU will drop in price when the new ones are released. That hasn't always been the case. Remember on this forum people were thinking that the 980Ti were going to drop to £200 after the 1070 price was announced? But, they never reached that price even second hand ones until much much later.
This is nothing new, it happens in the months before each GPU release.
This always done because people think that their GPU will drop in price when the new ones are released. That hasn't always been the case. Remember on this forum people were thinking that the 980Ti were going to drop to £200 after the 1070 price was announced? But, they never reached that price even second hand ones until much much later.
You called people out as p* takers for selling like this.The context of this conversation has gotten slightly muddied, and due to the ridiculous name calling that ensued yesterday, I'm only responding to people who quote me directly on the subject as you have here.
This particular thread of the conversation was prompted by me saying that I don't get the desire to downgrade and sometimes go without a GPU just so that this person can extract the maximum cash from a second hand buyer, prompted by the inclination that the card will be worth a lot less in a few weeks time. Personally, it's not something I would do because a) I want to enjoy my card until I upgrade and b) I wouldn't treat people like that.
It's a personal perspective, and at no time have I said anyone is wrong to do it, all I'm saying is that it's unacceptable to me. I wouldn't sell like that to a family member or personal friend and I'm just not desperate enough for cash that I'd do it with a stranger either.
Of course people can sell whenever they like, and of course the buyer should consider the value in what they're buying. However, there are people who deliberately offload in the full knowledge that the buyer is getting a really poor deal. I'm not one of those people, I see it as no better than retailers price gouging - we're all quick to criticise that.
I was described as sanctimonious yesterday regarding this, and I'll accept that there are people who see it all as fair game and view me that way as a result. That description was fine by me, everyone has different standards & opinions but it's worth bearing in mind that a discussion forum is a place to share them and we won't always agree.
This guy summarises my thoughts well.
You compared it to selling a banger that was about to break, which would incur repair cost on the buyer (a very wrong analogy).
Now you say "I wouldn't treat someone like that", inferring the transaction is malicious on the part of the seller.
All without a single shred of evidence as to what knowledge the buyer did or didn't have, or how the conversation went between the seller and the buyer.
Given the buyer had a 2070s it's logical to assume they had some savvy and knew what they were doing.
And even if they didn't - they STILL got a deal that honoured market rates.