Poll: British Grand Prix 2020, Silverstone - Race 4/?

[MissChief]

OMG lets wrap them up in cotton wool

F1 driver. I've hurt my hand so I can't drive.

MotoGP rider. I've got a broken ankle. pulled my shoulder and need crutches to get on the bike. Lets do this.

Edit= Ok not full Ground effect. But something near.

Like corner speeds at Silverstone of 150mph+ and then a sudden loss of downforce meaning no cornering at all. Think similar to Kyvat’s crash.

 

[englishpremier]

Would be far too chaotic and unpredictable under braking with them all so close.

That's a good thing no? If the drivers can't manage it, then let them crash out and ruin their race. Something tells me the best drivers would manage just fine. Perhaps Albon and Kvyat might have a problem though, along with the Haas pair.

 

[Deleted member 651465]

Think of a 747 flying through the air, it leaves a wake sufficient enough that smaller planes can't fly behind for a substantial distance. There's no amount of "skill" that you can deploy to make up for the physics.

Boeing said ICAO has sent a letter to its member nations that the 747-8 should maintain a 9.9km (5nm) separation distance from small aircraft weighing less than 19t (41,000lbs) and those in the large category below 136t (300,000lbs). For aircraft above 136t, separation distances have been reduced to 7.4km (4nm)

I suppose the argument is that after lap 3 the cars are at least spread out enough the severity of the turbulence is massively reduced. I'd dread to think what it would feel like turning in to the first corner of a grand prix along with 19 other cars with their DRS open. I'd like them to try it but you can't just "cope" with physics.

 

[MissChief]

I doubt there’d be much difference as they’d all have it. Except the lead car.

 

[deuse]

Like corner speeds at Silverstone of 150mph+ and then a sudden loss of downforce meaning no cornering at all. Think similar to Kyvat’s crash.

Then don't do 150 mph..simples.
Silverstone was changed to slow them down 2 or 3 times now.

 

[deuse]

Think of a 747 flying through the air, it leaves a wake sufficient enough that smaller planes can't fly behind for a substantial distance. There's no amount of "skill" that you can deploy to make up for the physics.



I suppose the argument is that after lap 3 the cars are at least spread out enough the severity of the turbulence is massively reduced. I'd dread to think what it would feel like turning in to the first corner of a grand prix along with 19 other cars with their DRS open. I'd like them to try it but you can't just "cope" with physics.

Tell that to marc marquez who does a 66 and 68 degree lean angle at some corners

 

[mmj_uk]

Refuelling is the very antithesis of exciting racing. The stats back this up. Any time refuelling has been part of F1 on track passes have dropped dramatically. The radios were full of ‘no need to try and pass him Kimi, we expect him to pit in a lap or two’ and ‘Box, box box, were going for a lighter stop to get track position over Villeneuve’. Some may appreciate the tactical battles but for the average fan who wants to see actual racing it was deathly dull and I really wish people would stop saying to bring back refuelling. It would also add significant extra costs when F1 is about saving money at the moment.

The antithesis of racing is having boost buttons to overtake, how many other (serious) race events are there where the person behind is given a speed advantage to make things more enjoyable for fans? if F1 was so great once fuelling was banned then why the need to even bring them in? rarely a race goes by without 'undercut' being mentioned dozens of times so it's not like things have changed.

Most of the interesting/unexpected stuff in F1 races today comes from teams using different tyre strategies and yet people are hostile to the idea of fuel strategies which shakes things up a lot more.

 

[Deleted member 651465]

Tell that to marc marquez who does a 66 and 68 degree lean angle at some corners

Seriously, what are you on about?

The level of aerodynamics involved in motorcycling are no where near F1 with DRS open. I ride a bike and wouldn't think twice of being behind 20 other riders on a circuit regardless of the lean angle.

 

[this_is_gav]

The antithesis of racing is having boost buttons to overtake, how many other (serious) race events are there where the person behind is given a speed advantage to make things more enjoyable for fans?

Pretty much every single seater series above F4.

F1, F2 and F3 have DRS.
Formula E has Attack Mode (good) and Fan Boost (bad).
Indycar has Push to Pass (everyone starts with the same at least).
Even BTCC will be having some form of Push to Pass with the upcoming hybrid cars.

 

[deuse]

Seriously, what are you on about?

The level of aerodynamics involved in motorcycling are no where near F1 with DRS open. I ride a bike and wouldn't think twice of being behind 20 other riders on a circuit regardless of the lean angle.

JH christ.

You got out the bottom of the bed today?
You mentioned "physics" so I mentioned a funny side of it and you over react as normal.

 

[Deleted member 651465]

JH christ.

You got out the bottom of the bed today?
You mentioned "physics" so I mentioned a funny side of it and you over react as normal.

No, I was trying to explain how the turbulence caused by 20 cars with their DRS open may affect turn in to the first corner of a grand prix. I used the plane analogy in an attempt to show how extreme it can be in some circumstances.

You then went full deuse and responded to my post on a bizarre tangent about motorcyclist lean angles, which have no relevance whatsoever.

I don't think I over-reacted. Just called you out, that's all

 

[deuse]

I don't think I over-reacted. Just called you out, that's all

No you did.
And you missed out the physics funny bit....

Back on topic.

 

[englishpremier]

Think of a 747 flying through the air, it leaves a wake sufficient enough that smaller planes can't fly behind for a substantial distance. There's no amount of "skill" that you can deploy to make up for the physics.



I suppose the argument is that after lap 3 the cars are at least spread out enough the severity of the turbulence is massively reduced. I'd dread to think what it would feel like turning in to the first corner of a grand prix along with 19 other cars with their DRS open. I'd like them to try it but you can't just "cope" with physics.

For one the cars are all the same size and weight, so nothing at all like a 747 vs smaller planes. Two, they are all drafting anyway from the start, so I don't buy your argument.

 

[Kenai]

I think there are a couple of reasons why they disable DRS at the start / restarts

Firstly, it was introduced as an aid to passing a car you've caught up but then hit the 'dirty air' - to solve the problem where we saw cars catching at tremendous rates and then just not being able to get any closer - this is not an issue with bunched cars and so it's not a necessary mechanism as the problem it's designed to solve is not present.

Secondly, I suspect they're slightly concerned at the potential overspeeds available with cold tyres and brakes at starts/restarts

 

[Deleted member 651465]

For one the cars are all the same size and weight, so nothing at all like a 747 vs smaller planes. Two, they are all drafting anyway from the start, so I don't buy your argument.

It’s fine, I’m not trying to change your mind just giving my opinion. The different size plane analogy was to show that turbulence can vary wildly so I’ll concede that.

However, would you seriously want 20 cars with seriously disturbed airflow and drag reduction barrelling one to turn 1?

Also, each car is slightly different so there will be an element of “wild” air as a RB would disturb the air much differently to a Merc for instance. I take your point about drafting but I still think it would energise the air much more than what people expect, given the number of cars with it all open.

Personally I’d prefer them to allow DRS all over the track after lap 3, instead of pre determined zones.

 

[this_is_gav]

Even ignoring why it was introduced as Kenai pointed out, DRS at the start would completely negate the point of the battle for pole position, as even with a perfect launch the pole sitter would inevitably end up 3rd or 4th before turn one at some tracks.

Could you imagine the disadvantage at Sochi or Barcelona?

 

[sadat]

Do we know if Perez is back or Hulk is taking his place again for this weekend?

 

[Mr Jack]

Do we know if Perez is back or Hulk is taking his place again for this weekend?

Pérez won't be. F1 has a 10 day minimum isolation period. Hülk seems like a safe bet, can't see why they'd change.

 

[sadat]

Yeah hope this weekend the guy can actually race.

 

[Flibster]

Bottas has signed a 1 year contract extension with Mercedes.

So it's just Hamilton and Toto discussing how large the number is going to be now.