Disenfranchisement and I.D. Cards

[Jean-F]

I would have thought the Germans especially would have been against police essentially saying papers, please

I guess that they would, but as I said, my elder son has lived there for thirty plus years, and has been a German citizen for circa ten, he has a German wife and they have two adult sons, none of them have been plagued by the polizei constantly asking for “ihre Papiere, bitte.”

 

[Destination]

You have to be rock bottom not to be able to scrape together £20.

I can't see a national ID card being charged for to the end user either, it'll be tax funded shirley?

Govt tried to tax fund or partially tax fund an ID card scheme previously, and somehow the individual price somehow came out higher than the bloody passport system.
I'm of the French mindset where I see nothing wrong with people having to carry ID at pretty much all times.
We spent enough on nottrace and nottrack to fund ID cards for everyone for about a century, so they should just on with it.

 

[Jean-F]

Govt tried to tax fund or partially tax fund an ID card scheme previously, and somehow the individual price somehow came out higher than the bloody passport system.
I'm of the French mindset where I see nothing wrong with people having to carry ID at pretty much all times.
We spent enough on nottrace and nottrack to fund ID cards for everyone for about a century, so they should just on with it.

You appear to be a person of some discernment, in agreeing with me that the French attitude to I.D. carrying is “Ce n’est pas grand-chose”, but to some Brits it’s the penultimate step before giving up their first born.
It reminds me of the old adage, ‘You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink.”

 

[Bear]

You appear to be a person of some discernment, in agreeing with me that the French attitude to I.D. carrying is “Ce n’est pas grand-chose”, but to some Brits it’s the penultimate step before giving up their first born.
It reminds me of the old adage, ‘You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink.”

Many be its because the French have had some sort of ID card since the first World War so they are used to having them, people tend to not object to something when its all they have known throughout their lives? If they have never been introduced and they were thinking about it now I doubt the French would be so forgiving about the idea. I'm not against the idea by the way

 

[Terminal_Boy]

Many French carry their National ID cards because they are issued free of charge and might be their only form of ID if they don’t have a valid EU/French photo driving license.

Oddly enough, a Carte Vitale (French healthcare card) isn’t considered a valid proof of ID despite being French government issued photo ID.

I had to show a passport to purchase some swimming pool chemicals last year as they contained oxidising agents because I didn’t have a Carte de Sejour (residence permit) at the time.

Considering the money that HMG has flushed down the pan on HS2, covering the cost of providing every U.K. citizen with an ID card should be a mere drop in the ocean.

 

[BallistixOnZ490]

Everything sucks when you can't get a driving license or passport in the UK.

Fortunately Barclays offered me a mortgage and accounts using my DWP letters aand birth certificate.

I am curious what would I do if the police or some such ask me for ID, when you can't even get an ID only thing in the UK?

 

[Meridian]

I guess that they would, but as I said, my elder son has lived there for thirty plus years, and has been a German citizen for circa ten, he has a German wife and they have two adult sons, none of them have been plagued by the polizei constantly asking for “ihre Papiere, bitte.”

Do they still have that bit where if you move, you have to notify the police? And get your car re-registered at the new home, complete with new plates? I should point out, this used to be far everyone, not just immigrants.

 

[Narj]

I've never taken a polling card to the polling station with me and I've never been asked for ID.

The only time they seem to be really strong on ID is when you are proxy voting.

I got asked for photo ID and all the paperwork when I made a proxy vote for a friend in the EU referendum (which was a pointless exercise anyways as we cancelled each other out ).

 

[bobuk]

10 weeks to get a passport renewed, how long do you thing rolling out an ID scheme, lining up all the contracts for tory donors would take ?

 

[PlacidCasual]

I think the point is, is there any evidence that it does? Genuinely interested. We can all have opinions, but is there data to back it up?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutfur_Rahman_(politician)

This pleasant gentleman was convicted of the very thing Pickles claims. Having only read the article on Pickles report not the report itself. I can only infer it says that the practice of community based manipulation is wider than just Tower Hamlets and that political correctness discourages people to look to deeply. A bit like the sex abuse cases in various towns were glossed over.

 

[plasmahal]

10 weeks to get a passport renewed, how long do you thing rolling out an ID scheme, lining up all the contracts for tory donors would take ?

Probably quicker than lining up all the contracts for Labour donors would take if Labour were in charge.

 

[Pho]

Ahh the classic diversion tactic of shifting the blame away from the people who are to blame right this moment. No MP should be dodgy. Especially the ones actually in charge. But no, it's Jeremy Corbyn's fault or something, apparently.

Just imagine if we had that chaos of Ed Miliband we were promised all those years ago.

 

[Duke]

10 weeks to get a passport renewed

Mine took a week?

 

[Narj]

'You have to have internet, you have to pay an ISP for certain fees / they might not have smart phones, they might not have data' - apparently if you aren't white you can't afford internet.

'How if you're a convicted felon, you're not allowed to vote and everything .... thats a huge population of the African Americans'.

"For most of the communities, they don't really know what is out there"

"I feel like they don't have the knowledge of how it works" - what the hell!

Some pretty condescending and dare I say it, racist assumptions being made there. Pretty shocking really. The idea that non-white people need to be mollycoddled and all think the same is damned insulting tbh.

"The black community" is another one that irritates me as well, as if all black people are one hive-mind when in reality it's comprised of vastly disparate groups, some of whom can't stand each other for starters.

 

[platinum87]

Everything sucks when you can't get a driving license or passport in the UK.

Fortunately Barclays offered me a mortgage and accounts using my DWP letters aand birth certificate.

I am curious what would I do if the police or some such ask me for ID, when you can't even get an ID only thing in the UK?

You seem to have too many problems for it to even be believable.

How exactly do you get a mortgage with no job?

 

[Surveyor]

Everything sucks when you can't get a driving license or passport in the UK.

Fortunately Barclays offered me a mortgage and accounts using my DWP letters aand birth certificate.

I am curious what would I do if the police or some such ask me for ID, when you can't even get an ID only thing in the UK?

The police have no power to stop you and ask for ID. They might ask for your name, what you're doing in an area and where you're going but you're not required to stop and answer.

Presumably you don't have a driving licence due to your personal circumstances, why can't you obtain a passport?

 

[Tony Edwards]

The police have no power to stop you and ask for ID. They might ask for your name, what you're doing in an area and where you're going but you're not required to stop and answer.

Especialy if you want to end up rolling around on the floor with loads of cops on ya.

 

[stockhausen]

The police have no power to stop you and ask for ID. They might ask for your name, what you're doing in an area and where you're going but you're not required to stop and answer. . . .

However . . .

Stop and search: police powers
A police officer has powers to stop and search you if they have ‘reasonable grounds’ to suspect you’re carrying:

• illegal drugs
• a weapon
• stolen property
• something which could be used to commit a crime, such as a crowbar

You can only be stopped and searched without reasonable grounds if it has been approved by a senior police officer. This can happen if it is suspected that:

• serious violence could take place
• you’re carrying a weapon or have used one
• you’re in a specific location or area

Before you’re searched
Before you’re searched the police officer must tell you:

• their name and police station
• what they expect to find, for example drugs
• the reason they want to search you, for example if it looks like you’re hiding something
• why they are legally allowed to search you
• that you can have a record of the search and if this isn’t possible at the time, how you can get a copy

What exactly constitutes "reasonable grounds" is pretty vague in practice - as many young men of colour will attest.

"Expectation", like "Hope" springs eternal

 

[Narj]

Especialy if you want to end up rolling around on the floor with loads of cops on ya.

Boom!

 

[Surveyor]

Especialy if you want to end up rolling around on the floor with loads of cops on ya.

Sure