Afghanistan - 20 years on

[alchal]

Until the US are out of the picture there will never be peace in the country. They have fumbled so many attempts of peace due to their own motives.

I didn't say or even allude to that.

So what are you trying to say then?
Without the US who do you think will step up?
China, Russia? Maybe a Muslim coalition lol lol lol

So my point stands you want them to revert back to the Taliban days because without the US that's reality of it.

 

[glenimp617]

Never really understood this war....but then again, I could never get my head around Vietnam. The more I researched it, the more confused I got.

 

[hurfdurf]

Never really understood this war....but then again, I could never get my head around Vietnam. The more I researched it, the more confused I got.

Very similar situations. Imperial war machines fuelling the military industrial complex wanting an excuse to attack a country, failing to do any good, then leaving an utter disaster behind.

 

[glenimp617]

Very similar situations. Imperial war machines fuelling the military industrial complex wanting an excuse to attack a country, failing to do any good, then leaving an utter disaster behind.

That's basically where I ended up. I could never find a reason other than because they fancied a war.

 

[200sols]

That's basically where I ended up. I could never find a reason other than because they fancied a war.

They haven't had a war in a while either. They need a new one.

 

[Slam62]

I suppose Vietnam was about communism and Afghanistan about bin laden however Afghanistan is also on the possible route for a major oil pipeline which may have been routed differently now.

Weren't the taliban originally the mujahadin who were originally armed by the US to fight the Russiansa?

 

[Nasher]

I think they started as that, but got infiltrated by much more hardline crazies.

 

[Malevolence]

This war needn't have even happened if the US military didn't have the SBS hold fire when they had Bin Laden in their sights back in 2001.

 

[jamoor]

The Afghanistan situation is bonkers.

A governance that was installed by invaders will never succeed in the eyes of the population.
They are foreign ideals. The average American would never accept a foreign system of governance such as a dictatorship so why they thought democracy would work in Afghanistan is beyond me.

 

[lemonkettaz]

I really shouldn't be, but I'm so surprised at just how badly us in the west are handling this. Like I say though shouldn't really be surprised. I mean the EU talking about isolating the Taliban, the US current administration pretty much begging the Taliban to cooperate and as for us, well at least Boris come out from underneath wherever he hides and said something, as pointless as it was in the end.

 

[Lord-Jaffa]

The UK could do an operation alone, but what's the point now. It's too costly and what exactly would it achieve? There is just no motivation for it. No one cares about oil reserves anymore, Afghans won't fight for their own freedoms, it's 500 years in the past.

We have to pull out of this one because it's US led and most of the infrastructure, logistics etc is theirs. We would need to start again from scratch.

We cant force project without American logistics.

 

[Nasher]

This war needn't have even happened if the US military didn't have the SBS hold fire when they had Bin Laden in their sights back in 2001.

Yea they could have done something in a few months what took the Americans 10 years. Apparently they had eyes on Bin Laden AND the Taliban leader, but the US wanted their glory and by the time they got there it was to late. It was never confirmed though.

 

[silvagti]

I suppose Vietnam was about communism and Afghanistan about bin laden however Afghanistan is also on the possible route for a major oil pipeline which may have been routed differently now.

Yeah, there's something strange about the situation. 20 years ago we were desperate to head into the country allegedly to apprehend one man responsible for 911 and subdue the regime behind him. Now it's as though the US and West are basically deserting the place leaving the Taliban to recapture it.

Makes me question whether the whole thing was a cover for securing an oil pipeline, trade routes, etc? Hard not to wonder if there was an ulterior motive given how things seem to be going at the moment.

With oil looking increasingly less important as a strategic resource these days maybe the US don't feel it's worth the effort to occupy the country any more?

Weren't the taliban originally the mujahadin who were originally armed by the US to fight the Russiansa?

As far as I can make out Afghanistan is basically a country Russia and the US both viewed as a strategic site which they used as a proxy warzone. Both have seemingly funded various factions within county to indirectly gain influence there as far as I can see.

 

[Angilion]

We're a tiny weak island though

Great Britain is one of the largest islands in the world. Surprising, isn't it? I think it comes in 8th in the size of islands. The UK comes in 6th in the size of national economies.

Second tier, yes. Tiny and weak, no.

Maybe I Missed this post in the discussion but how does the Taliban have the man power to take over an entire country in a few weeks?

Surely you need 10,000s of troops maybe 100,000s. Where have they been hiding? Something dodgy is going on here.

If you're brutal enough and there isn't any opposition with the will and ability to be violent enough, you can do it with far less people by compelling obedience through fear. A minority can easily rule a majority, either through overwhelmingly superior force or through lesser force and a willingness to routinely use violence to compel obedience and spread fear.

 

[Malevolence]

We're a tiny weak island though

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/new-study-ranks-britain-second-powerful-country-world/

 

[Johno please?]

Maybe I Missed this post in the discussion but how does the Taliban have the man power to take over an entire country in a few weeks?

Surely you need 10,000s of troops maybe 100,000s. Where have they been hiding? Something dodgy is going on here.

Oh that's easy it can be summed up with one word. Pakistan.

 

[Nasher]

TBH I think there is another plan in motion the public can't see yet.

Iran is starting to get worried about the Taliban, because they do not get on.

 

[Rroff]

TBH I think there is another plan in motion the public can't see yet.

There seems to be growing activity from rumoured CIA and other foreign backed paramilitaries and the likes, if enough get organised and manage to work together they may end up pushing the Afghan government aside, absorbing many of the ANA, etc. and facing off against the Taliban, with a lot of messy legacy tribal issues involved :s which might be the cynical intention from the US all along.

Iran is starting to get worried about the Taliban, because they do not get on.

Iran definitely taking it seriously - lots of Iranian ISR going on - though there is the whole Shia/Sunni divide there is some within Iran who support them.

Maybe I Missed this post in the discussion but how does the Taliban have the man power to take over an entire country in a few weeks?

Surely you need 10,000s of troops maybe 100,000s. Where have they been hiding? Something dodgy is going on here.

I don't know the ins and outs of it but as above Pakistan plays a role and they make heavy use of conscription and support is high in some parts of Afghanistan so doesn't take much to build their numbers up.

 

[alchal]

Numbers mean nothing if they are unwilling to fight.

The Taliban are religious fanatics, Syria has shown how far that can take you in conquest.

Let's see how the local players all act now.

 

[BowdonUK]

I think we have to accept most people in Afghanistan like the Taliban. They are closer culturally to what they are used to. They wouldn't be sweeping across the country if the people weren't welcoming them.

I wondered if part of this sudden withdrawal as anything to do with China being in talks with the Taliban. China as been going around to all the countries America as attacked and offered them reconstruction deals.