10 police officers shot by snipers at BLM protest in Dallas

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If you look at each case and check the details you will see cops using excessive force often killing the suspect when there is no need to. Often these suspects are black.

Forget whether they come from deprived backgrounds or are criminals no one needs to be murdered in cold blood. I guess this is why black people feel discriminated.

These cops need to be tried for murder not pardoned or excused as often seems the case.

How can you suggest that we should "Forget whether they come from deprived backgrounds or are criminals". You seem to be suggesting that we should selectively focus on one element of the situation, which is that they are black, and forget everything else that is relevant? You can't be serious.

If more blacks in the USA commit crime, then it is hardly surprising more are involved in such incidents. The more serious point is why do the statistics show more blacks committing crime. Socio-economic circumstances, educational attainment, welfare dependency, being born to unmarried couples or to a single parent, urban-gangsta culture and such like would seem to form part of the explanation.
 
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Yes but the way many are shot in cold blood is that warranted? Never see many videos of whites in the same situation, I could be wrong though.

You need to look harder and past your prejudices. There are white victims too. They just don't get the same media attention as there isn't a huge movement behind it.
 
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B&W

B&W

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How can you suggest that we should "Forget whether they come from deprived backgrounds or are criminals". You seem to be suggesting that we should selectively focus on one element of the situation, which is that they are black, and forget everything else that is relevant? You can't be serious.

If more blacks in the USA commit crime, then it is hardly surprising more are involved in such incidents. The more serious point is why do the statistics show more blacks committing crime. Socio-economic circumstances, educational attainment, welfare dependency, being born to unmarried couples or to a single parent, urban-gangsta culture and such like would seem to form part of the explanation.

Doesn't make a difference if the guy was criminal, he was held down by two officers and they still felt they had to shoot him multiple times.

Was he Houdini? The suspects background is relevant to his nature and whatever crimes he has committed.

It is not relevant when he is restrained and murdered in cold blood.

Same as "why do blacks commit more crimes" is not relevant to the situations that we see weekly where black guys are murdered unjustly.
 
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How can you suggest that we should "Forget whether they come from deprived backgrounds or are criminals". You seem to be suggesting that we should selectively focus on one element of the situation, which is that they are black, and forget everything else that is relevant? You can't be serious.

If more blacks in the USA commit crime, then it is hardly surprising more are involved in such incidents. The more serious point is why do the statistics show more blacks committing crime. Socio-economic circumstances, educational attainment, welfare dependency, being born to unmarried couples or to a single parent, urban-gangsta culture and such like would seem to form part of the explanation.

Except that often, and this is the key thing, the people getting killed have committed no more crime than something like a broken tail light, or playing with a toy sold in the store where the shooting took place (there has been at least one example of a youth/kid getting shot because he was carrying and playing with a toy the store he was inside stocked).

If it's so dangerous that the first response during a routine traffic stop is to shoot the driver multiple times because the he is moving his hands after you've asked for their papers (unless they're Jean Grey or Charles Xavier they're going to move their hands when asked to produce something), then either they need to get rid of the officers that are so worried they shoot just because someone is doing as requested, or make sure that officers don't go around on their own so they won't be as nervous about stopping a guy who is in a car with his wife and kid.

It is not a good thing when you're in a situation where a large part of the population actively fear the police and even more distrust them.
And unfortunately that is the situation that seems to be the case in the US, in part due to massive legalised (and then largely ignored) racism within living memory, and a system that means if you're anything other than white you're far more likely to end up in jail for minor offences.
IIRC for the same crime by the time people have been arrested, charged and appeared before a judge a black suspect is at least twice as likely to end up in jail - not for major crimes like murder, or rape, but things like possession of small amounts of narcotics (I think several studies have shown that for the same crime, with the same previous record you were at least twice as likely to end up in jail if you were black).
It's also not helped by the lack of any form of real comprehensive complaints procedure that has to be followed regardless of where you are, so in many areas if you make a complaint you can't do so anonymously or to a third party, but it's to the same officers who work with the person the complaint is about and may have no training in how to deal with them. Which means that because it isn't unknown (especially in some areas) for officers to not just get away with abusing their powers but to harass those that made complaints in the past you don't get complaints made for fear of things getting worse.

For all it's faults the IPCC, PACE etc have made policing in the UK much more accountable, and meant that it's far harder for a bad officer to remain in the job regardless of if he's in the MET or a local beat officer in rural Devon.
The US police in some regards seem to be stuck back around the point we were in the 70's with regards to accountability for their actions.
 

B&W

B&W

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You need to look harder and past your prejudices. Their are white victims too. They just don't get the same media attention as there isn't a huge movement behind it.

No prejudice here, must be white victims and it still makes what the police do wrong. Is it the same level as black victims?
 

B&W

B&W

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The only criteria we need to use; was the shooting of restrained individuals justified?

If the victim was Black or white shouldn't matter what should is the manner he was shot.
 
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Well now, This puts a rather diferent perspective on the Tail Light Man...!

http://forums.officer.com/t206228/

The number of officers involved and the degree of their jumpiness seems a bit more understandable in the light of this.

So the guy matches a rough decription of someone wanted for something, and that makes it OK to shoot him?

If he was suspected to be armed and dangerous why not call for backup before pulling him over, or simply tell both the adult occupants to leave their hands on the dash?

Or was the description "black male, in a car"?

If you read that thread you'll also see another poster stating he had a permit issued in the neighbouring county to where he was shot, and where he was living at the time (which would happen to explain why the sheriff in one county couldn't find a request filed if it was done in another).
 
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The fact the cops reason fo suspecting he was an armed robber from four days ago was "The driver looks more like one of our suspects, just ‘cause of the wide set nose.” really? Guess the all look the same to that policeman........
 
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It can be viewed on the flip side too. Feel sorry for black people, they can't even show a policeman their driving licence without worrying a maniac can draw a gun on them at any given time.
Another consequence of institutionalised racism and deep rooted (albeit ridiculous) fear of the black man.

70% of the people shot dead by police in the USA are "white". Which, of course, means that their lives don't matter. There's a powerful and growing movement explicitly devoted to promoting the idea that a person's life only matters if they're "black". Although that's assuming that followers of the ideology believe that people who aren't "black" are people, which is by no means certain. Now they're claiming to be surprised and shocked that someone has taken their message to a logical conclusion, which makes them either fools or liars.

There's plenty of racism all round. Mix that with plenty of guns and plenty of murders and plenty of fear and it's bound to be very ugly indeed.
 
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Lynching in America has a strongly racist history. Think gas chambers and Jews.

Lynching in America is rooted in the American revolution, primarily used by people who wanted a war for independence against those who either wanted to remain part of the British empire or who wanted independence but not a war. That's where the word comes from - Lynch was the most famous of those people.
 
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Lynching in America is rooted in the American revolution, primarily used by people who wanted a war for independence against those who either wanted to remain part of the British empire or who wanted independence but not a war. That's where the word comes from - Lynch was the most famous of those people.

I think you're missing out the bit where it was mainly used against non whites from the Civil war right up to, and past the start of the civil/equal rights movement, at a rate of about 3-1 for those that were recorded and have been verified.

So for the last 150 years or so it's mainly been used against one racial group (or those who have been working closely with them).
 
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Yes but the way many are shot in cold blood is that warranted? Never see many videos of whites in the same situation, I could be wrong though.

Almost all of those killed by police are armed or resisting arrest. I think it's about 3% which is less than a dozen a year. Which may seem high, but in a country of 300m that's small fry. More people are killed by ice cream vans.

I cannot actually think of a recent example where it was in "cold blood". I think that in most examples the police felt threatened and used deadly force.

My view is that in some cases the police panic and shoot when unnecessary. But police are killed all the time and it's understandable it happens when.
 
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resisting arrest =death
unbeliveable

In this country that would make sense, but over there I would probably shoot first and ask questions later.

I mean, think of the situation,

You go to arrest somebody for a minor punch up outside a bar,

They guy doesn't want to be arrested,

You try to cuff him but he shrugs you off and pushes you back a foot or two,

At this point you can make a decision,

Pull your gun.

Don't pull your gun.




If you decided not to pull your gun congratulations, you just got shot.


Or if you decided to pull your gun, congratulations, you just shot an unarmed guy and started riots that got 11 friends shot.


So, yeah, I would not be a cop in America.
 
Soldato
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So the guy matches a rough decription of someone wanted for something, and that makes it OK to shoot him?

If he was suspected to be armed and dangerous why not call for backup before pulling him over, or simply tell both the adult occupants to leave their hands on the dash?

Or was the description "black male, in a car"?

If you read that thread you'll also see another poster stating he had a permit issued in the neighbouring county to where he was shot, and where he was living at the time (which would happen to explain why the sheriff in one county couldn't find a request filed if it was done in another).

Of course not,

But it might suggest that this was more of a "Stockwell" case than a random "Lets stop somebody DWB" one. (With all that goes with it)

I am not arguing that the situation was particularly well handled (it clearly wasn't)

But I can certainly see that a cop who is actually looking for an armed robber (Or suicide bomber) is likely to interpret the gestures and actions of the suspect somewhat differently to how he might do so if it really was just a routine traffic stop.
 
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