2 x Lotus in F1

Weebull said:
After all, the Proton lot were never in any doubt of being the Lotus car manufacturers, and they're the ones with the proper badge on the front of their proposed car.
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Strangely, they haven't got the proper badge...

The proper one reads Team Lotus instead of just Lotus and Fernandes has that one. ;)

If thats the scheme Renault are running in 2011, they may get in a touch of trouble, as the badge on the nose of the car is meant to be the manufacturers badge, and having both Renault and Lotus Cars badges may be a bit of a no-no.

Noto said:
i think the article on BBC about did the current Renault tell their other sponsors that they would be lotus too. Can you imagine the big wigs that show up to F1 races.

"OK so errr which car are we supporting?"

Current Renault: "the faster lotus"

Tony Fernadez troop: "the original lotus"
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I was reading an article *can't remember where now* where one of the comments focussed on people saying that the 2011 Team Lotus isn't the real Team Lotus, and then pointing out that the 2010 Renault isn't the real Renault racing team either. :D They left in 1985 - Literally just closed the team down. That was through Renault Sport.

In 2000 - they bought the Benetton team and ran it as Benetton for 2 years until changing the name to Renault F1 Team. Benetton started out as Toleman until they bought the team in 1985.

So which is more real? Renault F1 Team or Team Lotus? ;)
 
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Its a head mess for sure.

Thanks for the poster that posted that awesome Team lotus F1 pic its my new desktop.

I have decied that this year there is room for me to support Maclaren Williams and Team Lotus. For some reason this just makes fernades seem like a plucky underdog and i like it. Not to forgot how fricking awsome the team Lotus car looks

Where are Team lotus based? and where would the Renault Lotus team be based?

What do people think team lotus will be able to achieve next season? trading paint with Toro rosso or looking at taking a pop at sauber?
 
I think its impossible to find anyone who doesnt like Lotus Racing (Team Lotus). They have turned up, given it a good go, been the best of the new guys, been nice guys about it, been respectfull to the name (how Proton could complain about this I dont know) and eveyone has just been pleased to see them.

This whole thing has just dragged them through the mud, but it looks as though Team Lotus may still be the most popular at the end of the day anyway.

Theres always been that difference between a team in F1 for the fun of racing and because they want to, and those teams in there for the business of it and the marketing. I prefer the guys who race because they want to, which are normally the smaller teams.

They could have handled this much better. After all we have 2 Red Bull teams, multiple teams with Renault or Mercedes or Ferrari in their names. I dont think anyone would have minded Team Lotus and Lotus Renault if they had just got on with it, but its the copying of the livery and the legal fight over the Team Lotus name that has made them all look like fools.
 
stoke1863 said:
Where are Team lotus based? and where would the Renault Lotus team be based?

What do people think team lotus will be able to achieve next season? trading paint with Toro rosso or looking at taking a pop at sauber?
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Team Lotus are based in Hingham, Norfolk. Renault Lotus will be based at the current Renault site in Oxfordshire. As for next season I think they are hoping to be in the mix with the midfield teams so as you say Sauber upwards.
 
Flibster said:
I was reading an article *can't remember where now* where one of the comments focussed on people saying that the 2011 Team Lotus isn't the real Team Lotus, and then pointing out that the 2010 Renault isn't the real Renault racing team either. :D They left in 1985 - Literally just closed the team down. That was through Renault Sport.

In 2000 - they bought the Benetton team and ran it as Benetton for 2 years until changing the name to Renault F1 Team. Benetton started out as Toleman until they bought the team in 1985.

So which is more real? Renault F1 Team or Team Lotus? ;)
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Other than the obvious candidates of McLaren, Ferrari and Williams, are any of the other teams on the grid 'original'? (I suppose the 3 new teams are) I'd have thought by now most of them have formed from buying out or changing names from older teams.
 
Kenai said:
Other than the obvious candidates of McLaren, Ferrari and Williams, are any of the other teams on the grid 'original'? (I suppose the 3 new teams are) I'd have thought by now most of them have formed from buying out or changing names from older teams.
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You'd be hard pushed to call the McLaren team that we have now the original one. They merged with (read: were taken over by, pretty much) Ron Dennis' F2 outfit Project Four Racing in '81 - hence the 'MP4/x' designation for all subsequent F1 car designs.
 
From a RACING point of view only - why is this any different from Torro Rosso being branded as Red Bull (they both have identical branding etc), the team names are different - but the cars look basically identical

In regards to Lotus - Im definitely in the Colin Chapman IS Lotus , and without him the name is meaningless camp - but given that Fernandez wanted to use Lotus months ago and stated as such, I think its a little ***** of Renault/ Investment Company to now want to use it
 
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FrankJH said:
From a RACING point of view only - why is this any different from Torro Rosso being branded as Red Bull (they both have identical branding etc), the team names are different - but the cars look basically identical
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STR and RB are owned by the same company Team Lotus and Lotus-Renault F1 Team aren't.

Also Tony Fernandes has announced that they are retaining the green and yellow paintscheme next year. Missed a trick - red, gold and cream. ;)
 
I think Fernandez has done a good job of forming a team and a brand in the Green and Yellow. Makes sence to keep it.

Is Proton still a backer for Team Lotus? If so then both teams are linked by the same major financial backer at least.

But as I said, having Team Lotus and Lotus Renault is nothing different to having Mercedes, McLaren Mercedes and Force India Mercedes. Its just a name. Its all the arguing thats caused the problems.
 
Question.

Ferrari had to get rid of their barcode logo on the car as it was deemed to be too close to being tobacco advertising. So should LOLtus-Renault F1 be able to get away with a colour scheme that apes the old JPS colours? After all, I reckon someone could make just as strong a case for that being subliminal advertising as Ferrari's barcode....
 
JRS said:
Question.

Ferrari had to get rid of their barcode logo on the car as it was deemed to be too close to being tobacco advertising. So should LOLtus-Renault F1 be able to get away with a colour scheme that apes the old JPS colours? After all, I reckon someone could make just as strong a case for that being subliminal advertising as Ferrari's barcode....
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As an entertaining twist I can see it happening, but only after 4 or 5 races when the Lotus thing gets to the FIA (they seem to love doing this sort of rubbish mid season). After a bit of research (wikipedia) the JPS brand is still going so that trump card is still playable for the green Lotus team (hope Fernandez gets into the spirit of F1 and points it out now he can't use it either just for the fun of it)

Id love to see the Renault team lumped with some sort of Proton SMASH team racing as their name from the FIA just as a bit of a joke solution to who gets to be Lotus... I dont see why these groups dont go and buy another classic team's name and use that, we could have Arrows back or Lola!
 
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I think that would only happen if JPS were actual sponsors of Lotus Renault. If they arent there is no case? Subliminally advertising something that they are not sponsored by? thats just dumb.

The difference for Ferrari is that Marlboro still sponsor Ferrari. Infact there still title sponsors, which I've never understood. How can Tabacco advertising in F1 be banned, yet a team still be called Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro?
 
Skeeter said:
I think that would only happen if JPS were actual sponsors of Lotus Renault. If they arent there is no case? Subliminally advertising something that they are not sponsored by? thats just dumb.

The difference for Ferrari is that Marlboro still sponsor Ferrari. Infact there still title sponsors, which I've never understood. How can Tabacco advertising in F1 be banned, yet a team still be called Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro?
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Because it is Ferrari, and everybody knows that Ferrari are allowed to play to completely different rules compared to every other team because the FIA are biased towards them.
 
What you said:

Monkeymatt said:
Because it is Ferrari, and everybody knows that Ferrari are allowed to play to completely different rules compared to every other team because the FIA are biased towards them.
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What I read:

Monkeymatt said:
Waaaaaaaaaah why do Ferrari get away with everything????!!!!!!111111oneoneoneoneleventyone
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Childish of me? Perhaps :o

Flibster said:
Illegally manipulating a race result - $100'000 fine
Yeah, not the greatest argument you have there. ;)
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Oh, absolutely.

But remind me again - what punishment did Renault get for having one of their drivers crash into a wall to manipulate the result of the race? Might it have been the sum total of sweet **** all? ;)
 
Christ they need to start the season already, they can stop crying about name related business then, let the results decide! I for one vote both teams be deleted from the universe!
 
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