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8600 Ultra and 8600 GT
- Thread starter shrek2
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LoadsaMoney said:
They're not out yet are they? In fact, according to Anandtech, it's still a good 3 months before they hit retail.
Although I guess you know exactly what ATi have planned. All we know is R600 is going to launch soon(ish). We don't know how fast, or slow it will be, what price, how many different versions, hell we don't even know it's name!
There a lot scheduled to happen before any of the cards mentioned above are available, only an idiot would dismiss ATi before seeing what they have to offer.
Oh dear Loadsa, I thought you would've known how this works by now.LoadsaMoney said:
It's all good saying "soon these Nvidia cards will crush current ATI cards" but it goes both ways, in swings and roundabouts. R600 is on the way, and it wouldn't surprise me if it knocks the 8800 cards out of the #1 spot while the 8600 cards knock the X1950s out of the high-end/mid-range.
Then Nvidia will build something to knock R600 out of the #1 spot and ATI will build something to knock the 8600 cards out of the high-end/mid-range and we will be back to where we are now.
Ad nauseum, repeat et infinitum.
At least someone understands.neocon said:Thats not good for PC gaming.LoadsaMoney said:ATi the end is nigh.
Competition only benefits us, the consumers.
Ulfhedjinn said:Oh dear Loadsa, I thought you would've known how this works by now.
It's all good saying "soon these Nvidia cards will crush current ATI cards" but it goes both ways, in swings and roundabouts. R600 is on the way, and it wouldn't surprise me if it knocks the 8800 cards out of the #1 spot while the 8600 cards knock the X1950s out of the high-end/mid-range.
Then Nvidia will build something to knock R600 out of the #1 spot and ATI will build something to knock the 8600 cards out of the high-end/mid-range and we will be back to where we are now.
Ad nauseum, repeat et infinitum.
At least someone understands.
That is if ATi has enough time to do that. Where is their R600?? Like 5 months after 8800 comes out. Nvidia, will without a doubt dominate the early stage of dx10 era.
The real fight begins later this year or early next year.
How long did it take the 7800GTX 512MB to come out after the X1800XT? That was a success until X1900.Lolcb said:
Like I said, it's swings and roundabouts. History always repeats itself in this market.
The fight doesn't begin this year, or next year. It began years ago, and each side gains the high ground every six or twelve months before it switches back again. Without fail.
There's no point waving flags for either side, neither can win until one is completely knocked out of the market. When that happens, we all lose because it means slow development and high prices until a new challenger enters the arena.
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Caporegime
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I know its not good for gaming, no good telling me, tell ATi, what would you rather buy, an x1950 XTX or an 8800 GTS, exactly, so when these cards come out, what would you rather buy x1950 XT/pro or the 320mb 8800 GTS, 8600 etc... etc...
R600 needs to be another 9700pro, it needs to come out and blow everyone away, including the GTX, a couple of frames here or there is going to be no good at all, and who's to say that seen as Nvidia are that far ahead of the game, that they don't have their next lot of cards ready etc... as soon as ATi get back into it, Nvidia could say 'here you go', and release the next one.
R600 needs to be another 9700pro, it needs to come out and blow everyone away, including the GTX, a couple of frames here or there is going to be no good at all, and who's to say that seen as Nvidia are that far ahead of the game, that they don't have their next lot of cards ready etc... as soon as ATi get back into it, Nvidia could say 'here you go', and release the next one.
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Soldato
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I think Loads is basically saying:
This SECOND ATI cant compete with the 8800GTS. If Nvidia release the 8600 range, then the X1950 cant compete, so ATI NEED to release their new chips.
I dont take him to mean "by god, ATI are doomed! they will never beat Nvidia again" he means right now, ati are on the backburner.
This SECOND ATI cant compete with the 8800GTS. If Nvidia release the 8600 range, then the X1950 cant compete, so ATI NEED to release their new chips.
I dont take him to mean "by god, ATI are doomed! they will never beat Nvidia again" he means right now, ati are on the backburner.
But you can say that any time. The 7900GT and 7900GTX were pointless with the X1900s in the market, which had superior image quality and performance. They got trounced by the arrival of the 7950 cards, which were in turn trounced (mostly) by the X1950 series.LoadsaMoney said:
Swings and roundabouts. ATI just dominated the mid-range (and still is for now), Nvidia will dominate the mid-range for a while, then ATI will dominate it again, then Nvidia will again, then ATI again, then Nvidia again...
And I'm saying "why is this even being discussed?" It happens every year.Dark_Angel said:
Caporegime
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I don't.
I would rather stay ATi, but if they don't have any cards out, then as i said no option but to buy Nvidia.
I would rather stay ATi, but if they don't have any cards out, then as i said no option but to buy Nvidia.
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Is that such a bad thing? Not forgetting you could just wait for ATI to strike back as happens every year in a never-ending cycle of nobody winning.LoadsaMoney said:I don't.
I would rather stay ATi, but if they don't have any cards out, then as i said no option but to buy Nvidia.
Caporegime
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Ulfhedjinn said:
There is no point waiting, if you wait you will never buy, everyone knows that, i wait for R600, oh look G80 refresher, wait for that now, oh look R600 refresher, wait for that now......... there is better cards coming all the time, no pont waiting at all, i hope ATi do strike back, and in a big, big way, but at the moment you have to say its all Nvidia, they released their high end next gen card 6 months before ATi, thay have announced all these low/mid range next gen cards, and what have ATi announced, 2x R600 high end cards, 1x with GDDR3, and one with GDDR4, thats it, and also announced a 3 month delay on em.
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That's what I was saying. Why wait for 8600 when you can buy an X1950XT now?LoadsaMoney said:
I will say the same about the X1950XT when the 8600 is out.
It's a never-ending cycle, not even worth discussing. But you're making out like ATI is suddenly not an option.
Ulhefdjin, I wasnt saying the fight between two companies. I am stating the fight between 2 companies in gaining market share for the upcoming dx10 cards.
Yes, it is true that there is a cycle for graphics and same goes for cpu. But it is without a doubt that ATi is on the losing edge here, like it or not, it is a fact.
ATi will without a doubt, keep losing to Nvidia until around Q3-Q4 of 2007, latest Q1 of 2008.
If you look at how things are moving at the moment, you will agree with me that ATi will lose to Nvidia for quite some time to come.
And I do have to agree with loads, waiting game is never an option for me adn some others.
Yes, it is true that there is a cycle for graphics and same goes for cpu. But it is without a doubt that ATi is on the losing edge here, like it or not, it is a fact.
ATi will without a doubt, keep losing to Nvidia until around Q3-Q4 of 2007, latest Q1 of 2008.
If you look at how things are moving at the moment, you will agree with me that ATi will lose to Nvidia for quite some time to come.
And I do have to agree with loads, waiting game is never an option for me adn some others.
ATI are not "losing to Nvidia" the same way Nvidia are not "losing to ATI."
They both dominate different sections of the market at different times, swapping places like they're on a merry go round. There's no two ways about it, so please stop the flag-waving.
When one of them is out of the market entirely, they lose, and in the current situation that means we lose. Sounds to me like you are wishing for ATI to be kicked out of the market, which is bad for the consumer.
If "waiting isn't an option" then why are people talking about the 8600s at all? Last I checked, they aren't out yet.
They both dominate different sections of the market at different times, swapping places like they're on a merry go round. There's no two ways about it, so please stop the flag-waving.
When one of them is out of the market entirely, they lose, and in the current situation that means we lose. Sounds to me like you are wishing for ATI to be kicked out of the market, which is bad for the consumer.
If "waiting isn't an option" then why are people talking about the 8600s at all? Last I checked, they aren't out yet.
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You don't get it do you, I am not in any way generalising the whole situation.
When I meant lose, is losing in the DX10 area at the moment.
And this time it is different case, because, the 8600 people are waiting is DX10 compatible whereas X1900 versions are not.
When I meant lose, is losing in the DX10 area at the moment.
And this time it is different case, because, the 8600 people are waiting is DX10 compatible whereas X1900 versions are not.
Sorry Lolcb but thats a load of rubbish - by the time DX10 applications (games and non-games for the sake of arguement) both ATI and nVidia will have a DX10 solution - only when they are both out can we determine what is best, to an extent I expect this to be primarily driver-driven (it will be a while until we get decent mature Vista DX10 compatible drivers)...Lolcb said:
Where do you expect nVidia to dominate this non-existent DX10 market?!? Yes, they are the only ones with a DX10 product, but I dont know anyone whose used it for DX10 apps or expecting to use it for DX10 apps before the ATI product comes out...
ps3ud0
