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AMD demonstrates Ryzen 9 5900X prototype with 3D V-Cache stack chiplet design

Discussion in 'CPUs' started by RavenXXX2, 1 Jun 2021.

  1. 4K8KW10

    Capodecina

    Joined: 2 Sep 2017

    Posts: 10,307

    I think that it is not good to invest in a dead-end platform, and its last version.
    Better buy the second generation of AM5 in 2 years.
     
  2. Joxeon

    Soldato

    Joined: 15 Oct 2019

    Posts: 7,445

    Location: Uk

    I think it depends on how your current PC is performing as 2 years is quite a long wait.
     
  3. 4K8KW10

    Capodecina

    Joined: 2 Sep 2017

    Posts: 10,307

    That's why you don't wait - just enjoy what you have now and choose a better period when to throw the money.
     
  4. welshrat

    Gangster

    Joined: 31 Dec 2011

    Posts: 489

    Ok that's your choice. But the investment isn't really that much when you consider the resale value of say my 3700x. Let's say around £200. I will then get 4 extra cores plus 40% extra for a 5900x vcache, I imagine I will find one for around £500 so only around £300 outlay when all is said and done. Just seems brilliant value to me.
     
  5. TNA

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Mar 2008

    Posts: 19,576

    Location: London

    Yep. Again, wasting your time. £300 or so will get you one of the best CPU’s out there at the time and last you a long time. Also what is the point in buying a platform that is not a “dead end” like all Intel ones are and not make use of the option of upgrading?
     
  6. welshrat

    Gangster

    Joined: 31 Dec 2011

    Posts: 489

    Exactly. One of the main reasons for investing in the platform in the first place.
     
  7. jigger

    Capodecina

    Joined: 28 May 2007

    Posts: 15,602

    Probably the biggest strength of AMD. The board in my sig is still going strong and supports all has support for all of the Ryzen line up. It even supports pre Ryzen CPU’s.
     
  8. faceman123

    Mobster

    Joined: 9 Jun 2011

    Posts: 3,218

    Hi all - how likely is there to be a 5800xt?
     
  9. Twinz

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 20 Aug 2019

    Posts: 1,689

    Location: SW Florida

    I think a faster version of the 5800X is very likely. I don't know if they will add a "t" to the end of the name though.
     
  10. andy_mk3

    Capodecina

    Joined: 5 Oct 2009

    Posts: 11,533

    Location: Lincolnshire

    XT varients with the 3d cache would be a nice upgrade in a year or two for me. That way I can run this system for many years to come with a good CPU before having to upgrade to a whole new platform.
     
  11. LePhuronn

    Soldato

    Joined: 26 Sep 2010

    Posts: 6,468

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Personally I'd say very likely, I just don't see AMD limiting the 3D cache chiplets to the 12 and 16 core CPUs especially if the Alder Lake performance leaks are accurate.
     
  12. faceman123

    Mobster

    Joined: 9 Jun 2011

    Posts: 3,218

    Thanks after that single chiplet because 0 latency overhead, a 3800xt with a + 15% yes please for competitive gaming rig !
     
  13. Sean473

    Gangster

    Joined: 23 Dec 2020

    Posts: 250

    I'm already invested in AM4 since 2019 so not an issue for me indeed - However, Zen4/AM5 might not even come out next year. DDR5 is also not that mature so personally, AM4 might be a good one to stay invested in instead of being a BETA tester with DDR5 etc..
     
  14. gpuerrilla

    Capodecina

    Joined: 21 Jul 2005

    Posts: 14,365

    Location: N.Ireland

    Agree with this. Wont be hard to migrate over once the beta testing has ironed out the bugs or even sell the AM4 gear to offset the next gen. We would be talking a way off so a sensible route IMO.
     
  15. Freddie1980

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 25 Sep 2009

    Posts: 7,694

    Location: Billericay, UK

    With V-Cache? Not sure they wil use the XT mockier as XT in the past has been used for chips with a better binning whereas V-Cache are with a different design. More likely they will be 6000 series given the performance uplift were expecting.
     
  16. LePhuronn

    Soldato

    Joined: 26 Sep 2010

    Posts: 6,468

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    They're not, it's the exactly same chiplet with some cache stacked on top. The power and data vias and connections on the chiplet have been there since Zen 2, AMD are only just now utilising them.

    3000 XT being used for improved yields and binning doesn't exclude XT being used again. The 3000 XT was a refreshed Zen 2, 3D stacked Zen 3 is still a refreshed Zen 3, so 5000 XT makes sense.
     
  17. Joxeon

    Soldato

    Joined: 15 Oct 2019

    Posts: 7,445

    Location: Uk

    If they go with XT then does this mean no 6 core with Vcache?
     
  18. Distracted

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 30 Aug 2018

    Posts: 2,481

    No-one knows which CPUs will get the additional cache yet.
     
  19. LePhuronn

    Soldato

    Joined: 26 Sep 2010

    Posts: 6,468

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    Why would you say that? Chiplets are chiplets are chiplets, it makes no sense for AMD to just throw away any 3D cache chiplets that don't make the cut for a 12 and 16 core SKU, or "waste" golden samples that are a bit "too good" for the dual chiplet models.

    Look at the chiplet allocation in the current 4 chiplet-based SKUs. Are all the chiplets the same quality? Do the 5900X and 5950X get slightly lower binned chiplets so the 5600X and 5800X get maximum performance? Or do the dual-chiplet SKUs get preferential treatment to keep their TDP down? Arguably it doesn't make a difference because there is still a binning requirement to populate those 4 SKUs, and that binning requirement doesn't go away because there's now a slice of cache slapped on top. And with yet another bump in TSMC's wafer costs and the little extra manufacturing cost to lay down the cache, I really don't see AMD throwing anything away just because a chiplet didn't cut the mustard for a 5900X.

    Also consider this: AMD demonstrated a 15% uplift in games. I think the use of a 12 core model was purely because AMD had pushed the 5900X as their ultimate gaming CPU previously, so that narrative was continued. But everybody in the real world knows 12 cores is currently overkill for gaming. Even if big little works out for Alder Lake, gaming is still going to be a job for the performance cores, and Intel still only has 8 of those. Gaming perIt'll be a big dent for AMD's current performance leadership if they appear to need 12 3D cache-enhanced Zen 3 cores to contest the gaming crown against "only" 8 Golden Cove cores. If Alder Lake's synthetics prove to be real and translate to real-world usage (which Rocket Lake never did), then AMD are going to need the 3D cache performance uplift across the entire product stack.

    Ultimately nobody's said which desktop SKUs are getting the 3D cache treatment, but I don't see any reason why such treatment would be exclusive to the top SKUs. And if the only argument is "well 3D stacking must cost a fortune" (of which it won't), then I can see AMD pricing Threadripper to subsidise the desktop line given there's a fight on with Alder Lake.
     
  20. Journey

    Capodecina

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 10,327

    Location: West Midlands

    5900XT will be 2x chiplets with 6-cores plus v-cache so the 5600X(T) or whatever it is going to be called is a no brainer. They should probably price it at $329 just to annoy everyone too. :p