Are EV’s really the way to go?

Soldato
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Its a bit like phone coverage, in the early days it was based around population and charging is pretty much the same at the moment although you can always use a 3 pin plug. It is getting better all the time though.

North Scotland, North Wales are not good for rapid charging but people do drive EV's around the north of Scotland and 300 miles of range gets you a long way between charges and back to a three pin plug.

If you (i'm speaking generally here, not you personally Quartz) don't like or want an EV then don't buy one, you can have an ICE for many more years yet. Personally I have one and really enjoy it for all that it offers, range is never an issue for me at 70 miles a day but I have done long runs and used Tesla SuC's which charge at mental speeds getting you back on the way in no longer than it takes to visit the loo and grab a coffee. My wife has a Zoe and she loves it, 200 miles of range is plenty for her and we reckon she will own it for many years.

When you do longer journies do you just charge up or do you take a ICE car? That's the one thing I'm always thinking. We often do trips from bath to North Yorkshire that would push the limits a bit for a single charge so I would worry about getting stuck. We do usually stop for a break though
 
Soldato
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so how many miles/pa during during you ownership and any loss in range ? predominately high/low power charging ?

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Despite the 33% efficiency of hydrogen generation, if we need storage during times of wind/solar plenty and don't have the batteries then other options are limited.
(have UK wind turbines, practically, already been already put in idle mode, due to over-supply)
Hydrogen technology could become UK's forte , we don't have the (economic) lithium supplies, post Ukraine I can see relationship with China for supply/processing, being a lot more acrimonious (high tech export being clamped down, Uighur situation deserves to be similarly deplored like Russia/Ukraine)
I've done about 50k in it. It's on 58k now. Used every day for the school run, shopping etc. I've done longer journeys in it. For a couple of years I did a 90 each way commute, and regular trips down to Brighton (~115 each way). The car usually lives on 'Long life mode' - so granny charged to 80%. Only occasionally charged above that or via a fast charger, as and when the additional capacity is needed.

Degradation has been minimal as far as I can tell. I hit 11 bars (85% indicator) a few years ago when my wife accidently charged it to 100% on a hot day and it was left at 100% overnight. Range wise, I've not noticed any significant difference between when I got it an now. I haven't tried any like for like journeys with those I did back when I got it. In reality, that's very hard to do as so many things can effect the results. Maybe it has dropped a bit, but not that I've really noticed.

It certainly doesn't feel like it's anywhere near it's last legs. I had to replace the lower ball joints last year, and I expect I'll have to replace many more mechanical components before worrying about the battery.
 
Soldato
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When you do longer journies do you just charge up or do you take a ICE car? That's the one thing I'm always thinking. We often do trips from bath to North Yorkshire that would push the limits a bit for a single charge so I would worry about getting stuck. We do usually stop for a break though

I wouldn't hesitate in taking my standard range Model 3 on that trip. I'm not sure where you would go in North Yorkshire but from Bath to Whitby (which is about the furthest point away while still being in North Yorkshire) its 284 miles so I'd need to stop once en-route to charge for 20 mins. Given it's 4.5 hours of driving I'd need to stop at least once anyway.

In the last 2 months I have done 4 >400 mile trips and Tesla's network just makes it easy, its not as easy outside of Tesla's network but its getting a lot better. It's even easier if you can get on a slow AC charger at your destination/hotel.

A couple of weeks ago I did Suffolk to East Yorkshire and back again in a day which is about 450 miles. It takes two charge stops with no destination charging but neither are long or tedious and I don't drive to save energy.
 
Associate
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I've just got a model 3. Its a dream, so cheap to run. No need to service it. Probably the first car I've 'made' money on, what with the wait time going. 100%. EV is the way once we sort out charging infrastructure for the people who live in terraces etc.
 
Soldato
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I've just got a model 3. Its a dream, so cheap to run. No need to service it. Probably the first car I've 'made' money on, what with the wait time going. 100%. EV is the way once we sort out charging infrastructure for the people who live in terraces etc.
Yeah that is it for me. I live in a terrace and I rent so would be entirely reliant on charge points
 
Caporegime
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After 4 years of EV ownership I don't intend to go back to an ICE car for daily use. I could be tempted by something like the the GR Yaris as a fun car as I always had 2 cars before. Neither of the EVs I've owned lost more than 1% per year averaged over my ownership. First car had covered 40k when I sold it and the current EV has passed 25K. I believe calendar aging of current battery chemistry is unavoidable so would explain the gradual loss I observed.
The fact you lost less than 1% is Nothing to do with being an EV
 
Soldato
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The fact you lost less than 1% is Nothing to do with being an EV
If you refer to the value then that's my mistake for not having battery SOC charge in that sentence which was my meaning.

As for value being an EV which is desirable to some and in short supply currently has certainly helped to maintain the value. Previous car went up and the current one is about the same. Not the first cars I've owned that have maintained value though they were either bought cheap or were appealing to a niche market.
 
Soldato
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We've just hit a year of EV ownership and I can't see us ever buying a non EV car again. I'm sure alternatives such as e fuel and hydrogen will always be around in some form, however it's clear that EVs are going to be the most common fossil fuel alternative.

I've driven 16k in this year ownership and the range has been a non-issue. There most inconvenienced we've been is having to wait 20 minutes for a charger at Gloucester services. We could have driven a few miles to another charger but we were in no rush.

Even on the >150 mile journeys, the only time we used the ICE car is for camping, as it has physically more space.

I find an EV far more convenient 99% of the time. I think I've been to a petrol station once in the past 6 months. Plugging it in at home takes seconds and that all I have to do.

I can't comment on batter degradation, apart from saying that in 16k miles, there hasn't been any. I can't think of a single EV other than the leaf that doesn't have some form of sophisticated battery management, and some KWs that are used as a buffer. Only time will tell, but I'd be surprised if our car has lost 5% of battery after 100k miles.
 
Soldato
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I've done about 50k in it. It's on 58k now. Used every day for the school run, shopping etc. I've done longer journeys in it. For a couple of years I did a 90 each way commute, and regular trips down to Brighton (~115 each way). The car usually lives on 'Long life mode' - so granny charged to 80%. Only occasionally charged above that or via a fast charger, as and when the additional capacity is needed.
OK - sounds good - a 180mile round trip commute throughout the year - it's a leaf+ then I assume ?
N cambridge park companies don't seem to have enough car park chargers yet for a reliable daily charge at work, although I'd only be 90miles round trip.
 
Soldato
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We've just hit a year of EV ownership and I can't see us ever buying a non EV car again. I'm sure alternatives such as e fuel and hydrogen will always be around in some form, however it's clear that EVs are going to be the most common fossil fuel alternative.

I've driven 16k in this year ownership and the range has been a non-issue. There most inconvenienced we've been is having to wait 20 minutes for a charger at Gloucester services. We could have driven a few miles to another charger but we were in no rush.

Even on the >150 mile journeys, the only time we used the ICE car is for camping, as it has physically more space.

I find an EV far more convenient 99% of the time. I think I've been to a petrol station once in the past 6 months. Plugging it in at home takes seconds and that all I have to do.

I can't comment on batter degradation, apart from saying that in 16k miles, there hasn't been any. I can't think of a single EV other than the leaf that doesn't have some form of sophisticated battery management, and some KWs that are used as a buffer. Only time will tell, but I'd be surprised if our car has lost 5% of battery after 100k miles.
Same (never going non-EV again). I have the added bonus of not doing many long journeys in general so I'm mostly town driving, meaning I've been able to granny charge almost all the time, with occasional rapid charging as I needed the car full the next day etc. Did a return journey to Leeds city centre from Liverpool and used only 54% of the battery even with all the hilly motorways, though to be fair I was sat at about 62-65mph; efficiency drop-off above those speeds is noticeable.

Once (if) we ever move house we'll get a Zappi point installed and then it likely won't be an issue again.
 
Soldato
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OK - sounds good - a 180mile round trip commute throughout the year - it's a leaf+ then I assume ?
N cambridge park companies don't seem to have enough car park chargers yet for a reliable daily charge at work, although I'd only be 90miles round trip.
Leaf 24kw. It was only once a week. I'd leave early on a Monday, stop at Thurrock (65 miles) for a breakfast, coffee and a rapid charge. I stayed where I worked overnight, and charged on a slow charger. Then stopped at Medway services on the return journey the next afternoon.

Was a bit of a ball ache of a commute, but doing it in an EV wasn't really any different to doing it in another car. I still used to stop for a coffee and breakfast before work. If I left later the Dartford Tunnel was rammed with queues, and if I got to work too early I couldn't get in.
 
Associate
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I've done about 50k in it. It's on 58k now. Used every day for the school run, shopping etc. I've done longer journeys in it. For a couple of years I did a 90 each way commute, and regular trips down to Brighton (~115 each way). The car usually lives on 'Long life mode' - so granny charged to 80%. Only occasionally charged above that or via a fast charger, as and when the additional capacity is needed.

Degradation has been minimal as far as I can tell. I hit 11 bars (85% indicator) a few years ago when my wife accidently charged it to 100% on a hot day and it was left at 100% overnight. Range wise, I've not noticed any significant difference between when I got it an now. I haven't tried any like for like journeys with those I did back when I got it. In reality, that's very hard to do as so many things can effect the results. Maybe it has dropped a bit, but not that I've really noticed.

It certainly doesn't feel like it's anywhere near it's last legs. I had to replace the lower ball joints last year, and I expect I'll have to replace many more mechanical components before worrying about the battery.
Have you seen the NZ based 16 blade: https://evsenhanced.com/aftermarket-battery/
Its what the leaf should have had from the go, LFP batteries and thermal management.
 
Associate
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Did my first 'long' drive in the Model 3 LR since I bought it in December, basically South Wales to Farnborough and back in a day for work, 291 miles round trip. Incredibly comfy, autopilot used for just about the entire motorway. Got to Farnborough with 41% battery remaining (left the house with 90%), 15 minute supercharge at Membury on the way back. So easy, and I didn't stop for any longer than I would have done in my ICE car (the stop at Reading services on the way was because my bladder isn't what it used to be!).

Also, cheap overall cost to charge for the trip meant that I made around £100 profit as we get 45p per mile allowance on personal cars. Bonus.

 
Soldato
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I've recently bought an used i3 as a 'hack' to replace a Golf 6 GTI and for what it does I can't fault it (school runs, trips to town, ~150km trips). I set it to warm up each morning before I get in and off I go. In saying that, it's only mildly fun and not engaging to drive at all, but that's not why you get one is it. I'll keep the 330d for long journeys and there's no weekend toy that I've seen so far that can replace an ICE one.

I've never had to use a public charger though and never would, if that was part of the experience I'd have kept the Golf. From what i've seen (at least here anyway) etiquette is loosely followed.. People overstaying at chargers, ICE cars parking in EV bays, EV's with trailers taking up 3 spots etc.. just too much drama to deal with.
 
Soldato
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I do miss it as that thing was a great little car but it just didn't deserve the boring trips I was doing in it. If I'd have had the space I'd have kept it. When I've got the time or can be bothered to go for a hoon I just go out in the R8.
 
Soldato
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long term leaf ownership Bjorn's done some battery degradation tests -mg zs/ioniq do well -
I don't understand how he rules out (sandbagging) that some of the additional gross capacity has just been made available to the car as usable driving range, as it ages;
you have to hope degradation is linear too, no exponential mechanism like covid spread.

VW e-Golf 24 kWh degradation test after 6 years/48k km

 
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