Are India and Pakistan about to have another showdown?

[Vita]

Conversely, do you not think Pakistan has angered a lot of Hindu's? Harbouring terrorists. Mumbai as an example. ISI working extensively with terror groups (Secret Affair by Mark Curtis).

Does India not house any terrorists? Or do they turn a blind eye?

If Pakistan was a terrorist state no way would the Indian pilot who has been caught be treated with the respect and dignity he has.

It will but large numbers of Pakistanis (both here and there) support the aims of various terrorist factions. Imran Khan will fail unless the is a strand compelling them.

Show me these Pakistanis please. Unless you have solid proof, that’s quite a speculation to make.

That is because they do. And have a large % of their population who openly endorse terrorism.

You mean the minority. Some of the Indian people are no different.

But Pakistan does house terror groups, whom it has and does still support.

Show me.

I don't condone a war starting and even with what's happened. India does have a right to defend itself and India is right to expect Pakistan to try and stop terrorists killing civilians.

India intervened Pakistan air space, even after leaving the first time round when PAK airforce jets intercepted. They got dealt with the second time round which is no surprise. PAK jets did not enter Indian airspace.

So... Simple question: Did Pakistan use all its resources to prevent a terror attack being planned, operated and launched out of its territory into another country who had the sole intention to kill? If the answer was yes, this situation would not be.

I don’t know, I don’t work for PAK defence or intelligence.

 

[Rroff]

India threw down the gauntlet Pakistan has responded - I don't think this is going away any time soon unless rational heads prevail very quickly. Kind of worrying as MAD was supposed to dissuade things escalating to full conventional war.

 

[NVP]

Orchestrated events to ease the public into a peace/truce publicity stunt for the cricketer and modi?

 

[RaohNS]

Does India not house any terrorists? Or do they turn a blind eye?

Show me a terror group that has operated inside India and launched attackS on Pakistan in the last 5/10years.

If Pakistan was a terrorist state no way would the Indian pilot who has been caught be treated with the respect and dignity he has.

Respect and dignity? He has clearly been assaulted and beaten upon his capture hence the images doing the rounds on Twitter. Pakistan putting him on state TV is also a violation of the Geneva convention.

Show me these Pakistanis please. Unless you have solid proof, that’s quite a speculation to make.

Sure. You going to ignore something even when it smacks you in the face:

www.counterextremism.com/countries/pakistan

A majority of Pakistanis reportedly condemn violence, but many still support extremist ideology, especially when based on religious... A January 2015 study concluded: The govt of P has been largely unsuccessful in mobilizing public support for countering violent extremism

There were plenty more but evidence provided.

You mean the minority. Some of the Indian people are no different.

But Pakistan are the ones who harbour terrorists.

Show me.

https://www.longwarjournal.org/arch...end-or-foe-in-the-fight-against-terrorism.php

Plenty more also. If you want a more thorough account pick up the book mentioned earlier.

intervened Pakistan air space, even after leaving the first time round when PAK airforce jets intercepted. They got dealt with the second time round which is no surprise. PAK jets did not enter Indian airspace.

Pakistan sponsored terror groups have repeatedly entered India and committed atrocities. They wouldn't enter air space so rashly. India would in the absence of nukes make pretty good work against them.

I don’t know, I don’t work for PAK defence or intelligence.

Given it happens so frequently and the fact that I've posted evidence showing plenty of support, it's evidence enough they did not.

Hopefully we can agree:
The pilot is returned
Both countries get around the table nd discuss non-military solutions going forwards
Something is done to destroy the terrorists operating with near impunity within Pakistan

 

[deuse]

If Imran Khan doesn't sort the terrorists out.
He will be out for a duck

 

[dowie]

If Pakistan was a terrorist state no way would the Indian pilot who has been caught be treated with the respect and dignity he has.

I think you've got some low standards for "respect and dignity" - let the locals give him a beating then bring him out for the cameras?

Here he is being captured:

https://twitter.com/YogiAdityanath_/status/1100746730839134208

Oh well I guess at least they didn't let them kill him.

 

[Mujja]

They haven't got on. Ever since the first invasions, Hindus have held a strong mistrust of Islamic incursions and people as a whole, regardless of their individual good.

May father was born and raised in Jalandhar which is now in Punjab on the Indian side. He was around 10 when the country was divided and moved north with his family. He remembers Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs all living as neighbours and no issues. He was probably too young too notice any social tensions which I'm sure there were. I've heard him discussing the old times with Sikhs and Hindus and they all remember how good things used to be. The recent BBC documentaries said the same. The issues started after partition when both sides saw large numbers killed, the violence is still used by both sides today as an excuse today.

I read about Pakistan supporting militants during the Afghan and USSR war but it seems their relationship ended long ago.

Pakistan tried to arrest militants, Siege of Lal Masjid. This was during President Musharraf's time who was an ex-General and had support of the Army.

The militants\terrorists in return have also attacked the Army and an Army school during which over 150 people were killed, many of them children. There was also the attack in the Lahore park.

I don't see why anyone thinks the average Pakistani would support these terrorists after the attacks they have carried out in their own country against their own people. It's one thing to hate another nation\religion but wanted to see them dead or blown up isn't the same.

 

[Mujja]

I think you've got some low standards for "respect and dignity" - let the locals give him a beating then bring him out for the cameras?

Here he is being captured:

https://twitter.com/YogiAdityanath_/status/1100746730839134208

Oh well I guess at least they didn't let them kill him.

The comments on that feed say the soldiers can be heard telling the mob to stop. And that's only a few slaps around the head.

 

[Mujja]

If Imran Khan doesn't sort the terrorists out.
He will be out for a duck

If India boycott the WC match in the group stage they might have to do so again in the knockout stage and could gift Pakistan the trophy, what a day to be a Pakistani

 

[Mujja]

.

 

[dowie]

The comments on that feed say the soldiers can be heard telling the mob to stop. And that's only a few slaps around the head.

Rather a poor excuse... so they didn't let the mob kill him or give a more serious beating.

Still a beating and then parading him on TV... good going - hardly the "dignity and respect" claimed by the other poster.

 

[LoadsaMoney]

Surprised May hasn't sent any of our troops there yet.

 

[Vita]

Rather a poor excuse... so they didn't let the mob kill him or give a more serious beating.

Still a beating and then parading him on TV... good going - hardly the "dignity and respect" claimed by the other poster.

They’ve treated him with miltary ethics. They could have turned a blind eye and left him for the dogs. He has said so himself the miltary has treated him right.

Ok so it isn’t a red carpet roll out or parade float, but I’m sure prisoners of war have been treated much worse by other nations.

 

[dowie]

They’ve treated him with miltary ethics. They could have turned a blind eye and left him for the dogs. He has said so himself the miltary has treated him right.

Ok so it isn’t a red carpet roll out or parade float, but I’m sure prisoners of war have been treated much worse by other nations.

What do you even mean by: "They’ve treated him with miltary ethics" - you're just parroting the official Pakistani line now.

So they didn't let the locals kill him, though did relatively little when they want to give him a few punches and they've then filmed him.

As for his statements at the moment - how delusional are you - he's a prisoner being brought out for the cameras he could well say anything.

Oh but it could be worse - so that makes it OK then?

The main point here was simply that your original claim re: "dignity and respect" is complete and utter BS.

 

[Vita]

The main point here was simply that your original claim re: "dignity and respect" is complete and utter BS.

Does he look battered and bruised to you? He’s in his senses and his face is fine. Though it was cut up and bleeding before.

Lol and I’m the delusional one. Gr8 m8.

 

[IronWarrior]

So much for the supposedly "unbeatable" Russian Sukhoi SU-30 jets.

Well, they are by far India's most numerous fighter jet..

There is enough disinformation on the Internet, it's best not to add to it.

It was a MiG-21 that got downed, India will be saving their SU-30's for a greater conflict and defence against China which is a bigger threat than Pakistan.

Anyway, I don't think things will get any bigger than this.

 

[Rroff]

There is enough disinformation on the Internet, it's best not to add to it.

It was a MiG-21 that got downed, India will be saving their SU-30's for a greater conflict and defence against China which is a bigger threat than Pakistan is while the MiG-21's are equal to what the Pakistan Air Force has.

Even with the current conditions Pakistan is flying them in F-16s are no joke. Dunno much about the JF-17 it is a bit of a wildcard but those that have looked into purchasing generally seem to consider them inferior to the previous generation Mirage jets. (EDIT: Though whether that is because of a difference between export and domestic spec I don't know).

Anyway, I don't think things will get any bigger than this.

I'm not so sure, I like to think that reason will prevail but those at the top of the government in India I think have miscalculated a bit and the higher army ranks in Pakistan seem to be a bit hot headed and backing themselves into a corner they can't back down from without losing face.

 

[TonTom]

Lol and I’m the delusional one. Gr8 m8.

Without a shadow of doubt.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

May father was born and raised in Jalandhar which is now in Punjab on the Indian side. He was around 10 when the country was divided and moved north with his family. He remembers Muslims, Hindus and Sikhs all living as neighbours and no issues. He was probably too young too notice any social tensions which I'm sure there were. I've heard him discussing the old times with Sikhs and Hindus and they all remember how good things used to be. The recent BBC documentaries said the same. The issues started after partition when both sides saw large numbers killed, the violence is still used by both sides today as an excuse today.

I read about Pakistan supporting militants during the Afghan and USSR war but it seems their relationship ended long ago.

Pakistan tried to arrest militants, Siege of Lal Masjid. This was during President Musharraf's time who was an ex-General and had support of the Army.

The militants\terrorists in return have also attacked the Army and an Army school during which over 150 people were killed, many of them children. There was also the attack in the Lahore park.

I don't see why anyone thinks the average Pakistani would support these terrorists after the attacks they have carried out in their own country against their own people. It's one thing to hate another nation\religion but wanted to see them dead or blown up isn't the same.

Pakistan is well known for being above board and honest. So I believe them totally when they say they are against terrorism. It was an honest mistake that they have been harboring and protecting terrorists for decades.

Pretty much most terrorist incidents if not all in india for the past 50 years have been committed by pakistanis or linked to them.

 

[dowie]

Does he look battered and bruised to you? He’s in his senses and his face is fine. Though it was cut up and bleeding before.

Lol and I’m the delusional one. Gr8 m8.

You're delusional if you think taking anything he says at face value is a good idea at the moment given his current situation.

His face did look a bit puffy, I didn't make any claims about what it looked like previously - perhaps you should try to stick to the arguments put forward.

Again - since this is rather difficult for you I'll reiterate - you made a claim, your claim was that he'd been treated with "respect and dignity" - this claim is nonsense, firstly there is the footage of him getting a beating upon being captured, second he's made to sit in front of the cameras which goes against the Geneva convention in which signatories are supposed to protect prisoners from: "acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity". While parading someone through the streets was perhaps what was on the minds of people at the time brining prisoners out for the cameras is the modern day equivalent.

You've so far replied with a vague/meaningless point that they've "treated him with military ethics" whatever that is supposed to mean and you and another poster have tried to downplay the beating and then made some argument about his face looking fine.

None of this is particularly relevant to the point I took issue with - namely your claim that he had been treated with respect and dignity - a claim that is clearly false.