Atos wants out

[Meridian]

^^ Agreed.

I've worked in outsourcing Catering/Cleaning/IT and they are prime candidates for outsourcing, that's why facilities management companies exist.

I agree. As long as you don't care about the quality of the end product. Look what happened to hospital cleaning after it was out-sourced. It certainly got cheaper, which was why it was done. Of course the wards now haven't been cleaned properly since, but that's a small price to pay isn't it? The in-house staff may not care much, but the the outside providers don't care at all.

 

[Mr Jack]

HR I kind of agree with, and Prisons I have no experience of. The others are the ideal candidates for outsourcing and to say otherwise is simply defeatist.

Defeatist? That's a bizarre attitude.

Why is it defeatist to think you can't outsource something but not defeatist to think you can't run in-house stuff as efficiently?

Out-sourcing is, unquestionably, less efficient than inhouse provision since, by definition, you have to pay the outsourcing companies profits as well as paying for the actual service. The theory is that you are compensated by getting extra efficiencies, invisible hand of the market, la de da, etc. but the fact remains you are, automatically, paying extra costs. So why is it defeatist to think some other company can deal with these extra costs and still provide a better service but not defeatist to think you might be able to do it in-house?

 

[Goberpiles316]

The outsourcing argument could go on and on, my wife works in a school for a company who provides the catering down here, having had school dinners many years ago where the food was cooked on the school by the cooks and seeing what she has to provide to the kids, you see how bad things have become, microwaved food delivered each day for the kids. After a holiday she has to use ration food which is tinned spuds, tinned vegetarian hot dog sausages.

Oh here is the spin from the company website:
Each school meal is prepared fresh every day by a dedicated team of chefs and kitchen staff, and offers a healthy and tasty meal to support pupils’ development in school.

What a load of cobblers.

Another example a Manager of a company told me how they could do with Parking ticket payments appeals quicker then us and they would only need one person and not three, when I asked how he would cover lunch, holiday, sickness or when the phone was busy I was told an administrator would help, if they were both busy a third person would help, well that's not one person then is it!

 

[Gilly]

I agree. As long as you don't care about the quality of the end product. Look what happened to hospital cleaning after it was out-sourced. It certainly got cheaper, which was why it was done. Of course the wards now haven't been cleaned properly since, but that's a small price to pay isn't it? The in-house staff may not care much, but the the outside providers don't care at all.

Isn't that due to mismanagement more than anything. If the contract states a certain level of service (which is a failing on the department if it doesn't) and the contractor isn't meeting that requirement, then they're in breach of contract. Bin them and get someone better.

 

[scorza]

Isn't that due to mismanagement more than anything. If the contract states a certain level of service (which is a failing on the department if it doesn't) and the contractor isn't meeting that requirement, then they're in breach of contract. Bin them and get someone better.

So you're the guy who made the decision to outsource the cleaning, and now you're saying that the benefits you said would materialise haven't, but it'll be different next time because there'll be a different company logo on the same cleaning staff uniforms.

 

[Gilly]

So you're the guy who made the decision to outsource the cleaning, and now you're saying that the benefits you said would materialise haven't, but it'll be different next time because there'll be a different company logo on the same cleaning staff uniforms.

Yep. And your business learns and grows and becomes better for mistakes it won't make again, and any company wanting to win your business will need to demonstrate that they will meet all criteria for not failing on the same thing.

 

[Meridian]

Isn't that due to mismanagement more than anything. If the contract states a certain level of service (which is a failing on the department if it doesn't) and the contractor isn't meeting that requirement, then they're in breach of contract. Bin them and get someone better.

First, the people dealing with the contract don't care about the quality, they only care about the cost. The people who do care about the quality aren't dealing with the contract, so their opinion counts for nought. Second, even if they did care, quality is a minor issue compared to cost. The cleaning company promises to meet a quality standard, but doesn't. By the time anyone high enough up the Greasy pole notices, the contract can't be revoked. If the commissioning company threatens this, a combination of bribes, blandishments and threats usually sees that the revoking never happens. If it get high enough. So the contract managers just shrug and say everything will be OK.

Third, even supposing the contract gets cancelled, any new company which gets the bid is going to be the cheapest. Which means they'll be rubbish. Fast, cheap, good - pick any two. The whole point is that this is about saving money, and nothing else.