Baxter Mixes Live Bird Flu Virus with Seasonal Flu And Ships it to other Labs

Keltik THC · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:15

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5iV_RT6oBK3tOhtsWf5pnu5OIby9w

:eek:

oh dear god, so they mixed H5N1 with HN32 (highly virulent strain of influenza) then shipped it out with the Vaccine... i have family who are virologists and they all said that if their was a sure fire way of creating a Human strain it would be to mix it with another virulent strain of human flu...

am i being too cynical when i call into question a company who makes vaccines who then ships a live H5n1 and Hn32 vaccine to 18 countries? a company whos business is selling vaccines, specifically to these 18 countries.

according to my family members who work in virology they have advised that if anyone took this vaccine then they could incubate it for any ammount of time, so if this were the opening of the human-h5n1 pandoras box we may not know for time to come.

what i also would like to note is that our Media has completely ignored this story - go and google it - you can only find it in places like Canada etc. This is one of the biggest stories of 2009 so far if not this decade.

my god.

Nzyme · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:17

From what i understand about Flu, the actually virus is in 2 parts but only 1 part mutates, so we need to create a vaccine which attacks the part which doesn't change from virus to virus and we will be fine

Wiggins · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:17

I know absolutely tripe all about virology but this does seem quite disturbing especially if it was to create a human strain.

andyinoz · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:22

terrifying. lol, now i have visions of dawn of the dead, except everyones sneezing and dying as opposed to eating each other... lovely

Morgoth · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:23

Yeah, that's a bit of a blunder. I don't think they done it on purpose to try and profiteer from it though.

Tee Hee Johnson · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:24

Sorry... for a second there i thought Baxter's (the soup people) has been messin with H5N1 with HN32 :\

I thought they were going to make a super soup to combat the virus...!

The link does not back this theory up tho lol!

Cybermyk · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:27

I wondered why it said T-Virus on my flu jab container last November :eek:

[FnG]magnolia · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:36

Keltik THC said:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5iV_RT6oBK3tOhtsWf5pnu5OIby9w

i have family who are virologists

Would you mind stating their qualifications and research area of work?

so if this were the opening of the human-h5n1 pandoras box we may not know for time to come.

That pesky Pandora and her box :rolleyes:

what i also would like to note is that our Media has completely ignored this story

Noted but it's not a very interesting story.

masterluke · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:43

I am (alongside everyone else on this board) not qualified to make a decision over the impact of this.

Much better to admit you dont know, rather than make some pseudo-scientific assumption.

Minstadave · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:47

You need to have two active strains of flu virus infecting the same host at the same time for any chance of recombination. The host has to be susceptible to the two subtypes for reassortment to occur.

If it has only one live virus then they can't recombine. If there's two live strains then there is a risk. The article wasn't all that clear on which is the case.

masterluke · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:53

The article seems to be suggesting that there is very little risk of this creating any serious issues. It appears more interested in the procedural issues that allowed the mistake to occur so that lessons can be learned to stop a mistake like this in the future. This seems to me to be the responsible step for them to take and I dont really understand how anything more sinister can be read into this.

[FnG]magnolia · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:55

Keltic THC said:
what i also would like to note is that our Media has completely ignored this story

masterluke said:
The article seems to be suggesting that there is very little risk of this creating any serious issues. It appears more interested in the procedural issues that allowed the mistake to occur so that lessons can be learned to stop a mistake like this in the future. This seems to me to be the responsible step for them to take and I dont really understand how anything more sinister can be read into this.

Keltik THC · 20 Mar 2009 at 20:57

Minstadave said:
Flu vaccines are subunits, I doubt there's any risk of creating a super-strain here. You need to have two active strains of flu virus infecting the same host at the same time for any chance of recombination. If it has only one live virus then they can't recombine.

so, having live H5n1 and live Hn32 in a vaccine that could have been administred to humans is very dangerous then?

im a layman aswell, but im just saying the virologists ive spoken to have said that if they did do this then not only is it complete madness but highly dangerous, as i said in my OP - i was told that having 2 live viruses in a vaccine, especially with a highly virulent strain is dangerous for the obvious reasons - i just thought some of you would have been a bit surprised about this like me, that if this is true then a company can just endanger the lives of potentially millions of people and no one cares.

im just a bit suprised some of you have said this story isnt very interesting, i mean, if someone sends anthrax then its all over the news for years but if a vaccine company ships out live H5n1 mixed with live Hn32 in a vaccine that could be injected directly into the blood stream of some un-suspecting person isnt news worthy?

i just thought it was something some of you guys might like to know about.

[FnG]magnolia · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:03

Keltik THC said:
so, having live H5n1 and live Hn32 in a vaccine that could have been administred to humans is very dangerous then?

But it wasn't.

im a layman aswell, but im just saying the virologists ive spoken to have said that if they did do this then not only is it complete madness but highly dangerous,

Again, would you mind stating their qualifications and their area of research? Are they published at all?

i just thought some of you would have been a bit surprised about this like me, that if this is true then a company can just endanger the lives of potentially millions of people and no one cares.

Potentially? Millions? IF true? *sigh*

if someone sends anthrax then its all over the news for years

Genuinely curious, did this happen? I remember an American incident in the 80's (?) but nothing since.

but if a vaccine company ships out live H5n1 mixed with live Hn32 in a vaccine that could be injected directly into the blood stream of some un-suspecting person isnt news worthy?

It becomes newsworthy when the minute risk becomes an occurence.

i just thought it was something some of you guys might like to know about.

Fair play, this is less conspiracy than your other stuff but still way off the mark. IMO, of course

Jokester · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:03

If it contained live avian flu and human flu for human use I might agree with you.

But it wasn't.

steinooo · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:03

what is the purpose of this company mixing them again?

masterluke · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:07

Keltik THC said:
im just a bit suprised some of you have said this story isnt very interesting, i mean, if someone sends anthrax then its all over the news for years but if a vaccine company ships out live H5n1 mixed with live Hn32 in a vaccine that could be injected directly into the blood stream of some un-suspecting person isnt news worthy?

The anthrax example is silly.. that was a terrorist incident a undoubtedly dangerous substance was sent to individuals intended to cause serious harm.
This is a procedural mistake which is categorised by the experts as having "minimal" risk.

I'm not saying its not news worthy at all, obviously they need to take a look at their procedures. But if the experts aren't saying that there is a serious risk then the layman shouldnt worry too much either.

Jokester · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:07

Thread title edited for clarity, as it was not a vaccine.

ChroniC · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:09

Who cares they are close to a cure.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4747909.stm

Ricochet J · 20 Mar 2009 at 21:10

Wouldn't the two Virii turn out to be something good?
Say something bad is negative ( - ) and something good is positive ( + ) then

Live Bird Flu - * Seasonal Flu - = +

So a minus times a minus = plus