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Brexit Discussion - The new thread

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Feek, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 9,411

    I thought all nursing was degree level nowadays.
     
  2. malachi

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Jun 27, 2006

    Posts: 9,404

    Location: Earth

    That's what I thought too.
     
  3. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 14,220

    Would hope so, but some of the stories I've heard from people's hospital stays in recent years...
     
  4. neviditelny

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 15, 2015

    Posts: 1,021

    It is a degree, but there is varous levels you can obtain it. As I work as a Health Care Assistant in the NHS I could go through a pathway to first do about 2 years as a foundation degree to become a Band 4 Associate Practitioner and then a 2 year degree to become a Registered Nurse (Band 5) while I work so I wouldn't need to go to uni for 3 years full time.
    There is also a 4 year degree you could do while still working (if I remember correct).
     
  5. neviditelny

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 15, 2015

    Posts: 1,021

    My issue with the nursing training is that is too much focus on hollistic care and everything around nursing instead of actually looking after a patient and understanding what is going on with the patient. Too many newly qualified nurses lack a lot of understanding in the pathological side of nursing and generally seems to know what to do "because this regulation and legislation states we do it like this" instead of "this is what happening to the patient and we do this to counteract on that"... And the management love to load us with various paperwork to fill in to achieve goals and prevent things which leads to less time for nurses to actually deal with the patients themselves.
    A lot of nurses are also fairly reluctant to deal with patients more than at drug rounds as well unfortunately...
     
  6. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 14,220

    It's like that everywhere in the public sector now. Paperwork for every little thing. You know it's bad when the army is having to fill in risk assessments for having a dart board in their kitchen.
     
  7. neviditelny

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 15, 2015

    Posts: 1,021

    It also varies a lot from Trust to Trust as well. I just wonder why can't it be more centralised and organised in the NHS?
     
  8. Dj_Jestar

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 28,557

    Location: Back in East London

    It used to be. Then the tories broke it up, introduced the internal market, and primed the different trusts to in-fight, ripe for privatisation.
     
  9. Caracus2k

    Soldato

    Joined: Jan 27, 2009

    Posts: 5,080

    Mostly the low skilled and poorly paid ones....

    Studies that show little overall effect on employment as a result of mass migration mask that it is the poorest in the host countries who bear the brunt of the negative consequences whilst it is the better of who tend to reap the benefits...

    So it's always nice to see certain forum posters here harping on about thoose 'thick/stupid' leave voters who are themselves apparently too dense to realise that perhaps some of them voted the way they did knowing they were getting the rough end of the deal and not because they were misled.
     
  10. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,972

    Posted this in the Election thread, but needs posting here too...

    Brexit and Brexiteer divisiveness and willingness to undermine institutions is destroying global faith in the UK...

     
  11. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 13, 2006

    Posts: 64,645

    But most seemed to be under the impression they'd get a better deal post Brexit - so I'd say they were misled.
     
  12. Freakbro

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 29, 2010

    Posts: 15,620

    Location: Lincs

    As usual you are putting the horse before the cart, they aren't taking these jobs 'from' British citizens they came over to do these jobs since there were vacancies to be filled as British citizens aren't aspiring to do these jobs anymore, as evidenced by the struggle these sectors are having in filling vacancies now the EU numbers are falling. Why aren't these postions being snapped up by the locals if those jobs were being taken away from them?


    Yea yea, no one votes to make themselves worse off. Funnily enough, this is why the Leave side didn't campaign on a slogan of "Vote for Brexit, make yourself even worse off for the next 10 years and wait 50 years to see what any benefits might be"

    No, they voted exclusively on the fact that voting for Brexit would make their lives better [in what ever form that manifested to the individual], from day 1 in fact, because it would sort out all the issues of their lives, which were coming exclusively from the EU [so they were told]. So yea, you do have to be pretty thick, gullible or naive to have believed that and then you have to be even more stupid, disingenuous or a charlatan to now say that people voted for Brexit under the knowledge things would get harder for them, in any term - short, medium or long.
     
  13. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,972

    Back to the debunked myth Brexit makes economic sense. Look at the figures. Appreciate how Brexit is going to dwarf these numbers you're talking about, and its effects are hitting exactly that same group.

    How obtuse does someone have to be to keep returning to the same, flawed argument over and over, only to have it disproved, over and over, and lack capacity to review and improve their worldview?
     
  14. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 13,436

    Location: Hertfordshire

    I did a summer strawberry picking as a youngster. Seem to recall everyone being English(though it was 30 years ago so may be wrong). At what point did the English get too arrogant to do these jobs. Is this not a problem of our own making which got solved by the EU? Rather than a problem caused by the EU.
     
  15. Freakbro

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 29, 2010

    Posts: 15,620

    Location: Lincs

    Education, Education, Education... remember that?

    We had a massive push towards higher education, with the aim of 50% of school leavers to go to university. We changed all the polytechnics into universities and opened the access to all with student loans.

    Children are educated now to aspire to be better, gain a higher education and get a good job, very few people look at working on the land or in a factory as a life choice anymore.

    And now with technology and the internet thrown into the mix, do you want to be out grading potatoes in the freezing cold or do you want to make your money an easier way?
     
  16. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 13,436

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Yeah but that only rules out some of the workers. These are also generally seasonal jobs rather than a life choice.

    Either way its just another load of brexiter guff as these EU workers were never a problem.
     
  17. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 32,315

    Location: Co Durham

    Everybody wants better for themselves now. I interviewed a new graduate 15 years ago who told me he wasnt prepared to "get out of bed for less than £25k per annum". unfortunately for him we had at least 6 people apply for the job who were all qualified and experienced at doing the job who all wanted less money than that.

    Our lowest paid "unskilled" worker is a flag layer where I currently work. I can train anybody to do that quickly. Its a physical job and outside all year round. We pay £13.50 per hour plus overtime and its based up North. Can we find people prepared to do the job? No, there is a shortage as young people dont want the hard work and outside jobs anymore. So I can fully understand why nobody wants the minimum wage strawberry picking jobs
     
  18. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 13,436

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Thats all fine when you have a ready made solution of EU workers. :p
     
  19. Btone

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 23, 2003

    Posts: 1,036

    Location: N.I.

    it also not a simple as "Not wanting to work" but is tied into the benefit system, My sister would have locals looking for work but they only can do 16 hours because anymore and it would affect their benefits, they would be will to do more hours and are good workers, but the hours she can give them depends on what orders she get in as she selling very fresh food so one week she might be able to give them 40 hours one week and the next week 4 hours. trouble is if the go over that 16 hours a week they could loose there benefits and it can be a nightmare to get them back, so they all stick to the 16 hours even tho there is more hours for them
     
  20. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 13,436

    Location: Hertfordshire

    So another issue losing all the EU workers wont solve?