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Brexit Discussion - The new thread

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by Feek, Sep 5, 2019.

  1. VincentHanna

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jul 30, 2013

    Posts: 19,954

    Think i'll do the opposite when I have to renew my passport - Put a burgundy EU case around it :)
     
  2. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 33,068

    Location: Co Durham

    More great news. Australia says that the UK dropping its hormone beef ban must be on the table in any trade talks.

    Everybody queuing up to shaft the UK I see.

    Are we sick of winning yet?
     
  3. Jono8

    Caporegime

    Joined: May 20, 2007

    Posts: 29,747

    Location: Surrey

    Again, this is what annoys me so much about the whole thing.

    There was this total misunderstanding where brexiteers thought we could just have trade deals with people all on our own terms and without having to follow another countries laws/way of doing things in terms of products.

    Now we have left the EU, we will likely have to abide by even more horrible rules/regulations on things (like chlorinated chicken and the hormone beef highlighted in your post, immigration and freedom of movement from countries further away and with less cultural alignment etc).

    I think a more in depth look at the word "deal" needs to be done by some.

    They are likely going to be wishing they could go back to how good we had it with the EU...
     
  4. Steampunk

    Soldato

    Joined: Jun 1, 2013

    Posts: 6,956

    People still think we are a massively powerful country with a worldwide empire, and can dictate what we want from others. We have not been that for over eighty years. Our power in the last thirty years has been from our economy (ie finance/banking), and that only works because of our membership of the EU and our position as the english-speaking gateway to the richest trading block in the world.

    Once we are out of the EU, we simply will not have the clout to compete against other trading block by ourselves. This is especially true when one of those giant blocs is the EU right on our doorstep. We will "take back control" by choosing to do what everyone else bigger than us (ie China, US, EU, Russia, India, etc) tells us to do.
     
  5. D.P.

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 30,421

    but hormone fed beef is what people knew they were voting for. This is hormone fed beef reared by people who speak English, non of that filthy French beef.
     
  6. inogen

    Mobster

    Joined: Jul 19, 2009

    Posts: 3,760

    Of course they will. The nutjobs never will, but it won't take much for 10 or 20% of the population who voted leave but could have voted remain if the wind was blowing differently to realise what a terrible mistake is being made.

    Of course, it will all be because they were lied to and they'll have a point.
     
  7. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 9,657

    The EU countries know the UK must get some sort of deal for financing so fishing which the Faragists demanded to be UK only in our waters will go. Denmark, Spain and France want fishing in UK waters. Fishing is little compared to finance in the UK economy so will go. I am relishing the spin they will put on this one. Experts told them this would happen but experts pfft.
     
  8. Mr Badger

    Soldato

    Joined: Dec 27, 2009

    Posts: 6,719

    The hardcore 40% (or whatever) may never change their mind, but we are long past the point where a lot of people realised that Brexit is not going to deliver what they were promised and/or that leaving the EU because you were fed up with the Tory establishment doesn't make a lot of sense. Brexit is being delivered via a general election first past the post result and not a confirmatory referendum that would have allowed people to give their view on how Brexit is actually shaping up.
     
  9. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 33,068

    Location: Co Durham

    And i have just heard on the radio that due to a shortage of low skilled workers the requirement for an immigrant work visa that somebody earns £30k is going to be reduced to £25k. I thought we had too much immigration and they were stealing our jobs?
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  10. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 3,233

    I get the impression it's not been about what's best for the country for a longtime, if it ever was, it's more about we won you lost, what they've won seems to matter less and less.

    I sort of get where they're coming from as for decades they've felt like their vote didn't matter, that no matter who they voted for nothing really improved, things just got worse and worse. I have to say though i disagree that the solution to that feeling is such an extreme reaction, it's akin to asking for a pay rise each year, getting a pay rise, and then one year punching your manager in the face because the pay rises weren't big enough.
     
  11. Mr Badger

    Soldato

    Joined: Dec 27, 2009

    Posts: 6,719

    Fixed that for you.
     
  12. Kermit

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 27, 2002

    Posts: 2,538

    Location: UK

    So on one hand we're going to get shafted because we're minnows and on the other we're going to get shafted by an even smaller minnow. Which is it? Did Canada (10% population of EU) or Japan (20% population of EU) get shafted by the EU with their FT deals? The answer is NO, the deals were agreeable to both sides.

    The reality however remainers want to try slant things is that trade deals are exactly what their name implies, deals & agreements. If we/other side don't like a deal that includes X, Y or Z, we/other won't sign it or keep talking.

    Remember we do ALL our trade with the US/China/Japan (until last year) without a FTA & can continue with that if needs be, we don't need one with the US although a fairly comprehensive FTA with the EU will be very useful to both sides.
     
  13. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 14,308

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Won't be a US trade deal anyway, the deranged trumpers are raging about Huawei. :p
     
  14. inogen

    Mobster

    Joined: Jul 19, 2009

    Posts: 3,760

    We did have trade agreements though. Not free trade agreements. But trade agreements. The kind that take years and decades to agree.
     
  15. Steampunk

    Soldato

    Joined: Jun 1, 2013

    Posts: 6,956

    Fact is those "minnows" are part of trade blocs and have the backing of multiple partner countries, making them larger than us as a whole. That's why countries become part of economic blocs. If we want to get a deal from the EU, and a small member wants to stop it until they get what they want from us, we'll have no power to stop that happening. Same as our WTO deal. Be prepared to give up the Falklands and Gibraltar, just like we're giving up Northern Ireland.

    In fact, being so close to the EU will work against us, as we've already seen countries such as New Zealand say they have no plans for special deals with the UK, as they intend to simply keep selling to the EU, and we can buy from the EU with the additional costs of another middle-man and extra red-tape. Being so close to the economic gravity of the EU, whilst not being a member will make us rule takers, not rule makers.
     
  16. Mr Badger

    Soldato

    Joined: Dec 27, 2009

    Posts: 6,719

    The level of misunderstanding in your post makes me sad.
     
  17. Double07

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Jan 10, 2006

    Posts: 1,197

    Location: Scotland

    Deleted. Promised myself I wouldn't indulge in political discourse on a forum! Poor by me.
     
  18. robfosters

    Caporegime

    Joined: Dec 1, 2010

    Posts: 32,257

    Location: Welling, London

    I’d take a confirmatory referendum right now with no worries. That landslide election result in favour of the only main party promising brexit makes me confident leave would win again.
     
  19. Kermit

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 27, 2002

    Posts: 2,538

    Location: UK

    your level of response makes me sadder still.
     
  20. Kermit

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 27, 2002

    Posts: 2,538

    Location: UK

    Its a deal between EU and Japan not EU and Japan + Trade block but of course you'll reply with some made up nonsense in response.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47086737