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Brexit Discussion

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by FrenchTart, Sep 11, 2016.

  1. String

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 6, 2013

    Posts: 11,427

    LOL@ the Scotland conversation.

    Everyone knows that the only guarantee Scotland has of being in the EU is to reject Independence and stay a member of the UK...Oh, hang about... This is the EU referendum thread, isn't it. :p
     
  2. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    You sound like a Brexiteer ;)

    The reality is that the main thing the countries of the eu can always agree on is the rules. It may not be just Spain taking that position, by the way, but it only takes one country to hold it.

    So the reality of Scotland leaving the UK post brexit and rejoining the eu is a messy, painful split where the uk uses the same strategy and logic the eu did to try and force Scotland to remain as closely aligned as possible, followed by 10 years plus of waiting to be accepted back into the eu, assuming an independent Scotland could meet the Copenhagen requirements in time.

    That's the reality based position, anything else is just a Brexiteer style unicorn fantasy.
     
  3. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    At the time, that was true. The eu were crystal clear that the membership belonged to the uk, and if Scotland left, they would have to reapply for membership and join the queue.

    If this whole brexit experience had demonstrated anything, it's that the EU stick to what they say.
     
  4. Screeeech

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 29, 2014

    Posts: 3,107

    Location: Farnham, Surrey



    Does have some swearies in it, but I think it’s a pretty fair and honest appraisal of the situation..
     
  5. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: Nov 22, 2006

    Posts: 12,152

    Well I'm kinda "in the loop", so yea...

    It's pretty common knowledge that they are bad. Not because the individuals are bad because they aren't, but they lack equipment, training and don't get to participate in much. So also lack experience.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
  6. String

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 6, 2013

    Posts: 11,427

    It was David Cameron who made the statement, and the irony is not lost on Scotland. The fact is, it's completely hypothetical because Scotland is not an independent nation, and that is partly down to the fact we wanted to remain in the EU.
     
  7. Bonjour

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Mar 30, 2004

    Posts: 9,076

    Location: London

    Cracking march yesterday. Kudos to everyone that turned out. Took nearly two hours just to walk the length of Hyde Park.

    I'm thinking we only really have two options at this point; all-out, balls-to-the-wall, no-deal Brexit or no Brexit at all. Anything less (especially May's deal), and Brexiteers will continue to blame the EU for all the country's ills and say we didn't Brexit properly.
     
  8. mburn_83

    Gangster

    Joined: Jun 1, 2004

    Posts: 430

    Location: Chryston, Glasgow

    In addition to the fact that the words of the UK Prime minister and Parliament are completely untrustworthy.

    The more this debacle stretches on the greater the argument for the UK splitting gets.

    The latest rumour is that Gove will now stab may in the back and become PM - which would take this farce to previously unimaginable depths.
     
  9. Harlequin

    Mobster

    Joined: Jun 17, 2004

    Posts: 2,928

    Location: Eastbourne , East Sussex.


    12/12/2019 is when they can try again to remove her, not before. Unless its a GE and she loses her job.
     
  10. Screeeech

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 29, 2014

    Posts: 3,107

    Location: Farnham, Surrey

    I’m not sure that’s true in reality though, if discontent is running so high and ministers are willing to attempt a coup, then essentially - she’s not in power at all, and she’d essentially have to go.

    (I think?)
     
  11. JRS

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jun 6, 2004

    Posts: 13,528

    Location: Burton-on-Trent

     
  12. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    That's not quite true. She can resign before that, and she may well do if it is clear (as it was with thatcher) that she can't command a cabinet.
     
  13. Harlequin

    Mobster

    Joined: Jun 17, 2004

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    Location: Eastbourne , East Sussex.

    The Conservative party has its rules, and one is they cannot attempt for force removal inside of 12 months of a previous attempt, she would have to resign, or lose her seat as an MP.

    edit: I should have added that to the quoted post by Dolph to clarify.
     
  14. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    Indeed. Remaining in the UK at the time was the only way to retain eu membership. Likewise now the only way to retain eu membership is to persuade the rest of the uk to stay.

    There is no way for an independent eu to bypass the eu membership requirements and process, as the eu commission confirmed in 2014 and reiterated in 2017.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.th...cotland-would-have-to-apply-for-eu-membership

     
  15. String

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 6, 2013

    Posts: 11,427

    Or they act with some dignity and support a confidence vote tabled by the opposition. They've had 2 votes in recent months and supported her and now they're scratching their heads wondering how they can get rid of her.

    Talk about idiots. :p
     
  16. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    No, the rules state they cannot have another vote of no confidence among mps for 12 months. They say nothing whatsoever about having to be loyal to the leader or doing other things to make her position untenable.
     
  17. Harlequin

    Mobster

    Joined: Jun 17, 2004

    Posts: 2,928

    Location: Eastbourne , East Sussex.


    They might hate May, but they Hate Corbyn even more, and given the last time May went for her Thatcher moment and failed, we *probably* wont get a GE until 2022.
     
  18. Jono8

    Caporegime

    Joined: May 20, 2007

    Posts: 27,946

    Location: Surrey

  19. Harlequin

    Mobster

    Joined: Jun 17, 2004

    Posts: 2,928

    Location: Eastbourne , East Sussex.


    Which is what I said or at least was implied; I would argue that her position was untenable the day after the GE in 2017 when she had to do a deal with the DUP to stay on, should have crossed the floor but didn't. Literally they are all self centered **** throwing monkies who have no clue what to actually do.
     
  20. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 46,530

    Location: Plymouth

    I don't disagree with anything, apart from the idea that this view is exclusive to tory mps. There are a great many MPs on the opposition benches that meet that definition too.