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Brexit Discussion

Discussion in 'SC Archive' started by FrenchTart, Sep 11, 2016.

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  1. Scrutinize

    Soldato

    Joined: Apr 4, 2003

    Posts: 7,374

    The unknown
    Where's the evidence for this?
     
  2. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 14,308

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Labours wishy washy stance is why I voted Lib Dem and would probably vote for them at a GE unless Labours stance changes.
     
  3. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 9,657

    He seems to be doing a Trumpeter but how is he going to pay for the tax cuts(Corporate and personal)? Borrowing? The Tories have spent the last ten years preaching that austerity was necessary as we cannot borrow our way out of the Crash. That should go down nicely.
     
  4. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Changes to what? How about they offer a second referendum in their manifesto. Then what?
     
  5. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 3,233

    And yet probably the most certain way to force them into getting behind a 2nd referendum is to not vote for them and instead vote for a party who is unambiguous about another referendum.
     
  6. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    If they dont offer a second ref in their manifesto then yes you are right.
     
  7. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 14,308

    Location: Hertfordshire

    Nope, stop backing any form of brexit.
     
  8. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 3,233

    And there will be no manifesto until either 2022 or if/when a GE is called and the chances of that happening are next to zero.

    The if we can't get a GE we'll support a 2nd referendum is a cop-out as you (third person) can always (until 2022) pretend you may get a GE tomorrow, next week, next month, etc, etc, and so you never need to commit to the 2nd referendum option because you can always pretend a GE is just around the corner.
     
  9. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    So what voting are you going to do between now and then? Im talking about a snap election, not 2022.
     
  10. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 47,573

    Location: Plymouth

    Are you deluding yourself, or trying to mislead others?

    With corbyn at the helm, Labour have nothing to offer the country.
     
  11. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Yes you have made it plain that is your opinion. No one is in any doubt you think that, but at least i have never voted Conservative.
     
  12. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 3,233

    If a snap GE happened then Labour no longer support a 2nd referendum, correct me if I'm wrong but iirc Labour said they'll only support a 2nd referendum if they can't get a GE.

    If there was a GE tomorrow Labour would campaign for a red version of leaving the EU and there would be no 2nd referendum.
     
  13. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Lets see. If they dont offer a second referendum in their manifesto then I recommend no one votes for them.
     
  14. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 47,573

    Location: Plymouth

    It's not my opinion. It's reality. The Labour Party stood on a hard brexit manifesto (the inclusion of ending freedom of movement and state aid restrictions means that it cannot be considered anything else, because those two things are required for a soft brexit). The leader of this party and his minions and acolytes have been staunch Brexiteers for years, and are determined to see it through.

    To fail to acknowledge this and push Labour under the current leadership as a party of remain , you either have to be a moron unwilling and unable to accept reality, or a liar who accepts the reality, but misleads others to get a Labour government anyway.

    There is no third way, moron or liar, which is it?
     
  15. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Give it a rest Dolph we have moved on from that. Stop with the personal insults.
     
  16. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 47,573

    Location: Plymouth

    That is another part of the reality.

    The only way labour can be reconsidered as a party of remain is if the current leader and his acolytes are removed from power.
     
  17. Murphy

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 3,233

    But it's not let's see, they've laid-out exactly how they want or see things panning out, they've been repeating it for ages.

    They want a red version of Brexit, if they can't get that they want a GE and if they can't get that they want a 2nd referendum....They can't get a red version of Brexit without a GE and they can pretend a GE is going to happen tomorrow until 2022 so they never have to commit to a 2nd referendum.
     
  18. Dolph

    Man of Honour

    Joined: Oct 17, 2002

    Posts: 47,573

    Location: Plymouth

    It's not an insult to highlight that your position cannot come from reality, and to ask which position it instead comes from. Your position is flawed, the flaw can only drive from one of two positions, a logic failure or an honesty failure.
     
  19. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Its pretty simple. Their will be no 'red brexit' unless there is a Labour government, there will be no Labour government without a GE. There will not be a major win for Labour if they do not offer a second ref in their manifesto. So if they dont offer a second referendum in their manifesto that will be the only way they can get in power there is no chance of the Tories offering a red brexit.

    If they dont offer second referendum in their manifesto then dont vote for them if you used to vote Labour in the past. Im not sure who you voted for before so it isnt clear where you are coming from. If you are anti Labour then you will never advocate voting Labour so it is a pointless discussion.

    I would also advocate Tory voters to support Libdem in either case.
     
  20. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,889

    Grow up Dolph.
     
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