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Brexit Discussion

Discussion in 'SC Archive' started by FrenchTart, Sep 11, 2016.

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  1. do_ron_ron

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Oct 23, 2002

    Posts: 9,125

    Worth mentioning is that the Israeli trade with the four MERCOSUR countries was $1.1Bn. From the same article

    So what we have is an incremental agreement only which is why it took little time. 86% of exports to Israel were already exempt from duties. You really should read the articles you post carefully before trying to make them out to be something else.
     
  2. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,557

    Also the 20 years is an exaggeration because the talks basically restarted not too long ago and yes we will be more efficient at getting deals, just not good ones.
     
  3. terley

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 3, 2010

    Posts: 2,438

    Not with that attitude!
     
  4. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,557

    India, Australia have already indicated they want us to relax immigration rules for a deal, most large nations will also be asking similarly.

    Considering non-EEA costs us money, this is a **** trade especially for what was "promised".
     
  5. Raymond Lin

    Suspended

    Joined: Oct 20, 2002

    Posts: 63,609

    Location: Wish i was in New York

    No pro Brexit supporter want to comment on the 20 years trade negotiation that the EU just agreed with South America?

    Anyone? On how we are going to be able to do the same but in a week? :p
     
  6. Murphy

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 2,262

    Onus probandi, you made the claim so it's your obligation to provide justification for your position.

    The European Union is not the ECB and the two are distinctly different, the ECB is more akin to a company with shareholders.

    I maybe flogging a dead horse here but after the four time of asking, are you going to answer the following?
    Is it that you can't answer, refuse to answer, are scared to answer, what?
     
  7. Tony Edwards

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 3,110

    Well if we go for a no deal brexit and refuse to pay the £39bn then we wont get on WTO terms because we will be blocked.

    We might get some deals with countries that are desperate for trade, just like we will be at that stage but they will not be as good for the people of Britain as the ones the EU have already negotiated for us as a block.

    The reason we dont have chlorinated chicken is because of the EU. The reason we dont have hormone fed beef that will decimate the British beef farmers is because of the EU.

    I just cant understand how those that support brexit can not see the potential problems that being out of the EU as far as trade deals will have on everything from fishing to agriculture to manufacturing and the services industry. Its just mind blowing.

    Thats even without the enviromental harm any future right leaning party will allow to happen and the harm that same group will do to the average person/family with health services, workers rights and public services.

    Austerity was nothing compared to the hell the right wing parties have lined up for us as a nation.
     
  8. DarkHorizon472

    Mobster

    Joined: May 16, 2007

    Posts: 3,077

    For me left v right , or remain v leave is just flag waving. What matter are the actual facts and available choices.

    The UK has had increasingly intolerant, right wing governments which have inflicted austerity, inequality and enflamed peoples intolerance by religion, culture, race, nationality etc. Many in the UK have serious struggles to get by in life and are now simply called welfare scroungers etc. so they can be ignored. In the past the left caused damage in different ways but to be fair the NHS, Welfare system, workers rights etc. came from the left so it is simply down to a good idea being a good idea, and abuse is simply abuse. Currently the left in politics has little influence.

    When it comes to a no deal Brexit it is a matter of how fast and how badly it will damage the UK. Cutting the UK instantly off from 600+ trade deals and numerous other rights, laws and agreements internationally will have a massive impact.
     
  9. altus

    Gangster

    Joined: Oct 17, 2005

    Posts: 397

    "Freedom has no price for Leavers…… Freedom has no value for Remainers."

    Remainers just dont get it, if they did, this thread would of died by now and we would of left.
    If you need the above explaining to you, there is no point in trying to explain it to you.
    I will carry on popping in with my popcorn to watch the fun though!
     
  10. DarkHorizon472

    Mobster

    Joined: May 16, 2007

    Posts: 3,077

    I would get plenty of popcorn in, so far no one has produced a detailed Brexit plan that can be implemented in the real world except May. Meaningless sound bites won't help !
     
  11. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,557

    Uhh no, you don't get it, literally the only reason we haven't left is because the leavers in government didn't vote for it.
     
  12. Murphy

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 2,262

    If you think Brexit is going to set the UK free you best prepare yourself for a very rude awaking, Brexit will be a millstone around the UK's neck for decades and strip away peoples freedoms.
     
  13. altus

    Gangster

    Joined: Oct 17, 2005

    Posts: 397

    "Meaningless"
    Thanks for proving my point about "getting" it.

    Surely Strider you meant leavers didnt fall for not really leaving?
     
  14. altus

    Gangster

    Joined: Oct 17, 2005

    Posts: 397

    "If you think Brexit is going to set the UK free you best prepare yourself for a very rude awaking, Brexit will be a millstone around the UK's neck for decades and strip away peoples freedoms."
    We will have to wait and see!
     
  15. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 20,557

    Leaving the institution of the EU is literally all that is required.

    The flimsy referendum paper only had "leave the EU" as the option, infinitely vague and therefore i am entirely correct in my assessment that we are still in the EU because of ***** like Francois.
     
  16. Caracus2k

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 27, 2009

    Posts: 4,872

    I really don't think I need to 'prove' that central banks can exert power over economies now?

    The ECB, like the bank of England, is on paper independant of parliament but accountable to them so is going to take their views quite heavily into consideration when formulating monetary policy.

     
  17. Caracus2k

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 27, 2009

    Posts: 4,872

    perhaps you should read back in the thread a bit..... where I pointed out that Israel managed to sort out a trade deal with the same trade bloc in around two year and there was a BBC article specially comparing the EU/ Mercosur deal to other excessively drawn out negotiations?

    Its hilarious that you think this is a selling point for the EU when all It actually demonstrates is that singular nations are likely to be able to far more quickly strike trade deals then the EU is with its multiple constituent nations causing more complexity and slowing things down.
     
  18. Caracus2k

    Mobster

    Joined: Jan 27, 2009

    Posts: 4,872

    As expected from you no citation.....


    A fact check on the 39 billion issue strangely makes no mention of being 'blocked from WTO terms' if we don't pay only that the EU could seek to gain a decision from the international court of justice.... I wonder why that may?



     
  19. Raymond Lin

    Suspended

    Joined: Oct 20, 2002

    Posts: 63,609

    Location: Wish i was in New York

    Isn’t it hilarious that the very article that you linked to, which was the one I read yesterday, is the very one that compare other similar deals which took decades.

    Israel is not the UK, the UK, judging by the last few years, are incompetent. They can’t even get Brexit through after 2 years, what make you think they can do a trade deal in the same time frame?

    What proof do you have that we can do it?

    And this isn’t the selling point of the EU, there are many many selling points of the EU, this is just the latest one, and a big one.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2019
  20. Murphy

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Sep 16, 2018

    Posts: 2,262

    There's a quote button for a reason you know.

    And no we don't have to wait and see, we know it's going to strip away peoples freedoms because we know it's going to make everyone poorer, we know it's going to restrict scientific research in everything from medicine to aviation, from defense to nuclear, it's going to take away the freedom Irish citizens have to move freely across the border, it's going to take away our freedom to move and work on the continent unhindered, we know it increase inequality, it could lead to power-cuts, decimation of the financial sector with thousands of jobs and millions in tax revenue, and the list goes on and on.

    The problem is leave supporters either refuse to accept the experts opinions or are being willful ignorant of the impacts of Brexit on purpose because they don't want to face up to the reality of what's about to befall the country and how it will result in losing control and a lack of freedom, ask anyone who's just lost their job, who's seen the cost of everyday goods increase by at least 30-50%, who's just had their house repossessed, is living on the streets, depending on handouts, and hasn't eaten in days, ask them how free they feel.

    No, but you do need to prove how a central bank can exert power on individual nations within a monetary union, saying otherwise would be like saying when the BoE changes interest rates it's detrimental to Scotland and an advantage to London, or even more laughable that a central policy set by the BoE that applies to the entire UK favors Chichester over Corby.

    Why is it leave supporters view the union of four nations called the UK is good but the Union of 19 nations that makeup the Eurozone is bad, and why is it they can't see the similarities like a central bank setting a central policy that applies to all members equally.

    And if you're going with the on paper they're independent but accountable to parliaments line you may want to look into who, out of the ECB and the BoE, are more independent, before you make yourself look even more foolish.

    Still waiting for you to answer this BTW, is it safe to assume you don't have an answer?
    That i was right and you were wrong? Because if so it makes me wonder what else you've got wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2019
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