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Brexit Discussion

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by FrenchTart, Sep 11, 2016.

  1. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,018

    I don't think anyone said Boris would never be PM, but I guess it's possible they may have said something like, "The Conservatives wouldn't be so dumb as to appoint Boris."

    But then nobody foresaw Arron Banks' call to Brexiteers to infiltrate the party, and the result on average IQ that must have had.
     
  2. McstylisT

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 8, 2008

    Posts: 1,743

    Location: ENGLAND !!

    He said that because of fear from the reality. Because that was the most dangerous threat to his ideology.
    Listening to him lately he is not a happy chippy is he. Offcom waiting in the wings for him for his final strike. Let’s hope he takes the bait soon enough and says something he shouldn’t.
     
  3. McstylisT

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Oct 8, 2008

    Posts: 1,743

    Location: ENGLAND !!

    I don’t think nobody has said the trade agreement is a problem at all. We can happily continue if they agree to re negotiate and award a free trade deal like the EU was designed for. But they want to have full licence to be involved or to lead the fore site. Which is where the problems begin.
     
  4. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,731

    Eh no it's still about Ireland, nice try though.
     
  5. Greebo

    Caporegime

    Joined: Jan 20, 2005

    Posts: 30,813

    Location: Co Durham

    Though amazingly over 50% of the Tory membership would prefer Farage as their PM if it meant we got Brexit!
     
  6. Tony Edwards

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 4, 2018

    Posts: 2,421

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...al-charges-electoral-commission-a8964831.html
     
  7. Dj_Jestar

    Caporegime

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 28,441

    Location: Back in East London

    Pure ignorance all wrapped up with a terrible-grammar bow. You're doing so much to dispel the stereotype.

    Why would, or even should, the EU gives us, and I quote, "a free trade deal"? Where are you getting that they "were designed for" that very purpose? They explicitly are not designed for that at all. You want free trade with the rest of the EU? You need to abide by their standards and agreements to do so.

    And just what the hell are you blathering on about with "they want to have full license to run the fore sight"?

    For someone who is so proud of their location being England that they capitalise and punctuate with a handful of exclamation marks, you are about as coherent in the native language as a two year old. Or are you gripping a bottle while you type?
     
  8. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,281

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    May was elected. She also won an election. Everyone remaining in the current Conservative Party leadership contest has been elected. We don't vote for Prime Ministers.

    Hence your 'bureaucrats' observation is also incorrect.

    But I imagine that the point you wanted to make was that the next Prime Minister will not have been Prime Minister following a general election. That would be correct. But they were elected at the last general election.

    So it is difficult to understand what point you're trying to make, as your statement is incorrect on a number of different levels.
     
  9. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,731

    Ahh but Boris himself called Brown unelected, that's the low bar of discussion set.

    Ergo if Boris doesn't want to be an unelected uselesscrat he should call a GE.
     
  10. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,281

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    No, I think that expenses-fiddling EU exit preference switching Arron Banks' funded puppet fake fishermen's friend definitely no links to Russia milkshake-clad Nigel Farage has got there before you with that one.
     
  11. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,281

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    Or he could just ignore the troll just as Brown did.

    Seriously, if you want to find double standards against past-Boris Johnson statements, there must be pages of ones that are superior to that one.

    But perhaps try and have a discussion and debate around whatever point you're trying to make. There's no sidebar of point scoring in this forum, you know. If there is, it is in your mind and nobody else is playing.
     
  12. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,731

    The point is that he made a statement about the processes of governance and if he wants to act in accordance to that statement he should bloody well follow through or he should retract his statement.

    Plenty of people in the country also thought Brown was unelected trash, so theres obviously some commons belief in this statement being true. The fact is that the public is increasingly expecting a presidentialisation of the post and the fact it isn't is running contrary to public belief. It began with Blair and hasn't really stopped gaining pressure.

    It also wasn't just Boris either, most of the high ranking Tories from 2007-2019 have alluded as much like Hague, Cameron and May all having statements to this effect.
     
  13. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,281

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    Well, if people are expecting a 'presidentialisation' of the post of Prime Minister, then forcing an election when one changes only reinforces that view.

    Like Corbyn, Boris has been in an element of opposition, mostly to his own party, all his life. Like Corbyn, he's also been very active outside parliament, although in Boris' case it has been being the pre-internet Katie Hopkins 'journalist' or 'commentator' rather than Corbyn standing up for any cause that opposed the UK mainstream government.

    It is going to leave him with a lot of contradictions in the future. But don't pick this particular hill to die on, especially when it is incorrect.
     
  14. StriderX

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 18, 2008

    Posts: 18,731

    It may be technically incorrect in respect to the commons rules, but a big part of British politics is about convention and if the convention has changed to proving you're elected, then surely that makes it important?

    Convention can be broken, but as we've seen with the Tories and Bercow, the Tories don't like doing that. I guess it's how you measure which side of this convention has bigger modern weighting with the public... Regardless it wont really matter because Boris wont be able to deal with the moderate MP's at all, so no this hill isn't worth dying on.
     
  15. garnett

    Mobster

    Joined: Mar 25, 2008

    Posts: 4,018

    I disagree. There's definitely an art to showing just how hypocritical someone is by managing to find such a specifically relevant hypocritical quote from someone - be that Johnson, Farage, Trump etc - for a specific moment in time.

    Showing that they're chumps even by their own standards is a pretty definitive argument for why people are dumb to vote for them.
     
  16. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: May 15, 2007

    Posts: 11,281

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    Fair enough, I'm not going to choose this hill to die on either.

    My point was twofold:

    - the point being made was weak because it was incorrect, irrespective of what Boris said in the past; and
    - Boris has said so much extraordinary **** in the past that there are better things to catch him out on, and if someone starts today with one a day they'll be unlikely to run out for the duration of his premiership (if he gets there)
     
  17. a1ex2001

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 14, 2005

    Posts: 11,205

    Location: Here and There...

    Lead the fore site? Still sure English is your first language?
     
  18. Screeeech

    Mobster

    Joined: Dec 29, 2014

    Posts: 3,118

    Location: Farnham, Surrey

    It's just ridiculous reading what people like @McstylisT say, there's absolutely no understanding or comprehension of how the world works, how treaties and agreements work between countries, or how economies function. It's just a misplaced sense of entitlement, that we can just get whatever we ask for because ENGLAND!!11..

    It's so sad.

    I can imagine him at the mortgage broker;

    "I disagree with the terms of the mortgage I've been paying for 10 years, so I'll no long be bound by it - and by the way, I'm not moving out"
     
  19. tamzzy

    Sgarrista

    Joined: May 26, 2012

    Posts: 9,353

    You need to be culled, along with the rest of the weak and infirm, for not believing in the #brexitdream

    :)
     
  20. chroniclard

    Capodecina

    Joined: Apr 23, 2014

    Posts: 11,905

    Location: Hertfordshire

    The double standards of Brexiters is the point, regardless of how incorrect the actual statement is. Wanging on constantly about unelected bureaucrats in the EU.