British Airways - Massive IT Disruption Worldwide

dowie · 29 May 2017 at 17:24

not exactly the first time that outsourcing has caused some issues:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...used-by-inexperienced-operative-in-India.html

combine it with a culture of always wanting to save face and you might well have people not asking questions and doing stupid things in production they don't really understand:

A source, who worked for RBS for “several years”, told the Register an “inexperienced operative” had made an error while performing the relatively routine task of backing out of an upgrade.

He said: “When they did the back-out, a major error was made. An inexperienced person cleared the whole queue ... they erased all the scheduling.”

RBS have not yet commented on the claims.

The bank has already promised customers will be reimbursed for the cost of fines or late payment fees incurred as a result of the delays. Banking experts said that the cost to RBS of dealing with the IT problems, including extra staff costs as well as the money to reimburse customers, is already likely to be between £50 million and £100 million.

Mr Hester has also admitted that the bonuses of senior members of RBS staff are likely to be reduced because of the incident.

Note the last bit - at least there were some consequences for the senior IT monkeys.

StriderX · 29 May 2017 at 17:31

Imagine losing your company £50 million, lol.

Caged · 29 May 2017 at 17:56

It is a cultural thing for reasons likely too complicated for me to fully grasp. IT staff from India seem to want to say "yes" rather than giving a genuine assessment of the situation.

glenimp617 · 29 May 2017 at 17:59

I'd be asking for at least £1,500 per day, but if I was short of work it would be less

I'm pleased someone has mentioned the culture of saying yes. Those who have done overseas IT work knows how infuriating that can be! No matter what question you ask, the answer is always "yes".

Can you do the upgrade - Yes
Minimum to zero risk - Yes
Can you let all the users know - Yes
This weekend - Yes

Next week, major problems. You ask the engineer what went wrong, you get a complete and total blank expression.

Is the UPS good enough - Yes
Is the AirCon good enough - Yes

Walk into the server room, UPS maxed out and the room is like an Oven with all server fans going at 100%. One of the blade servers is dead due to overheating.

You ask the engineer why he said it was all ok, you get a complete and total blank expression.

Do you have good backups - Yes
Do you check them everyday - Yes

Check the backup server, tape drive hasn't worked since installation three years ago. Disk array is unable to communicate with any servers on the network.

You ask the engineer why he said it was all ok, you get a complete and total blank expression.

I'm wondering if Yes, actually means No

Mysterae_ · 29 May 2017 at 18:04

BA chief executive Alex Cruz says he will not resign and that flight disruption had nothing to do with cutting costs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40083778

glenimp617 · 29 May 2017 at 18:08

Mysterae_ said:
BA chief executive Alex Cruz says he will not resign and that flight disruption had nothing to do with cutting costs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40083778

That's actually interesting, as it's either

1. a lie
2. if not due to costs, then it must be a better level of service. I want to see how they came to that conclusion.

StriderX · 29 May 2017 at 18:09

Mysterae_ said:
BA chief executive Alex Cruz says he will not resign and that flight disruption had nothing to do with cutting costs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40083778

So it has everything to do with cutting costs then, going by current rhetoric.

Hades · 29 May 2017 at 18:17

A sure sign of someone about to resign is them saying they won't resign.

Caged · 29 May 2017 at 18:20

Or he's going to get pushed

glenimp617 · 29 May 2017 at 18:22

I hope he does get pushed, and I hope this along with the NHS virus fiasco is a wake up call

IT has changed so much over the last 15 years, yet IT departments and top level managers/directors have pretty much stayed the same

Haggisman · 29 May 2017 at 19:14

Mysterae_ said:
BA chief executive Alex Cruz says he will not resign and that flight disruption had nothing to do with cutting costs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40083778

Way to show your customers you have 0 respect for them and don't give a **** about the stress caused to them the last few days.

We finally got to our destination a couple of hours ago, but ~£150 and a day late, will certainly be claiming back the costs of room and replacement transport along with the €750 for the delay.

Front line staff have been great, but overall a very disappointing experience, would certainly have a lot more respect for the company if he'd just held his hands up and admitted they messed up!

stockhausen · 29 May 2017 at 19:42

neil_g said:
<SNIP>
I'm pleased someone has mentioned the culture of saying yes. Those who have done overseas IT work knows how infuriating that can be!
<SNIP>

A few years ago, I wrote a spec for an application to be developed by some "overseas" developers. When the completed work came back to be for testing I almost immediately found a glaring weakness in it. I called in the lead developer and asked how come he hadn't noticed it (he was actually a very bright guy). He replied that he had noticed it. When I asked why he had gone ahead with it rather than asking for clarification his response was that he wouldn't want to question my instructions!

neil_g · 29 May 2017 at 20:39

stockhausen said:
A few years ago, I wrote a spec for an application to be developed by some "overseas" developers. When the completed work came back to be for testing I almost immediately found a glaring weakness in it. I called in the lead developer and asked how come he hadn't noticed it (he was actually a very bright guy). He replied that he had noticed it. When I asked why he had gone ahead with it rather than asking for clarification his response was that he wouldn't want to question my instructions!

im not sure why your quote is quoting something i did not say. please amend.

L33 · 29 May 2017 at 21:16

glen8 said:
I'm pleased someone has mentioned the culture of saying yes. Those who have done overseas IT work knows how infuriating that can be! No matter what question you ask, the answer is always "yes".

My personal bugbear:
Me: Have you done XYZ yet
Them: Yes
Me: Ok great, have you tested as per (whatever)
Them: Yes, we will test when we have finished XYZ
Me: So you *haven't* done XYZ then?
Them: Yes, we will do that next.
Me: That doesn't make sense, have you done it or not. Yes or no.
Them: Yes, it is in progress
Me: In progress means it isn't complete. So no, you haven't done it then?
Them: .... silence

Hades · 29 May 2017 at 21:38

L33 said:
My personal bugbear:
Me: Have you done XYZ yet
Them: Yes
Me: Ok great, have you tested as per (whatever)
Them: Yes, we will test when we have finished XYZ
Me: So you *haven't* done XYZ then?
Them: Yes, we will do that next.
Me: That doesn't make sense, have you done it or not. Yes or no.
Them: Yes, it is in progress
Me: In progress means it isn't complete. So no, you haven't done it then?
Them: .... silence

I recognise this

Rifte · 29 May 2017 at 23:03

Hades said:
I recognise this

I live and have my business in India. The 'yes' culture is infuriating.

Once challenged the inevitable silence infuriates me even more.

No one wants to deliver the truth if something can't happen. People who have worked in the country for a decent amount of time recognise this and understand the real meaning behind a 'yes'.I haven't reached this level yet......

Caged · 29 May 2017 at 23:14

Don't ask questions that have a yes/no answer.

"Will we meet this deadline?" - bad
"When will you have this task completed by?" - good

glenimp617 · 29 May 2017 at 23:14

L33 said:
My personal bugbear:
Me: Have you done XYZ yet
Them: Yes
Me: Ok great, have you tested as per (whatever)
Them: Yes, we will test when we have finished XYZ
Me: So you *haven't* done XYZ then?
Them: Yes, we will do that next.
Me: That doesn't make sense, have you done it or not. Yes or no.
Them: Yes, it is in progress
Me: In progress means it isn't complete. So no, you haven't done it then?
Them: .... silence

Perfect! I've had this conversation many times

V F · 29 May 2017 at 23:19

Hades said:
A sure sign of someone about to resign is them saying they won't resign.

Or have complete faith.

h4rm0ny · 30 May 2017 at 06:44

L33 said:
My personal bugbear:
Me: Have you done XYZ yet
Them: Yes
Me: Ok great, have you tested as per (whatever)
Them: Yes, we will test when we have finished XYZ
Me: So you *haven't* done XYZ then?
Them: Yes, we will do that next.
Me: That doesn't make sense, have you done it or not. Yes or no.
Them: Yes, it is in progress
Me: In progress means it isn't complete. So no, you haven't done it then?
Them: .... silence

ARGH! I had one of these. I just don't understand it at all. Wasn't a foreign culture thing, either. Was an English guy who just kept saying he had done stuff when he hadn't or could do things when he couldn't. If I kept pressing him (which I did), then he'd eventually just go into meltdown and just stand there staring at me like a rabbit in the headlights.

British Airways - Massive IT Disruption Worldwide

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