CCNP Hardware

enigmo · 29 Jan 2013 at 09:46

I'm just in the process of finishing off a CCNA and will be starting the CCNP straight afterwards and am looking to set up a home lab, so to that end a couple of questions:
Considering a limited budget, what is the minimum I can get away with for a CCNP capable home lab? 2x routers, 2x switches, maybe an ASA I'm guessing?
Anyone know what's the cheapest routers and switches I can get that will use ios 15? Should I even be worrying about that?

GhostlyPea · 29 Jan 2013 at 10:53

For the CCNP you need routers and switches only. Ideally:

2 x L2 switches (like 2950s)
1 x L3 switch (like a 3550/3560)
3 - 4 routers (2600/1700/1800 series with enough Ethernet ports and modules)

IOS wise, the CCNP only focuses on commands that are basically the same between IOS 12.x and 15.x, so don't worry too much. You will not need an ASA, Access Points or anything else.

You can also use GNS3 providing you can get images (http://www.gns3.net/) however it does not properly support switches (you can trick it slightly with a 3600 series switching module, but it doesn't work very well). Seeing as how you'll ideally need to buy switches to do the CCNP properly and the routers themselves are cheap, you might as well get a small lab as above.

Any questions fire away

- GP

enigmo · 30 Jan 2013 at 14:17

So all in all, I'm looking at £100 each for the switches, and maybe £25 a piece for 2600s? Is there also much difference I need to be mindful of when it comes to differences in routers? e.g. 2600 vs 2600XM vs 2611?

Dist · 30 Jan 2013 at 16:49

I think Packet Tracer can do L3 Switching, it should be enough to cover the topic at least. Maybe look into using that along with GNS3/actual hardware.

d_brennen · 30 Jan 2013 at 16:51

Out of interest how are you studying OP? I am looking at a lot of CCNA material but I'm easily distracted

Do you have any hardware or are you just revising theory?

enigmo · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:09

d_brennen said:
Out of interest how are you studying OP? I am looking at a lot of CCNA material but I'm easily distracted Do you have any hardware or are you just revising theory?

I did a proper distance learning course through the Open University. 9 months part time, best part of a grand, but very much worth it. Similar to you, I find dedicating time to study difficult, and also like a lot of ppl have extensive home networking knowledge but limited corporate exposure. The OU course just gave me two things needed; a structured, timetabled pattern of learning, and a modular approach that covered everything needed for the CCNA plus a bit on top. There were four modules, four modular exams, five sets of coursework, and a final overall exam, then you do the CCNA exam separately, but if you get a distinction for the OU course you get 50% off the CCNA

A word of warning, though; module 1 covered the basics. Pretty much everything I already knew so it was easy. By the end of module 4, I had still not come across anything I found difficult per se, but the time demands were great, like 15-20hrs per week is what I was putting in. You could probably get away with less, but that's what I felt I needed. Finished that course late last year and now I'm working on doing the exam for Cisco to get my certification. Mainly going over my notes, cramming through the braindumps, getting advice from the networks guy at work, that sort of thing. I can't really afford the time or £££ to fail and retake, so am trying to get it right first time.

enigmo · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:12

Dist said:
I think Packet Tracer can do L3 Switching, it should be enough to cover the topic at least. Maybe look into using that along with GNS3/actual hardware.

I still have access to the Cisco academy site so can still get PacketTracer. That's what I'm playing with at the moment, just always had more of an affinity for actual hardware, and seeing as I don't intend on stopping with just the CCNA it seemed worthwhile to invest in something I could use to learn on for a few years at least.

GhostlyPea · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:13

Dist said:
I think Packet Tracer can do L3 Switching, it should be enough to cover the topic at least. Maybe look into using that along with GNS3/actual hardware.

Packet Tracer can simulate some layer 3 switching, however it doesn't cover all of the requirements that the CCNP has on a layer 3 switch so will only be half-useful

- GP

GhostlyPea · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:19

enigmo said:
I still have access to the Cisco academy site so can still get PacketTracer. That's what I'm playing with at the moment, just always had more of an affinity for actual hardware, and seeing as I don't intend on stopping with just the CCNA it seemed worthwhile to invest in something I could use to learn on for a few years at least.

There is more to networking than knowing the course supplied material. Somebody who has never used a router or a switch in the flesh, trouble shooting cabling issues, file system issues, image corruption, amending boot loader settings is not only missing out, but is also a bit of a liability.

I come across a lot of people who have CCNAs and some CCNPs (or similar other vendor certs), but they don't really understand what it is to do the job and use the tech properly. As such things are more of a pain to sort out with them than something I can do in 5 minutes through hands on experience (and actually understanding the theory and the why behind it as opposed to how to type a few commands in and not know what to do when something doesn't work first time).

Get Packet-tracer and GNS3, they are fantastic tools, however don't underestimate having the hardware and working with it. If you can afford it, but something even if it's cheapo ebay kit (most of mine was under 25 quid a piece).

- GP

enigmo · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:31

GhostlyPea said:
There is more to networking than knowing the course supplied material. Somebody who has never used a router or a switch in the flesh, trouble shooting cabling issues, file system issues, image corruption, amending boot loader settings is not only missing out, but is also a bit of a liability.

And that's exactly what I don't want to be

Hopefully over the next few months I'll get more exposure at work, at least that's what's in the offing, but I'd like to get some extra-curricular experience with the hardware so I don't end up doing something stupid hardware-wise and scupper my chances.

d_brennen · 30 Jan 2013 at 17:43

enigmo said:
I did a proper distance learning course through the Open University. 9 months part time, best part of a grand, but very much worth it. Similar to you, I find dedicating time to study difficult, and also like a lot of ppl have extensive home networking knowledge but limited corporate exposure. The OU course just gave me two things needed; a structured, timetabled pattern of learning, and a modular approach that covered everything needed for the CCNA plus a bit on top. There were four modules, four modular exams, five sets of coursework, and a final overall exam, then you do the CCNA exam separately, but if you get a distinction for the OU course you get 50% off the CCNA
A word of warning, though; module 1 covered the basics. Pretty much everything I already knew so it was easy. By the end of module 4, I had still not come across anything I found difficult per se, but the time demands were great, like 15-20hrs per week is what I was putting in. You could probably get away with less, but that's what I felt I needed. Finished that course late last year and now I'm working on doing the exam for Cisco to get my certification. Mainly going over my notes, cramming through the braindumps, getting advice from the networks guy at work, that sort of thing. I can't really afford the time or £££ to fail and retake, so am trying to get it right first time.

Thanks for the reply, very helpful

You rate the OU then?

Dist · 30 Jan 2013 at 18:02

GhostlyPea said:
There is more to networking than knowing the course supplied material. Somebody who has never used a router or a switch in the flesh, trouble shooting cabling issues, file system issues, image corruption, amending boot loader settings is not only missing out, but is also a bit of a liability.

I come across a lot of people who have CCNAs and some CCNPs (or similar other vendor certs), but they don't really understand what it is to do the job and use the tech properly. As such things are more of a pain to sort out with them than something I can do in 5 minutes through hands on experience (and actually understanding the theory and the why behind it as opposed to how to type a few commands in and not know what to do when something doesn't work first time).

- GP

Can I just say that it is very hard to actually get the sort of experience you talk about, I have an ICT degree, a CCNA, and 1 of the 3 exams for MCITP server admin 2008 (not a real interest of mine but I want to broaden my basic skill set) and even with that there are few entry level jobs available that will actually lead to proper experience with equipment, and those jobs have hundreds of applicants.

d_brennen said:
Thanks for the reply, very helpful You rate the OU then?

I did my ICT degree through the OU, with the CCNA course as one of the optional courses. It was a great experience, and the CCNA course even had a day school for each module so you do get some (although still quite short lived) hands on experience. Like other universities though their prices have gone up recently, and so I don't know if it's as compelling now as it was when I was with them, but as for quality of the learning it was fantastic.

GhostlyPea · 30 Jan 2013 at 20:11

Dist said:
Can I just say that it is very hard to actually get the sort of experience you talk about, I have an ICT degree, a CCNA, and 1 of the 3 exams for MCITP server admin 2008 (not a real interest of mine but I want to broaden my basic skill set) and even with that there are few entry level jobs available that will actually lead to proper experience with equipment, and those jobs have hundreds of applicants.

I couldn't agree more, believe me. A lot of people in It lose sight of the fact it can be hard to specialise.

I worked on helpdesk for about 2 years, then as my only foot in the door, "moonlighted" in my own company for our comms department. It was very very tough, but that's what you do when you want to move on to something you enjoy. Realistically though a degree is no help going into this sort of work, neither is the MCITP (Most server engineers are useless at anything that comes under networking

) - it's all about industry related certs and experience. As a start a CCNA and general experience from a helpdesk is your best bet (even better if you can do low tier stuff for an SP). Having some hands on experience from ebay old equipment however, will mean if you ever do a practical test for an interview, and they provide you with something basic to do such as a password reset, you know how to do it rather than have no clue as it's all been on a sim. Seeing as you can pick up 2600 routers for the price of a takeaway these days, there's no excuse. For the record, I started learning on 3 2500 series routers and 2 2900 Xl switches. If you have any idea what they are, they are essentially archaic (token ring and AUI interfaces anybody?!)

It's tough to get into, but it's all about persiverence

- GP

enigmo · 31 Jan 2013 at 09:15

d_brennen said:
Thanks for the reply, very helpful You rate the OU then?

I do. It costs, and Dist is right; their prices have gone up recently. But if you absolutely have to make sure you haven't missed anything, and in the absence of a friendly network engineer would like a tutor on hand to help, a formal course is a very good option, and of them all the OU course is one of the best. The practical component was the only let-down, limited as it was to a few hours in a day school four times during the course, but I don't see how any other distance learning course would do much better.

ChrisD. · 31 Jan 2013 at 09:54

Not sure if it's been mentioned but keep an eye on eBay, Gumtree and even freecycle (I've picked up many L2 and L3 switches along with some routers for free) as people often sell 'CCNP' packs of hardware.

enigmo · 31 Jan 2013 at 11:01

MilanoChris said:
Not sure if it's been mentioned but keep an eye on eBay, Gumtree and even freecycle (I've picked up many L2 and L3 switches along with some routers for free) as people often sell 'CCNP' packs of hardware.

Worth considering these packs, or would it be better to just get what you can as cheap as you can, reflecting a real business environment in many ways?

ChrisD. · 31 Jan 2013 at 11:03

Depends on the packs, they are people like you and I who are finished with them so pass them on. Just look at the hardware and see if it'd suit your own needs.

Awahwah · 31 Jan 2013 at 14:48

GhostlyPea said:
(token ring and AUI interfaces anybody?!)

Token Ring, I remember those days. Not in the Environment I'm in now but on smaller Notworks (Networks

)

Still have working ATM circuits too.