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Chip & Pin not so secure...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by The_TailGunner, 9 May 2006.

  1. The_TailGunner

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 17 Oct 2003

    Posts: 1,894

    Location: Dublin

    considering the banks supposedly tested and approved all the various makes/models, there really is no excuse...

    the company i work for supplies some shell sites with a c&p solution, and our official line is:

     
  2. tedaC

    Hitman

    Joined: 26 Apr 2006

    Posts: 673

    Chip and pin is like any other piece of security technology - someone will always find a way around it unfortunately
     
  3. SidewinderINC

    Soldato

    Joined: 8 Feb 2004

    Posts: 5,211

    Location: Dartford, Kent

    so its all inside jobs from that statement, makes sense!
     
  4. kaiowas

    Capodecina

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 10,401

    Location: Castle Anthrax

    I've been wary of something like this happening since I first went to a restaurant that used wireless chip & pin devices.

    At the end of the day you're keying your pin number into a random box of electronics that has already read your card and could be doing anything with that information.
     
  5. D4VE

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 23 Oct 2003

    Posts: 8,899

    Location: Hampshire, UK

    This happened at a Shell garage near me :(

    Recently I had to sign for something when I paid by Switch, is this legal?
     
  6. PinkPig

    Mobster

    Joined: 7 Jun 2004

    Posts: 3,534

    Whatever technology we use, there's always the possibility of someone on the inside switching equipment. In addition, it's nothing to do with the fact that you enter a PIN rather than signing.
     
  7. The_TailGunner

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 17 Oct 2003

    Posts: 1,894

    Location: Dublin

    signing is still perfectly legal. c&p was NEVER a legal requirement, but the banks forced it on retailers by saying that any fraudulent transaction on non c&p cards would be charged to site...
     
  8. SidewinderINC

    Soldato

    Joined: 8 Feb 2004

    Posts: 5,211

    Location: Dartford, Kent

    @PinkPig - true, but the addition of pin entering means that the person recording all the information can so easily just clone the card and then withdraw money...

    which is so much easier than card fraud via buying stuff when you have just the card and signature.
     
  9. Von Luck

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 24 Nov 2005

    Posts: 2,455

    ..
     
    Last edited: 11 May 2006
  10. stoofa

    Capodecina

    Joined: 4 Mar 2003

    Posts: 12,229

    Location: Chatteris

    It is still infinitely more secure than the old system.
    If we hadn't rolled out Chip & Pin guess what - the cards could still have been skimmed.

    Your title gives the impression that because of Chip & Pin more money has been lost.
    This is misleading - the cards could have been skimmed whatever technology was being used.
    Oh and you can hardly blame the whole Chip & Pin system when it's an inside job.

    The items in my safety deposit box are rather safe.
    If however a bank employee doesn't set any alarms one night and tells the thieves all of the combinations to any/all safes they need to get into my deposit box.
    Does this make safety deposit less secure suddenly?
     
  11. D4VE

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 23 Oct 2003

    Posts: 8,899

    Location: Hampshire, UK

    Ah I see, thanks for the info :)

    I know 4 people who had their cards cloned recently!
     
  12. The_TailGunner

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 17 Oct 2003

    Posts: 1,894

    Location: Dublin

    its no harder to fit a skimmer to a c&p terminal than it is to fit one to an ATM (apart from it being next to the cashier). i dont think the terminal would need to be removed from site...more the cashier distracted long enough to allow the skimmer to be slotted in...

    ...could be wrong though...
     
  13. lemonkettaz

    Capodecina

    Joined: 28 Nov 2005

    Posts: 12,630

    ive never used chip and pin.. ever since watching the trevor mcdonald program about it.

    but ive never used it anyways.

    i dont see any problem with getting the cash and paying by cash.
     
  14. SidewinderINC

    Soldato

    Joined: 8 Feb 2004

    Posts: 5,211

    Location: Dartford, Kent


    but before chip and pin, did the cloners have your pin number so easily?

    my guess would be a definate no, but now they can very easily record it when you tap it in if they have a modified box.
     
  15. PinkPig

    Mobster

    Joined: 7 Jun 2004

    Posts: 3,534

    Statistically I'm fairly sure that the chances of you being a victim of crime are far greater if you carry wads of cash around than if you pay using a chip and PIN card!
     
  16. PinkPig

    Mobster

    Joined: 7 Jun 2004

    Posts: 3,534

    But, before chip and PIN, when it came to buying expensive things and even getting cashback in a shop, it didn't matter in the slightest whether they had your PIN number or not!
     
  17. lemonkettaz

    Capodecina

    Joined: 28 Nov 2005

    Posts: 12,630

    its not like i carry £1000 in my wallet though.

    maybe £20.. or £50
     
  18. SidewinderINC

    Soldato

    Joined: 8 Feb 2004

    Posts: 5,211

    Location: Dartford, Kent

    true, but my point is its much much easier to get money straight out of a cashpoint. and far more discreet too!
    the simplicity and discreetness of it has more than likely prompted quite a lot of people to start doing it.

    i for one would never do it, but i sure as hell would rather just swipe some money from a cash point than risk going into a shop and buying something!
     
  19. MrMoon

    PermaBanned

    Joined: 22 Dec 2002

    Posts: 1,596

    yeah dont use Shell at aldershot road in guildford, loads of people I know got money taken etc. from there
     
  20. Visage

    PermaBanned

    Joined: 13 Jan 2005

    Posts: 10,708


    As opposed to signature based cards, with your signature carefully hidden away on the back of the card? ;)