Dishwasher real world costs

Soldato
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Have you been living in a cave for the past 15 years?

EU has pushed energy saving legislation on us year upon year. If your dishwasher is using loads of electricity then it's probably because it's 15+ years old and should have broken by now.

Every year every electrical appliance within the home is pushed to be more efficient.

Central heating pumps from 20 years ago that used 100W today now use less than 15W. light bulbs from 20 years ago that used 100W now use 5W. TV's from 20 years ago that used 2000W now use 50W.

the only things that still consume loads of electricity are heating devices and hot water devices. however cleaning devices have had technology improvements in other areas which means they now don't need to use has much hot water or heat it up as much.

You wot. Next you'll be telling me that my 6kW hoover is excessive. #brexit4eva
 
Caporegime
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Wire a plug, I mean how many do you actually need to do now. I can think of 1 I have done in 10 years
Bleed radiator, most you can do with a screwdriver now

Turning off the house stop **** however is far trickier, always simple in theory, ******* difficult in practice, almost always seized to hell.

Its funny because people love to mock millenials, they are probably the self same people that have to be protected from difficult things like not clicking the handy link from their bank in the email that says they need to reset their password and confidential information, or someone has to break the bad news to them that the £10k they transferred to help release their £100M from Nigeria has gone missing ;)

Exactly. Old people have to try and make themselves feel better when they fail with modern technology by proclaiming that the “old ways” are the best and that young people can’t do them as well. Well no, most millenials have never needed to wire a plug, but then why would they, they’re all moulded on.:p

I bet today’s old people don’t even know how to weave their own cloth. Sad times :( (said person around 1900 about the then current young generation).
 
Soldato
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Varies but chopping boards, knives, peelers, blender/processor, tins & packets, worktops... Sure they don't take long but why not do them while I'm not doing anything else
you could be washing the tins in a dishwasher.

Yup... and there are people who make a living from fixing the mistakes made by those clueless millenials who merely looked things up without having the background skills and knowledge that used to be part of basic school lessons. :D
Undertakers ?, but I suppose the RCD devices protect them.
 

SPG

SPG

Soldato
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Dish washer, run every 2 days on max power.

ECO settings are a complete waster of time they save about 2p a wash in terms of energy and water.

Marketing wins out over actual practically again. educate yourselves folks, its also better for the dishwasher to run it on max settings as it keeps everything clear.
 
Associate
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Exactly. Old people have to try and make themselves feel better when they fail with modern technology by proclaiming that the “old ways” are the best and that young people can’t do them as well. Well no, most millenials have never needed to wire a plug, but then why would they, they’re all moulded on.:p

Did you just assume my plug wiring needs?! I like the old ways, where things were made to last. I have some of my grandfathers stuff like heaters etc which are 60+ years old and needed a filament rewind once in that whole time.

I recently bought a house with a 16 year old dish washer in it. Seems to have had better days (doesn't change programs from default) although it did run fine on 30 min quick wash (empty). Having never lived with one before i'm trying to get everyone to agree to use it xD And then maybe replace it with a more modern one. Is there a consensus on whether non fitted is any better than fitted (ignoring cosmetic aspects)?
 
Soldato
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ECO settings are a complete waster of time they save about 2p a wash in terms of energy and water.

Marketing wins out over actual practically again. educate yourselves folks, its also better for the dishwasher to run it on max settings as it keeps everything clear.

700-800W less energy and half as much water used per cycle and everything comes out clean. I'll continue using the Eco mode.
 
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Did you just assume my plug wiring needs?! I like the old ways, where things were made to last. I have some of my grandfathers stuff like heaters etc which are 60+ years old and needed a filament rewind once in that whole time.

I recently bought a house with a 16 year old dish washer in it. Seems to have had better days (doesn't change programs from default) although it did run fine on 30 min quick wash (empty). Having never lived with one before i'm trying to get everyone to agree to use it xD And then maybe replace it with a more modern one. Is there a consensus on whether non fitted is any better than fitted (ignoring cosmetic aspects)?

Thats not relevant to wiring a plug though, thats just general cost is everything throw away society

Funny but the reason we moved to pre wired plugs what that people were in fact not as good at wiring them as they thought so they were often poorly fitted (and quite normally with the wrongly rated fuse as well)
So they moved to legislate for pre fitted plugs.
Its funny you dont hear people going "those millenials dont know how to wire a plug badly like we used to in the old days" ;)
 
Soldato
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You mean you just don't buy a new 75" OLED TV when the fuse in the plug blows?
Don't be silly - That's a waste of money. You RMA it!!

You got yourself a unicorn there son.
Huh?
What good is a unicorn, anyway? Will it keep me warm?

Old people have to try and make themselves feel better when they fail with modern technology by proclaiming that the “old ways” are the best and that young people can’t do them as well.
Modern technology is mostly disposable and wasteful junk, made cheap and costing rip-off money.
So what if a few clueless idiots kill themselves because they can't learn how to wire a plug? The world is over populated already...

I bet today’s old people don’t even know how to weave their own cloth. Sad times :( (said person around 1900 about the then current young generation).
I bet you we do.....

Undertakers ?, but I suppose the RCD devices protect them.
I was thinking mechanics, but various tradespersons also apply.
 
Associate
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Thats not relevant to wiring a plug though, thats just general cost is everything throw away society

Funny but the reason we moved to pre wired plugs what that people were in fact not as good at wiring them as they thought so they were often poorly fitted (and quite normally with the wrongly rated fuse as well)
So they moved to legislate for pre fitted plugs.
Its funny you dont hear people going "those millenials dont know how to wire a plug badly like we used to in the old days" ;)

Wiring a plug isn't relevant to this thread but that's how conversations work. People say things and other people follow up about said things.
But in any case it is related. In a consumerist throw away society there is no need to know how anything works and thus develop the analytical skills to diagnose issues and fix them. It's easier to throw it away and buy another one. Even just a small amount of these types of skills are transferable into many aspects of life. I think this is a large contributing factor in why "millennials" can't seemingly do "simple" things in this regard. You don't learn these skills doing office based pencil pusher jobs.
 
Soldato
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In a consumerist throw away society there is no need to know how anything works and thus develop the analytical skills to diagnose issues and fix them. It's easier to throw it away and buy another one.
But not necessarily cheaper.
Case in point - The wife wanted to go buy a new lawn mower and hedge trimmer, for several hundred quid. I insisted on buying a pair of plugs for a fiver (including the diesel to go get them) and fitted them to the perfectly good kit my neighbour was getting rid of.

Even just a small amount of these types of skills are transferable into many aspects of life. I think this is a large contributing factor in why "millennials" can't seemingly do "simple" things in this regard. You don't learn these skills doing office based pencil pusher jobs.
Exactly.
 
Joined
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Wiring a plug isn't relevant to this thread but that's how conversations work. People say things and other people follow up about said things.
But in any case it is related. In a consumerist throw away society there is no need to know how anything works and thus develop the analytical skills to diagnose issues and fix them. It's easier to throw it away and buy another one. Even just a small amount of these types of skills are transferable into many aspects of life. I think this is a large contributing factor in why "millennials" can't seemingly do "simple" things in this regard. You don't learn these skills doing office based pencil pusher jobs.

Interesting, your assuming the throw away came first and the repairs dropping as a result
I would say based on my mates comments who used to repair a lot of consumer electrical items its the opposite, because things have become difficult to repair the assumption is its not worth it as there is a high chance of expenditure for no benefit.

The micro components are nigh on impossible for most people to fix, where as 20-30 years ago most parts would be fixable for anyone even remotely able to use a soldering iron etc

I have a dent in the back of my ipad air, I thought fine i will just get a broken one and swap the back for mine, I then looked at a tear down of one to see what was involved. It was horrendous, loads of opportunities to basically cause total failure, or opportunities to end up with a newly introduced error far more significant than a dented case.

Cars are the same, years ago, bar a complete seizure you could probably get a car going and limp to a garage or something. Now there are multiple sensors that will shut down the ECU. You ain't getting that started no matter what you do, unless you carry a full ECU reader and a boot load of spares around.
 
Associate
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Interesting, your assuming the throw away came first and the repairs dropping as a result
I would say based on my mates comments who used to repair a lot of consumer electrical items its the opposite, because things have become difficult to repair the assumption is its not worth it as there is a high chance of expenditure for no benefit.

The micro components are nigh on impossible for most people to fix, where as 20-30 years ago most parts would be fixable for anyone even remotely able to use a soldering iron etc

I have a dent in the back of my ipad air, I thought fine i will just get a broken one and swap the back for mine, I then looked at a tear down of one to see what was involved. It was horrendous, loads of opportunities to basically cause total failure, or opportunities to end up with a newly introduced error far more significant than a dented case.

Cars are the same, years ago, bar a complete seizure you could probably get a car going and limp to a garage or something. Now there are multiple sensors that will shut down the ECU. You ain't getting that started no matter what you do, unless you carry a full ECU reader and a boot load of spares around.

I'm just saying its a general method of thinking that has developed which suppresses useful, transferable skill development. Many things are as you say not worth investing the time in but that shouldn't stop you from being able to identify what is worth time and having a go (I recently got a free laptop just because i could disassemble it and unsolder/resolder a new DC jack to the motherboard). Combined with many other external factors my opinion is it all generally suppresses this useful development and encourages the conditioning of most young people to do one thing and one thing only.
 
Soldato
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12,300
The micro components are nigh on impossible for most people to fix, where as 20-30 years ago most parts would be fixable for anyone even remotely able to use a soldering iron etc
And yet many things still have to bear a sticker saying there are no user-servicable parts inside, for all those old folk that still would look to fix it... and as is, I often find components that I can still nick and use in something else.
 
Soldato
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21,783
(if it is not sedition) from here re eco
It is less water and less heat over a longer period. When my Neff dishwasher broke the first thing the engineer asked me if I always used the eco setting as it is common for breaking whatever element heats the dishwasher with so little water in hard water areas like London.
can well believe reliability is reduced. ?
 
Caporegime
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Modern technology is mostly disposable and wasteful junk, made cheap and costing rip-off money.
So what if a few clueless idiots kill themselves because they can't learn how to wire a plug? The world is over populated already...


Exactly. British plugs are like tanks. They rarely ever break, unlike the delicate electronics in most modern tech, where it costs more to buy that single part and replace it than just buy a replacement device.:(

I think I’ve only ever broken one plug in my life. And yes, I did put a new one in.

I bet you we do.....

Got your own loom in the shed then? :p
 
Caporegime
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I'm just saying its a general method of thinking that has developed which suppresses useful, transferable skill development. Many things are as you say not worth investing the time in but that shouldn't stop you from being able to identify what is worth time and having a go (I recently got a free laptop just because i could disassemble it and unsolder/resolder a new DC jack to the motherboard). Combined with many other external factors my opinion is it all generally suppresses this useful development and encourages the conditioning of most young people to do one thing and one thing only.

The general method or thinking is still there, it’s just used in different ways. People’s peiorities change as society changes. Why waste your time on something that’s going to save you £20 when it’s going to take you a few hours and faf of your time (which is worth £20 an hour). It made sense when that device was a weeks wages, but not when you could earn more in the time it took to repair it.

Honestly I hope when I get old I don’t turn into one of those “younguns these days” people. I probably will, because that’s how the “system” works and has done for millennia. Maybe one day we’ll all learn that people have different strengths.

This coming from a millennial that does try and repair his stuff. I’ve repaired phone, cars and other devices, but the more I earn the less bothered about it I am, because it just becomes not worth it time/benefit wise.
 
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