How much is a unit on its own though? I think a lot of the total (I.e., installation) cost comes from the fact a lot of houses need larger radiators, re-piping, if the house is in any way modern it probably has a combi setup so will need a complete re-plumb to add (back) in a hot water tank...
Energy Prices (Strictly NO referrals!)
- Thread starter DXP55
- Start date
Soldato
I cant afford the outlay.
You may have seen my previous car engine failed - there is £3k down the drain plus £4k on a new (used) one. Straight on a credit card as after buying my new house I don't have any cash left.
Energy bills biting. Food, fuel biting.
Where's the money coming from?
(that isn't a specific question about my personal circumstances, it will be the same for lots of people).
Soldato
Probably considered too 'out there' for this thread but it makes me question our entire way of life. Why are we here in this cold wet country when there are nice warm countries we could have populated all those thousands of years ago. Why do we still persist on investing in our infrastructure here instead of facilitating a long term transfer of ourselves to a new place? Like Hunger Games, England should be a farming resource to supply food to where we actually live (somewhere warm to minimise energy use).
Soldato
Borrow the money then
Although it does depend on usage, right now its still only really beneficial for medium to high users, due to the quite high fixed element of install.
Hopefully some of the techs like coatings you can put on windows will make it to actual end product. That way even small lower usage houses would like be able to install some generation.
Soldato
- Joined
- 23 May 2006
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- 7,312
indeed prices have gone insane at the moment. I am the 1st to wax lyrical about solar and battery, I am completely sold on it BUT going into debt right now to do it may not be the best idea. prices will surely drop again in future and surely sooner rather than later (it annoys me that all new cars right now cant do this given CHAdeMO could support it ages ago) all electric cars will support proper vehicle to home possibly making an actual home battery some what of an extravagance.
(many cars support running components from it but really it needs to be done through the charger not running a 3pin plug extension cable from the car through your letterbox!)
(many cars support running components from it but really it needs to be done through the charger not running a 3pin plug extension cable from the car through your letterbox!)
Associate
Size. Most fridges are 80-100 W. An ASHP is like >25x that. That size increase doesn't come for free. Not to meantion theres quite a bit more to a ASHP central heating system than just the compressor/evap system alone which adds further cost.
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Soldato
I semi agree on pricing but there are two factors, materials pricing and installation/profit for installer
I don't see the pricing side dropping any time soon, demand is going up a lot gloabally
There are still sensible prices to be had just need to shop around.
My install should save me 15-20% of install costs in first year, by delaying a year I am looking to see prices drop by more than that else I am worse off.
I don't see the pricing side dropping any time soon, demand is going up a lot gloabally
There are still sensible prices to be had just need to shop around.
My install should save me 15-20% of install costs in first year, by delaying a year I am looking to see prices drop by more than that else I am worse off.
Soldato
I bit the bullet and turned up the 2 storage heaters in our all electric house in readiness for the cold snap, they run off an economy 7 circuit. The hallway heater is at 40% and the living room at 50%.
£6 electricity used overnight, so very unlikely that we'll stay within the £10 per day we've been achieving in the autumn.
It's 18.8c in here though, so I'll drop it slightly tonight to try and achieve 18c.
The family are starting to call me a smart meter nazi and are considering getting me an arm band made, but it's wasting electricity that I'm concerned with, not using what we need.
£6 electricity used overnight, so very unlikely that we'll stay within the £10 per day we've been achieving in the autumn.
It's 18.8c in here though, so I'll drop it slightly tonight to try and achieve 18c.
The family are starting to call me a smart meter nazi and are considering getting me an arm band made, but it's wasting electricity that I'm concerned with, not using what we need.
Very hard to find quotes locally. As said in the solar thread, companies are charging for quotes
Soldato
Actually it does seem to be a thing that could happen, at least with Morocco and the UK: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xlinks_Morocco-UK_Power_Project
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Soldato
Very hard to find quotes locally. As said in the solar thread, companies are charging for quotes
To be honest I know loads of people getting quotes and no one is paying for them.
Maybe its an area thing but round here its just workload thats the issue, many will simply not reply to enquiries.
china(Uighurs?) are a big source of PV panels so with the economic/political climate I don't see prices dropping
playing the long game - global warming considered , or, maybe ancestors exhibited higher levels of evolutionary IQ due to challenges UK climate presents
Soldato
I don't have a money printer like the Government does...Borrow the money then
No, look, I cant afford to add to monthly budget with a loan repayment, especially with everything else going up. Like I said, the money isn't there, borrowed or not.
I could have afforded it before I bought a house, but my old house was rented...
Fixed amount of my money, too much demand for it.
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Soldato
- Joined
- 25 Nov 2005
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- 12,502
Soldato
But surely the point is to save you costs. If you can save £100 a month at a cost of £75 wouldn't that make sense?
Soldato
It would, but if the capital isn't there, and borrowing can't be budgeted for, what can you do?
This is why richer people can benefit more from opportunities than people with no cash - money makes money.
Edit - ah were you assuming an immediate saving of £100 on monthly energy bills thus offsetting the loan repayment? IN which case fair enough, I didn't clock this.
Im not sure the savings would be that high, my usage is mostly gas for heating so would have to weigh up the options. I don't know if solar could do it on its own.
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Soldato
But for the most part you aren't saving £100 a month to pay out £75 a month, not even close. You are only breaking even on installs after 12yrs+ and that is without a loan and interest rates. You are assuming either very low/0% interest but most people on perosnal loans will be averaging a further 10-15% interest rate to borrow such monies so now you are waiting to break even for possibly 20yrs+ then. That is then assuming you even get approved for such large borrowing which a lot of people on lower income wont even be able to borrow.
I opened all the windows in the three unused rooms (master bedroom, bathroom and her office (unused today) upstairs at lunch time. Doors shut, everything good. I just opened my office door to go get a coffee and all three doors were wide open whilst the windows still open. Heating going like the clappers.
WOMEN ARGH!!!!
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Soldato
An online solar calculator says I could generate circa 3500 kWh per year for an install cost of £6k. £6k is £115 per month repayment over five years.
I use about 2000 kWh of electricity per year, at 33p that is £55 per month. So even if all my usage was offset, it wouldn't cover the loan repayment.
That doesn't include batteries. Adding batteries would add much more to the install cost, and without an EV you can't get on the only beneficial tariff that I would need to get good nighttime top up rates (Octopus Go).
Adding batteries is no good unless I reconfigure the house to use electric heating/electric hot water, without doing that I can't offset any gas use. So there is more cost there.
Seems the only way to offset a good proportion of gas use is to use a heat pump. Install for one of those systems is £10-15k, possibly with a £5k grant. I don't know how much gas use it would offset, and whether it would work well enough in an older solid walled house with poor insulating properties. But lets say it offsets half my gas use, so 5,000 kWh a year. That is £500 at 10p per unit or about £50 per month. A £10k loan over 5 years is £200 per month.
I use about 2000 kWh of electricity per year, at 33p that is £55 per month. So even if all my usage was offset, it wouldn't cover the loan repayment.
That doesn't include batteries. Adding batteries would add much more to the install cost, and without an EV you can't get on the only beneficial tariff that I would need to get good nighttime top up rates (Octopus Go).
Adding batteries is no good unless I reconfigure the house to use electric heating/electric hot water, without doing that I can't offset any gas use. So there is more cost there.
Seems the only way to offset a good proportion of gas use is to use a heat pump. Install for one of those systems is £10-15k, possibly with a £5k grant. I don't know how much gas use it would offset, and whether it would work well enough in an older solid walled house with poor insulating properties. But lets say it offsets half my gas use, so 5,000 kWh a year. That is £500 at 10p per unit or about £50 per month. A £10k loan over 5 years is £200 per month.