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Engine re-mapping - Thoughts?

Discussion in 'Motors' started by Xein, 19 Apr 2021.

  1. Simon0001

    Gangster

    Joined: 26 Jun 2020

    Posts: 209

    Never had it done. Just can't believe people saying it was declared to insurance. When they ask me if it's modified I just say it's second and I haven't got a clue.
     
  2. jpaul

    Capodecina

    Joined: 1 Mar 2010

    Posts: 15,538

    but, isn't there the old addage - ignorance is no excuse ....
    & aren't insurance companies clued up now

    never had it done either , but on a 2nd hand car I'd be more inclined to rejuvinate/improve handling - replacing shocks, more expensive rubber... probably more expensive though.
     
  3. Simon0001

    Gangster

    Joined: 26 Jun 2020

    Posts: 209

    Yes on a 2nd hand car suspension refreshing is the best thing after a general service and tyres
     
  4. pugheaven

    Mobster

    Joined: 22 Apr 2008

    Posts: 3,599

    Location: Bryn Celyn Wales

    My insurnace know every single mod, as for me, is it worth them finding something and then invalidating my insurance, I lose my car and then I have to pay the person I hit, hospital bills blah blah blah? Declare everything or just dont' go insured.

    When my wifes Civic Type R was written off by the garage who were sorting her exhaust, when the inspector came around he noted 3 modifications. However I'd declared them and his words were "good man, because if you hadn't you'd have just lost £6k"... so, take ya chances is what I say if you want to... but that's not for me.
     
  5. theone8181

    Soldato

    Joined: 27 Mar 2013

    Posts: 6,326

    The problem is if you don't know it has a mod, and its a map it would be very hard to know if it had been done, if the only car you drive had 150hp instead of 100hp, would you know? If you've got nothing to compare it against I'm not sure you would, although I assume a map would be timestamps when it was done but still, must be tricky. Suspension must be even more difficult to trace.
     
  6. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: 22 Nov 2006

    Posts: 21,817

    Yep it's a big grey area with used cars. Not everyone is a petrolhead and going to know if something is modded. Even when they are it can be hard to spot sometimes. An insurer can't blame it all on ignorant average Joe.
     
    Last edited: 22 Apr 2021
  7. pugheaven

    Mobster

    Joined: 22 Apr 2008

    Posts: 3,599

    Location: Bryn Celyn Wales

    Agreed BUT come on... Insurance companies aren't stupid nowadays the way lots get remaps etc... alot will now be checking and it's easy to know with a remap if you have the right software but yeah like I say personaly, I'm not will to take the chance and using the "Hello sir is your car modified?", "err not that I know of"... mmmm will that wash nowadays with a £20k payout?
     
  8. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: 22 Nov 2006

    Posts: 21,817

    Unless they can prove you did it, how can it not.

    It's a bit of a dumb question to ask for used car insurance tbh. How would you answer with a kit car. "Is it modified" errr, no it came with a nos kit.

    If the car has been serviced or repaired by an indi garage the chances are some parts aren't OEM. Is that a mod?
     
    Last edited: 22 Apr 2021
  9. pugheaven

    Mobster

    Joined: 22 Apr 2008

    Posts: 3,599

    Location: Bryn Celyn Wales

    Like I've said, everyone to their own. Insurance companies are NOT stupid anymore and if they can get out of paying YOU vast quantities of insurance money they will (just like I would if I owned an insurance company). If they ask you if you're modifed and you say no and it's been remapped, and then they check post accident you will get ZERO payout. You lied, it's simple as that. They don't have to prove anything other than the car you said wasn't modified is and they are now in their right to not pay you a penny. I don't give a monkies about this conversation really. I'm covered lol and got guaranteed insurance values. if people want to lie, get on with it. A kit car is a kit car and you'd STILL have to tell whoever your insurance is what it is, engine, body blah blah and it'll be a specialist insurance company probably anyway.

    The discussion isn't about putting aftermarket brake pads and different make to factory tyres, this is about going from original spec to a completely different spec... bigger wheels, uprated suspension, re-maps so lets so lets not be silly on what defines modified (WE ALL KNOW WHAT IS MODIFIED AND IF YOU [email protected] GO AWAY), this is about remapping a car. Remapping makes a car faster, suspension will amend from factory settings, these are serious mods that they need to know about. They might not even be bothered and it makes ZERO difference... I've had my SRT8 remapped, uprated engine bay and CAI and they increased my insurance by £26 for the year... perfectly acceptible.

    Everyone is always trying to get away with things nowadays, cutting corners, trying to lie and get ahead and advantage by being awkward and blantently lying and these people deserve everything they get, never telling the truth nowadays does my head in... all about me me me and how I can scam someone. Then those people will be the first people to whine and moan when they don't get a payout. Who cares if a 70 year old sold you a car with a remap, has nothing to do with what you're telling the insurance, your car, your responsbility. Know your car, and if you don't tough. Anyway, can't be bothered saying anything on this anymore as it's a mute point. Everyone can lie all they want and we can just wait for the threads "my insurance won't pay out because my cars remaped and I lied..."... it'll make a change of crappy threads like "if the car doesn't do 0-60 in 0.5s it's crap" rubbish lol

    BTW, not having a go at you, just sick of liars everywhere trying to get something for free so all I'm saying is, if people don't tell the truth, just be ready to be raped by your insurance company, it's really simple. If some ***** hit me, and he was modified BUT ended up not being insured because he'd not declared his mods and i'm left out of pocket because of a liar, I'd take his head of lol. this is about EVERYONE not just the person who's on the con!
     
  10. theone8181

    Soldato

    Joined: 27 Mar 2013

    Posts: 6,326

    I see what you're saying, but my point remains, there will be things a used car will have that you can't easily tell as a second owner. I'm sure some insurance companies would try to wriggle out of a payment if the tyres were a different make to when the car was new:cry:. Your remap is a perfect example of something that you might not know about (obviously you do as you had it done, but it's not like it has a big flashing neon sign telling you). With your last point, I'm sure there's some sort of slush fund that all insurance companies pay into for that reason, think they only cover everybody else's damage, not the person who was uninsured.
     
  11. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: 22 Nov 2006

    Posts: 21,817

    They wont just not pay put if the mods are road legal. You'll have to pay the difference for the higher premium. I know people who have been through it.

    How many people actually list optional extras in a car? Some insurers technically want that as well. I dont know anyone who has (ever).
     
  12. theone8181

    Soldato

    Joined: 27 Mar 2013

    Posts: 6,326

    Again it's a slippery slope, if you've got say a 3 series, it might not come with a certain level of nav, but some had it fitted. It's hard to track these things down. I know somethings can be pulled from the vin (I think that's how porsche did it, with a nice big sticker under the bonnet listing all the options). I pick a 3 series, as I know my m3 comes with stuff standard that a normal 3 series would have as ab extra, but tracking it down must be hard. Also not sure if having the storage extra should affect premiums:cry:.
     
  13. Mucky_Pup

    Mobster

    Joined: 21 Jul 2008

    Posts: 4,859

    Location: Earth

    They can not pay out (to you) if they wouldn't have insured your car with the modifications had they been told prior, not all insurance companies or underwriters will insure cars with any modifications or specific modifications. If someone has been caught and the worst they've got away with is being allowed to just pay the difference in the premium, they're very lucky and could have easily had their policy cancelled instead, and possibly been on the hook for any 3rd party costs if it was an accident involving other people.

    On the subject of remapping, I would do it, my car with the remap and other supporting mods is around 120bhp more than the standard car, total difference, even if I wasn't planning on doing anything else a remap by itself is a good starting point.
     
  14. 3t3P

    Mobster

    Joined: 20 Dec 2006

    Posts: 3,749

    R8 V10 gen 1 NA maps from 520 to 6-620hp if you want.

    A rare exception I think though.

    Tuning boxes don't qualify as a remap IMO
     
  15. Coowhan

    Gangster

    Joined: 29 Jan 2017

    Posts: 186

    Location: Scotland

    Depends on the car imo if it's worth it or not. Some cars get huge gains from a remap and others barely anything. If it was something like 20 hp or torque of a difference, I wouldn't bother myself as don't really see it being worth the money. Although if there's a hefty torque jump on a diesel and quite low hp gain for example it might be worth. The torque is really what you feel when you put the foot down.

    Generally with performance orientated cars (or anything with a turbo these days really) it's worth it as there's usually substantial gains. My car is running over 100bhp and torque more than standard with just a downpipe bolted on and a map for example. Obviously made a huge difference that was instantly noticeable. Felt like a whole other car.
     
    Last edited: 26 Apr 2021
  16. Rich1988

    Soldato

    Joined: 8 Jan 2005

    Posts: 6,414

    Location: wiltshire

    if you're willing to have things go wrong and pay for the consequences go for it. I have done it a number of times and never regretted it. I currently have a Saab 9-3 that is remapped from the standard 210bhp 300nm to 275bhp and 420nm. Granted I needed a new, larger front mount intercooler, downpipe, sports cat and uprated clutch but the difference is huge. I also have a turbo charged MX-5 but thats a whole different kettle of fish price and hassle wise!
     
  17. matthab

    Mobster

    Joined: 19 Apr 2009

    Posts: 3,158

    The only thing I was planning later on was the ABT tuning box for the Leon Cupra. This apparently keeps the warranty and takes the car to 370bhp, not sure if it needs anymore :D.
     
  18. LiE

    Capodecina

    Joined: 2 Aug 2005

    Posts: 22,835

    Location: Milton Keynes

    In the unlikely event you blew the engine, Seat would be able to see you had run a piggy back tune.
     
  19. Kenai

    Capodecina

    Joined: 5 Apr 2009

    Posts: 22,056

    I think the Abt tuning box adds a level of confusion because in a lot of mainland European countries, Abt will effectively uphold the warranty instead - I didn't think this applied to the UK though.

    A bit like Mountune used to do with Ford.
     
  20. Nasher

    Capodecina

    Joined: 22 Nov 2006

    Posts: 21,817

    ECUs log quite a lot of info. They would be able tell if they looked hard enough.